Powder for Longer or Shorter Barrels.

[Juice Jaws]

Everybody finds fun in doing different things. What takes the fun out of things is people trying to tell you not to do the things that make it fun for you.

Think about that a bit.

Don't have to think about it, most of the posts here are telling people what they should or shouldn't do, just saying what I think about it, Think about that a bit.

 

[chorizo]

Don't have to think about it, most of the posts here are telling people what they should or shouldn't do, just saying what I think about it, Think about that a bit.

I am sure there are plenty of threads you could go look at and comment on without having to throw a wet blanket on the conversation. I urge you to go populate those with your wisdom.

 

[Juice Jaws]

I am sure there are plenty of threads you could go look at and comment on without having to throw a wet blanket on the conversation. I urge you to go populate those with your wisdom.

Wonder why it bothers you so much for me to post what I think.

 

[chorizo]

Wonder why it bothers you so much for me to post what I think.

Because it is nonproductive, negative and contributes nothing to this thread except to show that you are a jerk.

Think what you want, but saying what ever comes into you mind is a different matter. Again go find a thread where you can make a positive contribution.

 

[nkbj]

Wonder why it bothers you so much for me to post what I think.

Yo Juice.
Each generation has to learn, relearn, rediscover for themselves. They find a nugget of truth, there's that "ah ha!" moment that puts assumptions in their minds as facts to be defended even though they're not done learning... it never changes. Give 'em time.

 

[Juice Jaws]

Because it is nonproductive, negative and contributes nothing to this thread except to show that you are a jerk.

Think what you want, but saying what ever comes into you mind is a different matter. Again go find a thread where you can make a positive contribution.

You are wrong all I said was most people over think this sport, Unless you are a Olympic Shooter most things people worry about doesn't matter. KIS, keep it simple

 

[Juice Jaws]

Yo Juice.
Each generation has to learn, relearn, rediscover for themselves. They find a nugget of truth, there's that "ah ha!" moment that puts assumptions in their minds as facts to be defended even though they're not done learning... it never changes. Give 'em time.

You are right brother, let them learn for themselves , been there myself. thanks.

 

[Bad Karma]

I think we try very hard to make a simple fun sport into something very hard. I shoot flint locks, smoothbore, rifles, and use 3F for everything, spit patch for everything, run my own ball and shoot the smooth ball with the wrinkle balls and manage to bring home game and ribbons. Plus have lots of simple fun.

That’s commendable. Many people do just what you are doing with varying degrees of success or satisfaction. I’ve long known that this board is populated with many people who feel that a flintlock shooting round ball is all that anyone “needs”. I’ve always wondered though, how do these guys know what I “need” let alone want from a muzzleloading firearm? I’m just not as good at reading minds, ask my wife.

 

[Bad Karma]

I had never thought about this, but it sure makes sense.
I have both long and short barrels, but haven't consider the length when loading my horn.

So, the way I understand it:
1. When you want the max push to the ball, it seems you would want the powder to burn completely in the barrel. So, use a faster-burning powder?
2. When you want flame and smoke, you want unburned powder flying out the muzzle and igniting. And use a slower-burning powder?

So, does the grind actually make much of a difference, or is it more a function of the volume of powder used?
What do y'all think?

I don’t know if I would call it max push, maybe efficient use of powder. But yeah that’s the right idea. New Year’s Eve and Independence Day? I’m stuffing a hundred fifty grains of 1.5f into the 58 caliber Musketoon, packing a wad of butcher paper over that, and letting it rip…

 

[RIDE-RED350R]

I think we try very hard to make a simple fun sport into something very hard. I shoot flint locks, smoothbore, rifles, and use 3F for everything, spit patch for everything, run my own ball and shoot the smooth ball with the wrinkle balls and manage to bring home game and ribbons. Plus have lots of simple fun.

I get what you are saying.

But I enjoy the tinkering aspect of this hobby and what can be learned from it. I have a very mechanical mind and like to know how things work, why things work, and maybe discover a better method along the way. This forum is the campfire of the modern age that brings those of us with common interests together to share experiences and ideas. Yeah some of what is discussed here can be largely academic and probably not of much use in the real world for many of us and our level of shooting. But I enjoy the pursuit of knowledge and learned a long time ago that there is plenty I can learn from more experiences hands if I ask in earnest and listen.

 

[BP Addict]

I have often pondered this subject and even started a Thread once.

In order to get a complete burn from a short barrel, would a finer powder be better? Also, what would be defined as a short barrel? 32” or less, 30” or less, 24” to 28” perhaps?

Usually, when I think of a long barrel, it’s greater than 32”. Would a slower burning powder help push the projectile out rather than “pop” it out?

The funny thing is, Ned Roberts talked about the Target Shooters of the day using 1F powder imported from England that left a damp residue. I can’t remember the brand and don’t have time to flip through the pages.

As already mentioned, even the same brand and caliber of gun has its own tastes. Every Spanish 50 caliber rifle I’ve shouldered shot well with 60 grains of 2F for target work. The point of impact was the same for 3F, but the recoil was greater. A newly acquired Made in USA CVA Mountain Rifle likes 55 grains of 3F.

There is that general rule of thumb, and most manufacturers use it in their Instruction Manuals, 3F for under 50 cal and 2F for 50 and over. However, sometimes each gun just likes what it likes.

Great Calculator, BTW!

Walt

 

[dickerr52]

It is the grind. More surface area exposed to oxygen and surface to burn.

Bore size makes a difference also as there is more room for expansion and thus more complete burn.

In short, volume of area to burn, the physical condition of what you are burning.

Faster burn mean quicker and higher pressure peak with resulting increase in velocity

Add heavier bullet weight and the increase of static inertia to overcome results in a smaller space to burn and a resultant increase in pressure and velocity.

@Brazos John Play with this calculator: Look at pressure peak, barrel lengths, grind and volume (caliber) and you will get a feel for what I mean

https://www.p-max.uk/cgi-bin/black_powder.cgi
On powder:

Black powder​

Main article: Gunpowder
Gunpowder (Black powder) is a finely ground, pressed and granulated mechanical pyrotechnic mixture of sulfur, charcoal, and potassium nitrate or sodium nitrate. It can be produced in a range of grain sizes. The size and shape of the grains can increase or decrease the relative surface area, and change the burning rate significantly. The burning rate of black powder is relatively insensitive to pressure, meaning it will burn quickly and predictably even without confinement,[12] making it also suitable for use as a low explosive. It has a very slow decomposition rate, and therefore a very low brisance. It is not, in the strictest sense of the term, an explosive, but a "deflagrant", as it does not detonate but decomposes by deflagration due to its subsonic mechanism of flame-front propagation.

Black powder does not need atmospheric oxygen It relies on the exothermic decomposition of the potassium nitrate to burnt charcoal and sulfur.