Percussion rifle identifcation

Discussion in 'Firearm Identification' started by FLgunner87, May 31, 2019.

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  1. May 31, 2019 #1

    FLgunner87

    FLgunner87

    FLgunner87

    32 Cal

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    Greetings guys,

    I recently came into possession of this percussion rifle. The owner had passed away and I've been tasked with selling the collection. Unfortunately someone decided it would be a good idea to spray paint multiple firearms in this collection including a Remington rolling block, an 1894 Winchester and this percussion rifle. Before I proceed I'd like to make it clear that I know nothing of musket or percussion firearms. It was obvious that this was spray paint, same consistent paint on these firearms and the over spray showed on the wood. There were no visible markings on this rifle and the spray paint was peeling off so I decided to take some lacquer thinner and remove the paint with a paper towel...i Know that is probably sacrilegious. Behind the rear sight there is an X and from what i can tell a stamping with "SUWAR..." and after that it is unlegible. I'm not sure what the stampings really are, certainly could be other letters. Please refer to photos. The hammer and lock have some scrolling work and there seems to be extremely faint letters on the lock. At first i thought this may be a reproduction kit rifle of some sort but after going over the stock I noticed multiple intricate wood repairs where someone spent a great deal of time repairing cracks and other dings. Any information would be extremely appreciate because i'm lost. I'm thinking about keeping it as a wall hanger if it's not a kit rifle.

    Thanks,

    Derek

    Whole drop box folder:

    https://www.dropbox.com/sh/0tkv4k26d...xLNZNcPfa?dl=0

    individual pictures:

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/je7it9xr8i...12725.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/yo1z3psi7k...12710.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/ek19cre11v...12732.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/5qkqy5ziet...12739.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/xpr85876v1...12747.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/j09iktuh9e...12756.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/lbnn1l2mdr...12805.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/5qlrmsucwy...12812.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/1np5sq5dls...12822.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/jlegcyokel...12825.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/uk292estuh...12902.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/ht3z9xk1m7...12809.jpg?dl=0
     
  2. May 31, 2019 #2

    FLgunner87

    FLgunner87

    FLgunner87

    32 Cal

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    Whoops, this was meant to be posted in the Firearm Identification forum, can an admin move this post there? Thanks.
     
  3. May 31, 2019 #3

    bang

    bang

    bang

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    Looks to me like the Hawken Plains Hunter. Main guy Samual Hawken. Believe Colt made some. Several brands make reproductions. I did notice Hawken faintly visible on top of barrel. Search for more markings.
     
    Smokey Plainsman likes this.
  4. May 31, 2019 #4

    bprflmkr

    bprflmkr

    bprflmkr

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    Looks like SH WAR... Could mean warranted. The patch box looks similar to an old hawken. If it’s a replica it’s old. Try a green light. I’ve used green LED flashlights to try and decipher engine plates to get faded out model and serial numbers on old tractors to order parts. Something about stamping on metals, the compression changes how certain types of light reflect off of it. Blue, green, red, and yellow wavelengths all act differently.
     
  5. May 31, 2019 #5

    Smokey Plainsman

    Smokey Plainsman

    Smokey Plainsman

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    Looks very much like a hawkins plains rifle to me.
     
  6. May 31, 2019 #6

    cositrike

    cositrike

    cositrike

    40 Cal.

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    Looks like a put together from parts, to me. May have been done many years ago, but I don’t think the parts are all from 1 gun. Patch box looks like it’s on the wrong way round. A nice wall hanger, but nothing more than that. Just my opinion though, so probably wrong
    Definitely not a ‘Hawkins’ though. I believe the guy meant Hawken, but I’m sure it’s not one of those.
     
  7. May 31, 2019 #7

    Mark Herman

    Mark Herman

    Mark Herman

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    I agree with Cositrike, it's not a Hawken. The cap box is newer than the rifle and is on backwards and the lock appears to have been changed at some time, poorly,. I would also suggest a parts gun. You haven't hurt it any more than whoever put it together.
    Mark
     
  8. May 31, 2019 #8

    ugly old guy

    ugly old guy

    ugly old guy

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    OEM didn't use paint on the metal.
    Not sacrilege to remove the paint.
     
  9. Jun 3, 2019 #9

    FLgunner87

    FLgunner87

    FLgunner87

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    Hope this helps, I removed the lock and took pictures before and after i cleaned it. There are manufacturer numbers on some parts. I have no idea how to remove the barrel from the stock. In the stock where the capbox lays there was pieces of wood that just fell out. I just added the photos to my Dropbox folder, new photos are at the bottom. If someone gives me a clue on how to remove the barrel, i'll do that as well. Thanks.

    https://www.dropbox.com/sh/0tkv4k26d...xLNZNcPfa?dl=0
     
  10. Jun 3, 2019 #10

    Badgerfarm

    Badgerfarm

    Badgerfarm

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    I would check to see if it still has a live load in it before going any farther. Look for metal pins that are driven through the stock from side to side. Take out the ramrod and loosen the screws in the tang and the barrel should lift out. If you still aren't certain find someone to help you with it. Safety first.
     
    TFoley likes this.
  11. Jun 3, 2019 #11

    rich pierce

    rich pierce

    rich pierce

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    A really generic inexpensive late percussion rifle. Knowing who made it and when might be fun though.
     
  12. Jun 3, 2019 #12

    Zonie

    Zonie

    Zonie

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    I might add to Badgerfarm's comment above, the pin that is in line with the ramrod entry thimble should be left alone.

    To remove the barrel pins, a very small nail should work if it is smaller in diameter than the barrel pins. Be sure to remove the point if you use a nail. You want a nice flat surface to rest against the barrel pins so it won't slip off to the side and damage the wood.

    Also, when removing the barrel pins, drive them out only far enough to be able to get a good grasp on the exposed end with a pair of pliers or vise grips. Then, pull them out.

    If you have the lock installed with the lock screw, it's a good idea to remove the screw before trying to pull the barrel out of the stock.
    On many guns, that lock screw (the rear screw if the lock has more than one screw holding it in) will be going thru a hole or slot in the exposed portion of the barrel tang/breech plug. If this is the case, until the screw is removed, the barrel won't come out of the gun.
     
  13. Jun 4, 2019 #13

    FLgunner87

    FLgunner87

    FLgunner87

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    Okay, so I separated the barrel from the stock. The rifle is empty, no worries of a negligent discharge. I have yet to find any markings. There seems to be faint lettering on the underside of the "tang". I am not sure of proper term but the thin long piece of metal with the three screw holes attached to the rear of the barrel. The trigger assembly has no markings on it either. Check out the photos I posted in the same album, again new photos on the bottom.

    https://www.dropbox.com/sh/0tkv4k26dnbcnvu/AACUcNauZKpwsjGRxLNZNcPfa?dl=0
     

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