Patches always torn

[TarponStalker]

Hello everyone.
I know we’ve all read posts about patches and lubes until some are tired of seeing them. But here’s mine.
My .54 flintlock has given me problems since birth. The attached photo shows how they all look after being shot. I’ve tried pillow ticking. Store bought .018 cotton patches and #40 drill. They all look the same. TOW mini oil, spit and Mr Flintlock lube. I’ve used both .530 and .535 round balls.
I’ve tried smoothing the muzzle crown and scotchbrite pads at least 200-300 strokes.
I even considered it being my short starter so I pulled a ball after it was about an inch . inside the bore. Not that either.
I’ve tried 2F and 3F from 50-90 grains
Any more ideas?
By the way, if this helps this rifle fouls more than any I’ve owned. I’m so envious of those saying they can shoot all day without swabbing. I can barely load a second ball unless I run a patch down the barrel. I’ve always figured it was the high humidity here in FL. Or maybe others used way more lube than I do.
Thanks for any ideas.

 

[1950DAVE]

Just a guess but I would say you still have too thick a patch. Have you miked the ticking and drill?
With my GPR .54 I have to use a .530 with ticking. I couldn't get thin enough with a .535 ball.
I think I would try .015 patches.

 

[Grimord]

I have had two guns that shredded the patches just as yours, and I did all the same things you have tried. The solution for both of the guns was to use a felt wad over the powder, then the lubed patched ball. Patches came out practically unscathed, and could be used again if I were to recover them.

 

[Phil Coffins]

What brand of rifle or barrel?

 

[Dwight Rutherford]

I’d mic the barrel, the bore may be larger than .540.

 

[bldtrailer]

try Denin 10 oz tighter, less fauling and more scotch pad(with oil on it) you have a cut rifling barrel sharp lands(bur) shoot it smooth or oooo steel wool w oil
Below same barrel before steel wool and after

 

[Rock Home Isle]

Hello everyone.
I know we’ve all read posts about patches and lubes until some are tired of seeing them. But here’s mine.
My .54 flintlock has given me problems since birth. The attached photo shows how they all look after being shot. I’ve tried pillow ticking. Store bought .018 cotton patches and #40 drill. They all look the same. TOW mini oil, spit and Mr Flintlock lube. I’ve used both .530 and .535 round balls.
I’ve tried smoothing the muzzle crown and scotchbrite pads at least 200-300 strokes.
I even considered it being my short starter so I pulled a ball after it was about an inch . inside the bore. Not that either.
I’ve tried 2F and 3F from 50-90 grains
Any more ideas?
By the way, if this helps this rifle fouls more than any I’ve owned. I’m so envious of those saying they can shoot all day without swabbing. I can barely load a second ball unless I run a patch down the barrel. I’ve always figured it was the high humidity here in FL. Or maybe others used way more lube than I do.
Thanks for any ideas.

I have a Pedersoli Alamo Rifle, that had the same issue; patches torn apart and burned through. Accuracy was horrible…pie plate at 50 yrds from a rest. I took some valve grinding compound, rubbed it into a cleaning patch and scrubbed out the bore.

Patches now look like they can be shot again…gun shoots more accurately than I can hold. It’s taken many elk and was my goto hunting rifle for 8-10 years.

You’ve got burs in the rifling left over from the machining process. Get rid of the burs and the patches will look much better…accuracy should improve.

I used valve grinding compound to remedy my problem, scotch brite pads can be used as well…probably would work even better.

Take a small square of scotch brite on the end of a cleaning jag. Put some gun oil on it and Lapp the barrel about 20 times. If there are burrs, it will be very hard to run the length of the barrel, and after a few strokes, will then really smooth out.

Your next visit to the shooting range will be a completely different experience.

 

[TarponStalker]

What brand of rifle or barrel?

It’s a Rice barrel.

 

[pmccoywss]

I had the same problem and solution as Grimord. Later switched to linen patches and no more problems even without the felt patch.

 

[BruceHH]

Rock Home Isle has given you to right answer. You have machine marks in your lands and grooves. For your rifle (50 cal.), take a .45 caliber jag and Scotch Brite (I use Red colored) square patches that you cut so that they will just barely go in the bore when placed on the jag.. Go up and down that bore at least 500 or more times and change the patch when it gets too loose. If you want it to have a mirror finish, follow that with White colored Scotch Brite patches. I do not oil my patches during the process.

 

[TarponStalker]

I had the same problem and solution as Grimord. Later switched to linen patches and no more problems even without the felt patch.

Do you know what type of linen you used? I bought some a few months ago but it is so thin/loose woven that I didn’t think it would work.

 

[Hatchet-Jack]

I think what Rock Home Isle describes fits the bill here. #40 drill cloth is pretty tough material with a tight weave. For that to be shredding I'd say is a sign of a rough barrel.

I've smoothed some of mine out using maroon scotch brite and various grit compounds.

 

[concho7]

Here is what I have done in the past! Remove flash liner, then remove breach plug, now clean bore use light to examine bore you will probably see teeth in rifling that are tearing the patches, now do as others suggest! Bore will need not less than 1000 strokes if bore is damaged from a dull reamer or rifling cutter. Good Luck

 

[Flintandsteel]

ive NEVER seen a Rice barrel that had a rough bore. Most will shoot from the first shot.
one thing that no one has mentioned is lube. If you’re using paste lube, get rid of it. The tearing and and fowling should end.
liquid lube, (moose milk), .005 under bore size ball, and a .020” patch.
live used at least 20 Rice barrels with this configuration, and have been able to shoot all day without cleaning.
First 7 shots out of a new Rice barrel.

 

[Grimord]

I prefer a greased patch (Mink Oil) in my Rice barrels of which I have two, a .32 and a .36. I use either the #40 cotton pocket drill, or 10 oz denim for patches. I use Mink Oil cause it stays pretty much the same consistency under most weather conditions, and I hunt alot in the winter months here in New England.

 

[olskool]

50/50 dawn dish soap and water, and life is good,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

[TarponStalker]

ive NEVER seen a Rice barrel that had a rough bore. Most will shoot from the first shot.
one thing that no one has mentioned is lube. If you’re using paste lube, get rid of it. The tearing and and fowling should end.
liquid lube, (moose milk), .005 under bore size ball, and a .020” patch.
live used at least 20 Rice barrels with this configuration, and have been able to shoot all day without cleaning.
First 7 shots out of a new Rice barrel.
View attachment 143028

Thanks for the ideas. Not sure if you saw my entire post but I’ve tried all of these. However I am curious if guys that strictly target shoot ( not saying that’s your case”) may use a lot more lube than I do. Since my rifle will stay loaded for days I’m hesitant to really load up my patches with liquid lube as I don’t want to “contaminate” the powder. Therefore I use mink oil or lightly lubed with MR FL. But they are damp. I’ve had the same issues with spit or other liquid lubes.
I just can’t imagine shooting more than 2-3 shots wo swabbing.

 

[TarponStalker]

I think what Rock Home Isle describes fits the bill here. #40 drill cloth is pretty tough material with a tight weave. For that to be shredding I'd say is a sign of a rough barrel.

I've smoothed some of mine out using maroon scotch brite and various grit compounds.

I’ll try the maroon scotchbrite. I’ve been using green. It’s not as abrasive I don’t think

 

[hanshi]

Rice barrels have a reputation of having very smooth bores and I have two, a .50 and a .32. Mine shot fine from the very start, so this does sound very curious indeed. An op wad can probably fix your problem. My thinking, especially if yours is a radius groove barrel, is that you need thicker patching not thinner. TOW mink oil and Hoppes BP Lube are all I use now. Yes, I'm one of those who load & shoot all day with no fouling problems. The patches I use in most of the rifles are cut from unbleached canvas .024" compressed. But I've also had great success with mattress ticking .018". Canvas patches work especially good both in .010"-.012" grooved barrels all the way up to Rice radius groove bores of .016". Denim works well. Use an op wad and a thicker patch together and see it that helps.

 

[TarponStalker]

Rice barrels have a reputation of having very smooth bores and I have two, a .50 and a .32. Mine shot fine from the very start, so this does sound very curious indeed. An op wad can probably fix your problem. My thinking, especially if yours is a radius groove barrel, is that you need thicker patching not thinner. TOW mink oil and Hoppes BP Lube are all I use now. Yes, I'm one of those who load & shoot all day with no fouling problems. The patches I use in most of the rifles are cut from unbleached canvas .024" compressed. But I've also had great success with mattress ticking .018". Canvas patches work especially good both in .010"-.012" grooved barrels all the way up to Rice radius groove bores of .016". Denim works well. Use an op wad and a thicker patch together and see it that helps.

I thought about trying a .526 ball and thicker patch just to see. You’re correct about the op wad. I tried some corn meal over the powder and it did work better. I just hate to add one more step if I don’t have to.
I’m pretty sure it’s a Rice barrel. It came with a popular kit. I hate to sound like I’m bashing the kit producer so I won’t say.
It’s almost as if there’s one bad land since it’s mostly only one cut area.
I need to change something that I haven’t done yet. As I mentioned I can barely load two shots without swabbing with an alcohol patch. I’m not too lazy to do that but can’t help to wonder why mine is different.
That’s part of the fun isn’t it?