Paper cartridges for Brown Bess?

[paulvallandigham]

YOu always have to measure the bores on these guns. No matter what it says on the outside of the barrel, the bore can be either under, or over sized! When they get too oversized, that ball rattles down the barrel!

One of the real lessons to learn from this sight is to pay attention to all the comments describing the choice of Patching to use with a RB when loading, either a rifle or smoothbore. The patch thicknesses vary widely with the the diameter( actual) of the bore, the chosen ball diameter, and whether its rifled or smooth. That should tip everyone off to the necessity to get these combinations correct if you expect any kind of real accuracy.

I always encourage new shooters- and old shooters with a new gun, who may have forgotten--- to buy Dutch Schoultz's system. Go to his website,
http://www.blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/

and send him $15.00 for his work. Its the cheapest and best $15.00 you can spend to learn about accuracy with all BP guns. No, he is not focused on smoothbores, and paper wrappers. However, his discussion on how to go about choosing the correct patch thickness and lube is spot on, and the information can be used in all guns.

If the poster is getting tight groups, he already knows how to makes these guns work. Listen to him. He's obviously doing something you aren't, and whatever that is, it makes the difference, NO?

 

[JOHN F]

jim sorry you had to waste your breath.....i do shoot my bess both with paper and patched ball... guess i am not the sniper that you are...sorry if i got your pressure up ,wont happen again.... :surrender:

 

[JOHN F]

paul,i wasnt trying to be a dick... i know that most of you guys have way more experience than i could ever imagine,,i have been at this for about a year.. i know that i am green.. if you guys took offense to what i said sorry!!!the key part of my sentence was MY accuracy...not trying to kick sand in anyones sandbox.. i enjoy this site but damn, :surrender: .

 

[paulvallandigham]

I don't think anything of the sort! I certainly am neither mad at, nor impatient with you! As you say, you are new to all this, and How is a guy to learn without asking questions? What possible perspective can he bring to shooting any gun unless he is able to work with others, learn to shoot, and load from them, and compare his results to theirs? This is such a small Market of shooters, a National Forum like MLF.com is almost a necessity for shooters to learn from others who may live on the other side of the continent!

Take the time to read everything available on this site. You may have noticed that there are some " permanent" posts on several of the threads about certain issues. There are also a growing collection of articles written by members, along with useful charts, and of course, the Links page, all located under " Member Resources" on the Index page here, to help members find information, parts, powder and ball, etc. It can be very instructive when you first come on this site with a new gun, or a new question, to go back through several pages of postings to see if the issue that concerns you has already been discussed at length.

I have been shooting BP regularly since 1977. I have been on this forum only since 2006. Yet, with all that personal experience, some of the best information I have learned has come from this forum from posts made by other members.

THERE ARE NO STUPID QUESTIONS, HERE. The only "Stupid Question " is the one NOT asked. We have members who seem to be involved in every level, and manner of BP shooting here. Whatever your interest, someone here can save you time and money learning to do it right. We all want you to be safe, and have fun. :hatsoff:

 

[gjkershul]

Getting onto this thread late, here is my non- traditional Bess cartridge protocol.


My load in my Pedersoli Brown Bess for trailwalks, military shoots, and whitetail is 80 gr of 3f. with a .735 Lyman ball ball in a computer print out paper cartridge-yellow pages out of the phone book work well also.
The computer paper mikes at .0035 and two wraps around the mandrel-cartridge stick- bring the paper patched ball to close to the .749 muzzle diameter. I use just a simple rectangle rather than a trapazoid. Before puting the powder in the cartridge I dip the cartridge with the ball in place in hot paraffin (sp) wax to just cover the portion of the cartridge were the ball is.

To load, the cartridge is torn, the powder is poured and the cartridge is reversed and thumb loaded waxed portion first into the barrel. The portion of the cartridge now above thge crown of the barrel is then torn off leaving a waxed-for lubrication- paper patched ball which is then rammed home on top of the powder charge. If permitted by the event, it is advisable to reload with this type cartridge immediately after firing when the barrel is warm from the previous discharge.
This protcol is something like the British drill for Enfield Rifled Musket cartridges.

In reference to .69 balls being used-Neumann in "The History of Weapons of the American Revolution" says at page 14, that balls were .05 to .10 under bore size to faciltate loading with fouled bores.

 

[Captain outwater]

How you make your cartridges depends on what you plan to do with them.
Reenactors use a 1/2 inch dowel, wrap the paper around it, fold the ends, add powder, and fold the open end closed. This works well for blanks.
I don't know how well folding it closed would work with a 1 oz lead ball. The British did use a 69 cal ball in their 75 cal Bess, to allow fast loading. They tied their cartridges closed with thread.
You need a dowel or former- 1/2 inch works for blanks, but you need one the size of your ball for live shooting.
A simple way to make cartridges is to take some copier paper, fold in half, then in half again. Cut along the creases so you now have 4 pieces from each page. Wrap with long edge along the dowel. Pull the dowel back from the edge its width, and fold the seam inside, then the other two sides. Pull the dowel back slightly again and fold the edges again onto the dowel, making a crease like on a shotgun shell. Add components- if ball, that goes first! then measured powder. Flatten the paper end down to the powder. Fold the paper from each side in to the center, fold back over the cartridge, or twist if you want the end sticking out in your cartridge box.

 

[Joel/Calgary]

The British did use a 69 cal ball in their 75 cal Bess, to allow fast loading. They tied their cartridges closed with thread.

IIRC, the British tied both ends closed and clipped the powder-end short, while the French glued the ball-end and left the powder end longer and folded it closed. The U.S. government split the difference, and tied the ball end and folded the powder end. This practice was continued for the later U.S. rifle-musket cartridges.

Regards,
Joel