Need ID/Value Help

[Rebel]

I just purchased this flintlock musket and can't find any info on it. It is a club butt design with a 52" barrel with a .75 bore. Only markings i can find on it are 2 old British proof marks. One is a Crown with the letters BP under it and the other is a Crown with the letters BV under it. In between them is a 12. Overall length of musket is 69" The lock has a very heavy mainspring and it does spark well. I will enclose some pics. Thanks for any help with an ID and possible value

 

[Sam squanch]

Looks like a modern made gun from India to me.

 

[Rebel]

Could be, that is why i asked. I have No idea. But can't find any importers selling club butts or any with a 52" barrel. Thanks

 

[Flint62Smoothie]

My thoughts ...

BARREL - The barrel appears to be real and the proofs appear to date to the Birmingham Proof House ... but of 1904 to 1905? That I don't get, because I could be mistakenly reading 'smokeless powder' proofs, and yet, the chart does go back to 1813.

LOCK - To me, the English would have some name like 'Tower' or other on the lock. And now thart I think of it, I don't think I've ever seen an UNmarked English lock, haha! It looks either French or Belgian to me and the sideplate looks Belgian to me too ... but I'm no expert. But I do see a maker's mark or some mark at the top of the cock right above the top jaw? Can you read that? FWIW I've never seen anything like that on an import lock made in India and it does not look like a lock made there, to me anyways.

Note the Belgian martial arms industry was extremely prolific in making up arms from parts from scores to 100s of years old, even as of 50-60 years ago they were still making flintlocks and selling to tribes in Africa who were banned from owning modern arms!

STOCK - Can't really see enough to judge, but haven't seen a band like that on an Indian import. It could be someone bought a bunch of parts and made their own?

In regards to British arms, the resident expert on here is Dave Person (username of dave_person). So if he doesn't respond here, maybe you could PM him and ask his advice.

 

[Rebel]

Thank you for the info. Any idea as to value as i plan to sell it?

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

It's a gun made for the African trade. They made them as late as the 1930s

 

[Rebel]

The 2 brass bands around the stock were just something made from thin brass shim stock that someone must have added for effect, which i just removed. They did nothing and the stock is one solid piece. Can't tell what the marks on the cock above the top jaw are.

My thoughts ...

BARREL - The barrel appears to be real and the proofs appear to date to the Birmingham Proof House ... but of 1904 to 1905? That I don't get, because I could be mistakenly reading 'smokeless powder' proofs, and yet, the chart does go back to 1813.

LOCK - To me, the English would have some name like 'Tower' or other on the lock. And now thart I think of it, I don't think I've ever seen an UNmarked English lock, haha! It looks either French or Belgian to me and the sideplate looks Belgian to me too ... but I'm no expert. But I do see a maker's mark or some mark at the top of the cock right above the top jaw? Can you read that? FWIW I've never seen anything like that on an import lock made in India and it does not look like a lock made there, to me anyways.

Note the Belgian martial arms industry was extremely prolific in making up arms from parts from scores to 100s of years old, even as of 50-60 years ago they were still making flintlocks and selling to tribes in Africa who were banned from owning modern arms!

STOCK - Can't really see enough to judge, but haven't seen a band like that on an Indian import. It could be someone bought a bunch of parts and made their own?

In regards to British arms, the resident expert on here is Dave Person (username of dave_person). So if he doesn't respond here, maybe you could PM him and ask his advice.

View attachment 254597

 

[rickystl]

Much agree with Post #8 above. And as Flint mentions above:

"Note the Belgian martial arms industry was extremely prolific in making up arms from parts from scores to 100s of years old, even as of 50-60 years ago they were still making flintlocks and selling to tribes in Africa who were banned from owning modern arms!"

The lock looks very much like the Belgium locks used on these guns at the turn of the 20th Century.

The gun, with it's long barrel could probably still fetch 400-500 today. Stuff is lately selling for more than I would have guessed just 3-4 years ago.

Rick

 

[Rebel]

Thank ya kindly for the input. I took the lock all apart just a bit ago and smoothed up the inside of the lock plate and all the bearing surfaces. Also took a bit off the sides of the springs. Is a lot better than it was. Not a great trigger pull but one finger doable now. and it is a real good sparker.