need accurate 18th C. belt knife sheath pattern

[onefeather]

very nice i might do that :front:

 

Check out antique dealer sites that carry native american aritfacts. 19th century plains and southwestern indian made knife sheaths show up from time to time. I doubt if there is much of a difference between eighteenth and nineteenth century sheaths. The shape of a sheath veries mainly with the shape of the knife.

 

[Damascus]

This is my simple brass-tack sheath (and the knife that lives in it)

A butcher knife, or boucheron, would have had something smaller but Im sure that it would still be possible to go with tacks.

as I understand it, tacks were more of a western thing though.

Ah well.

:m2c:

Damascus

 

[bnail]

That's a fine looking sheath Damascus. I thought about that style, but I wanted to try a simple, slip-it-in-the belt style scabbard/sheath.
I finally got the leather together and stitched up for my sheath, but to my dismay, it looks like a flippin' filet knife sheath!
I'll get a pic posted after I tighten up some of the rough edges.

 

[onefeather]

hey skagun in mark bakers book a pilgrims journey there are alot but the one i styled one after kinda was danid wrights sheath simple but effective :front:

 

[robertl]

This was my idea for a sheath. I have also seen this same pattern with the loop left open on the bottom and positioned on the front of the sheath. That way it could slipped behind the sash with the hook going over the top front of the sash.

 

[bnail]

in mark bakers book a pilgrims journey there are alot but the one i styled one after kinda was danid wrights sheath simple but effective

I didn't think of that source. I just slapped a couple of pieces of leather together; Here's what I came up with:

The lighting is rough, but you can at least see what I came up with.
BTW, that knife was smithed from an old file. I found it in a rummage sale mixed in with a bunch of old kitchen knives.:front:

 

[robertl]

Some Rev. War sheaths for reference.

 

[onefeather]

that looks fine skagun i actually like it :front:

 

[bnail]

Thanks One Feather:
Here's a clearer shot of it. I brought the sheath to school with me and laid it on the scanner! :thumbsup:

 

[onefeather]

still nice thats how im gonna make my next one i just want to make something plain and simple that wont cause a fuss so this week when i get my moose hide im gonna make me one along with a shoe pack anf a possibles bag and anything else i want to make lol sheathj looks good :front:

 

[Stophel]

The bottom two sheaths from the "collector's illustrated..." are in line with what FEW 18th century knife sheaths I have seen. The top two, I don't know about. The second one (the English knife) I would hesitate to place in the 18th century...especially without seeing the blade.

ALL of the 18th century European knife sheaths I have seen were like the bottom two. The leather is folded around both sides of the knife and stitched up the back. IF there is a belt loop, it is attached in some kind of frog arrangement, or a loop is attached with a metal ring. These are not too hard to make, BUT, I have confirmed my suspicions that they don't work too well for the drop-edge type knives that most all of us carry. The edge slices the sheath every time it goes in or out. A wooden or metal insert would work, but would make the sheath really bulky.

My next sheath will be of the ordinary "single fold" variety, but I am going to put a metal ring on the back and attach a belt loop to it so that the knife sort-of dangles from the belt.

 

[bnail]

{quote}My next sheath will be of the ordinary "single fold" variety, but I am going to put a metal ring on the back and attach a belt loop to it so that the knife sort-of dangles from the belt.[/quote]
I'd rather have the "single fold" styled sheath myself; It wouldn't take much for my scabbard to resemble a Ka-Bar sheath, but all I had access to was strap leather. In all, I'm happy with the outcome, but I still wished I had an original from which to copy. :thumbsup:

 

[David S Kendall]

Probably not all that 18th century but here is one I made awhile back.

 

[David S Kendall]

Oops should proly show this too.

 

[Artificer]

Any folks out there know of/seen an authentic 18tyh century knife sheath? I have a butcher knife I need to cover, but I haven't a clue what kind of sheath to make. I toyed with the idea of a "kabar" style sheat, as they sit well on the belt, but I want one that rides more toward the front. I've heard that the earlier sheaths slipped into the belt and tied in place, but I haven't seen any documentation at all concerning sheathing.

Hi bnail,

The center seam knife sheath is without a doubt the most authentic sheath to make for a European Settler's trade knife of all sorts. Fortunately it is not that difficult to make.

Scroll down in this thread for the pics LRB posted of original sheaths for Cartouche Trade knives. The third pic shows the backs of two of the sheaths on the left. Cartouche Knives cost more than period butcher knives, so their sheaths were a bit simpler in design, but still constructed in a similar way.
https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/knife-sheath.116277/page-2#post-1602830
The following link shows center seam sheaths LRB makes for both French and English Trade Knives. The cross lines and dots were well known for being used on 18th century sheath decoration.
http://www.wickellerbe.com/gallery/index.php?action=view&gll=5
Now, NONE of us are going to make a center seam sheath as finely made as was made in the period or by today's better makers, especially the first time you make one. So don't be disheartened that your first sheath won't look quite as nice. I'm sure replacement sheaths made by frontiersmen looked a lot cruder than the ones above.

The following "How To" Video is not bad at all and gives you a good idea how to make a basic center seam sheath, though with some variance.


Gus

 

[Jaeger]

I have photos of a knife and sheath dated to from the early to mid 18th century. It is also illustrated as a line drawing in the "Roger's Rangers Sketchbook". It has an ivory handle carved with figures from the garden of Eden, it has a sheepsfoot style blade. The sheath is embossed leather with a center seam and includes a leather cap to slip over the top of the handle and upper part of the sheath.
To see nearly identical knives go to www.lanouvelle-france.com click on "More French Trade Knives" scroll to "Flemish Type Knives". It includes a couple of early sheaths.

Regards, Dave

DON'T click on that website! Not a secure site....goodness knows what kind of virus your computer will pick up there!

 

[tippit]

Bill Wright made this raw hide sheath for my knife...tippit

 

[Dale Lilly]

Yeah Fat dutchman, I'm afraid that's the way it is. I can't is even find a description of a sheath.

Here' my post about Miller's paintings of knives at the 1837 rendezvous: [Miller shows primarily 'fold over' sheaths. Some have a belt slot, most do not. They are either just put inside a belt or tied to the belt in some fashion. Most are riveted or tacked, not stitched. From his 1837 rendezvous paintings referenced and illustrated by Rex Allen Norman in his '1837 Sketchbook of the Western Fur Trade'.] Polecat

 

[Stophel]

Wow, this thread is from the 18th century....

And my answer wasn't very good!