Lock Patterns

[Titus]

Does anyone know where I can find patterns and blue prints for building a percussion lock or flintlock lock from scratch? Ive got access to the tooling, but no blue prints of the physical locks...

Thanks

 

[rich pierce]

I believe Track of the Wolf still carries a booklet or two by Pryor Mountain Bill that has some patterns for locks and shows how he used to forge them. They were cheap booklets but very helpful.

 

[Tumblernotch]

I have an old copy of that book. It does have a pretty good bit of info for the home blacksmith/gunsmith. He also put in some drawings for triggers too.

 

[rich pierce]

I have an old copy of that book. It does have a pretty good bit of info for the home blacksmith/gunsmith. He also put in some drawings for triggers too.

You must have been in this a while, my friend.

 

[chichi]

I am interested locks and in the Pryor Mountain pamphlet.I want to forge the parts. I just ordered some other lock related material from Track of the Wolf and did not see any listing. Is there another source? I would be happy to pay for a used copy or xerox.
Thanks,
Bob

 

[dwarvenchef]

Interested in building locks as well

 

[Tumblernotch]

For a while. Since '73 when I was a snot nosed teenager. :grin:

 

[Titus]

I believe Track of the Wolf still carries a booklet or two by Pryor Mountain Bill that has some patterns for locks and shows how he used to forge them. They were cheap booklets but very helpful.

Had a look and I cant find anything in Track. Any other possible sources?

 

[Titus]

I have an old copy of that book. It does have a pretty good bit of info for the home blacksmith/gunsmith. He also put in some drawings for triggers too.

Can you maybe help with a title for the book? I find other books by him but nothing on lock patterns. :surrender: :idunno:

 

[Tourblanche]

I hope I will not sound snobbish or something , but
blueprint for making gun locks the traditionnal way is
just useless .

Blue prints were first used around XIX th cent . with
the invention of the concept of precision machining and
replaceable parts . A visit to the Windsor Vt ,

museumhttp://www.americanprecision.org/

would convince you of it .

Before mid 1800 , gun locks were first forged and hand
fitted . No part from one lock could be used in another
lock .

What you need is a set of patterns , those are easy to make
from pictures and photographs , set to the proper scale with
modern reprography .

Access to a good forge is not as easy .

When the forged blanks are done , you are at the same
level as those craftmen who took the parts home for
hand fitting , be it in Birmingham , Tulle , Liège , Oberndorf etc.

The rough cast parts from Rifle shoppe look very much
like forged blanks .

If you do have acces to a blacksmith shop , this book
has a chapter about forging lock parts
http://www.amazon.com/Art-Blacksmithing-Alex-W-Bealer/dp/0785803955/ref=pd_sim_b_2

All XVIII th cent locks have the same 6 parts in them
( Plate , cock , pan ,frizzen , nut and trigger )

To make the 3 springs , follow the instructions of Kit Ravenshear
http://kitravenshear.com/sitebuilder/images/Simplified_V-Springs2-271x360.png

 

[Titus]

Tourblanche, thanks for the very informative answer. :thumbsup: Patterns / exploded drawings are exactly what I am looking for. I have to admit that I expressed myself incorrectly with the word "blue prints". :surrender: I realise there is a difference.

I did find these which I think will help me in my quest. I want to start with the "easier" :surrender: concept of fabricating a percussion lock or two before I get to the more intricate cock of the "rocklock" :hmm: I believe if I get the internals of this right I will be able to take it one step further..

:hmm:

 

[LaBonte]

Before mid 1800, gun locks were first forged and hand fitted. No part from one lock could be used in another lock .

Not quite true - "interchangeable" parts were being used as early as at least the Lewis and Clark expedition - granted they needed some fitting, but then even today that's generally true of even so-called precision replacement parts.

As for blueprints - a simple form was being done at least early as the the late 1700's - here's a bad copy of a section of the original Nock Patent breech patent office drawings - this is just one example of such period drawings - look through the patent offices of England and the USA for more examples:

As for precision measuring, nope no micrometers, etc, but one can do some quite precise measuring from drawings or a pattern part using outside calipers, dividers, and a good ruler.

but blueprint for making gun locks the traditionnal way is just useless .

Perhaps using such drawings is not period correct but they are far from uselsss - that's based on having built a couple of locks from blueprints using nothing but traditonal methods (forge, anvil, files, stones, and a pole lathe) along with dividers, outside calipers, and a ruler.
One thing I didnt use that was used by at least the last quarter of the 1700's were forging dies for the various parts - such dies were used "in period" to produce repeatable parts.

 

[Tumblernotch]

The one I have is titled, "Handforging the Muzzleloading Gun Lock" by Pryor M. "Bill" Newton of Deaver, Wyoming. It was published in 1978.

It is only 38 pages long, but full of drawings and with some tips for the home blacksmith who doesn't have a lot of specialized tools. Mine also has an insert of 8 pages showing exploded drawings of all sorts of locks as well as 2 types of set triggers and an underhammer action. It's a neat little book.

 

[dptywrdn]

I recently purchased "How to build your own percussion rifle or pistol" by George Lauber from Amazon a few weeks back. It was used as it is now out of print. With that said, the book has full size drawings and measurements for a percussion lock. The drawings have precise measurements and appear to be drawn from a machinist point of view. Additionally, the book contains detailed drawings of the breech plug, trigger guard, thimbles, etc. If you are interested in the book or some of the drawings let me know.

 

[Titus]

I recently purchased "How to build your own percussion rifle or pistol" by George Lauber from Amazon a few weeks back. It was used as it is now out of print. With that said, the book has full size drawings and measurements for a percussion lock. The drawings have precise measurements and appear to be drawn from a machinist point of view. Additionally, the book contains detailed drawings of the breech plug, trigger guard, thimbles, etc. If you are interested in the book or some of the drawings let me know.

:shocked2: :shocked2: :shocked2:

dptywrdn, thats exactly (and idealy) the kind of thing I am looking for.

 

[dptywrdn]

Titus,

Let me know what pictures you’d like and I’ll scan them and send via email. Also, if you’d rather, I would be willing to sell the whole book for what I paid for it plus shipping. Let me know either way.

 

[Titus]

if you can help me out with a pattern for a Plains type percussion lock ie: Hawken, Dimick, Lehman and maybe a flint pattern the likes of something which was used by the Christian Spring gunsmiths ie: Dickert, Haines etc I would really appreciate it. :bow: :bow: :bow:

 

[NAULTRICK1]

The one I have is titled, "Handforging the Muzzleloading Gun Lock" by Pryor M. "Bill" Newton of Deaver, Wyoming. It was published in 1978.

It is only 38 pages long, but full of drawings and with some tips for the home blacksmith who doesn't have a lot of specialized tools. Mine also has an insert of 8 pages showing exploded drawings of all sorts of locks as well as 2 types of set triggers and an underhammer action. It's a neat little book.

I too am interested in making my own locks, made an exact copy of a Siler percussion for my 58 SM,could you tell me where I could find Bill Newtons book or if there is some way I could copy yours, it would be greatly appreciated and would save me a heck of a lot of filing and fitting-would still have to do some but no where near as much :bow: Thanks in advance either way Nault PM me if you like

 

[DAWomer]

There are a few very good sources for gunlocks and 18th century rifle building in general. The first one is a series of 5 volumes that was done under the Journal of Historical Armsmaking Technology. They are no longer in print. I recently got the 4th vol. from the NMLRA website for 2 bucks. It was the only vol. they had available. It was not the best of the 5 so focus on getting the other four if you can.One of the volumes goes into detail on locks. I now have all five. you might check ebay or out of print shops. There is a nice section on the geometry of locks as well as good pictures of the various stages of the forging/finishing process.
Also, visit George Shumway publishers and pick up the various books on Gunsmiths of Colonial America. There are two volumes and they run about $75.00 a piece, but they are great for looking at and reading about original rifles.
Finally, the old VHS tape from Colonial Williamsburg on the gunsmith is an entertaining and fact filled video on the process of making the whole gun from scratch.
Good luck!
Dave

 

[flintriflesmith]

The Gunsmith of Williamsburg movie from 1969 is now available on DVD for $19.95 direct from Colonial Williamsburg bookstore catalog web site.

Gunsmith movie