Heavy Tulles

[bud in pa]

Anyone have any ideas why Tulles made today are heavier then the originals? The book French Trade Gun in North America seems to indicate that they were usually under six pounds. Can anyone reccomend where to get the parts to assemble a light weight Tulle. Thanks Bud

 

[rich pierce]

It's hard to get a kit that's right. Better off getting a custom barrel. BTW, most folks prefer referring to the guns by something other than the town where they were made. For example, do you mean a 1740's plain French trade gun?

 

[alex efremenko]

Other than TRS, there are no kits parts sets that are correct.And very few builders get it correct either,regardless of thier skill level.Most if not all barrels are incorrect profile/too heavy/too short/wedding bands are in correct.most hardware today is cast,not forged.Forged originals are quite thin. All these things help to shave weight off a finished product.
I have had a reproduction barrel made off an original St E. FDC barrel i have.Its at Dave Keck's now being inletted to a piece of Euro Walnut.as far as I know,its the only repro taken off an original.Although the barrel maker made on for himself also.And it is not the lightest of barrels either. I could keep going on.........

 

[JOHN F]

alex, is the r e davis kit somewhat close ??

 

[alex efremenko]

Its close,but not perfect.The lock not being the most perfect.I altered one a lot to make it more passable.The thumbpiece is not really correct for it also.that being said,I'm using one for this years reenacting season.Or at least till i sell it.

 

[Mike Brooks]

alex, is the r e davis kit somewhat close ??

Barrel is too heavy. I never did like the lock either. I Have an original 1730's french trade gun barrel theat is 47" long and weighs a bit over 3 lbs.

 

[Jim Blair]

What is the barrel wall thickness compared to a current manufacture barrel of the same bore?Is there a manufacturing problem involved in producing a barrel such as that with current machinery?

 

[tg]

You can get down to about 7 lb with a 44" TOW FDC in a .66 Colerain barrel, TOW has a new "Tulle" lock on their web page which is a bit longer than the davis lock and engraved with the TVLLE name, No one makes a really good one of these in a kit.

 

[alex efremenko]

The Rifle Shoppe does,thier St. Etienne FDC is identical to one in the Parks Cananda collection.

TOW's new lock is quite an improvement over what is currently available.Except it is a one screw lock. but 19 out of 20 eople probably would not notice. [I have one on order]Its going to be mated to my repro FDC barrel and aa piece of euro. walnut.
And the Davis Barrel is a lot heavier than need be.
Hey Mike, Does your fusil have a flat like the Davis barrel,or more of a "rib/sighting plane" going to the front sight?

 

[Keb]

I don't know about french guns but I've an American walnut fowler with a 44" Colerain 20 gauge & M&G Ferguson lock with all iron fittings I got down to 7 lbs. It'll go under 7 lbs. if I don't use the Osage ram rod. :/

 

[Mike Brooks]

The Rifle Shoppe does,thier St. Etienne FDC is identical to one in the Parks Cananda collection.

TOW's new lock is quite an improvement over what is currently available.Except it is a one screw lock. but 19 out of 20 eople probably would not notice. [I have one on order]Its going to be mated to my repro FDC barrel and aa piece of euro. walnut.
And the Davis Barrel is a lot heavier than need be.
Hey Mike, Does your fusil have a flat like the Davis barrel,or more of a "rib/sighting plane" going to the front sight?

Mine has a sighting flat down the length of the barrel, pretty common on french guns. Crooked as a dogs hind leg too, been alot of "adjustments" over the past couple centuries. :haha:

The problem with MOST repro barrels is the tapers are all wrong. Old barrels tapered RAPIDLY at the breech then had another taper that wasn't so dramatic then stayed skinny all the way down to the muzzle. Many barrel makers today skip the rapid taper at the breech and use a mild taper for the full length causing a fence post like barrel.

 

[alex efremenko]

Thanks Mike.
My peeve about the modern barrels is the transition from octagon to round. This new guy I have doing barrels seems to have a grasp on it though.

 

[Mike Brooks]

Thanks Mike.
My peeve about the modern barrels is the transition from octagon to round. This new guy I have doing barrels seems to have a grasp on it though.

Some barrel makers are real bad with wedding bands. With those guys I just file them in myself.

 

[alex efremenko]

So I'm not the only one that does that.

 

[Capt. Jas.]

So I'm not the only one that does that.

I actually prefer it because unless its a Spanish or Spanish type barrel, the stuff I want should not go all the around anyway.

 

[tg]

"The Rifle Shoppe does,thier St. Etienne FDC is identical to one in the Parks Cananda collection."

Gottchya Alex, I saw you had mentioned them as having one I just did not repeat it in my post,what on earth would they g to a single lock bolt? is tha a totaly new lock or an existing plate "lock modle" that was modified like the did with the C/D locks? as to the "American" fowlers how early were they and be identifyable from Euro fowlers?

As to the barrel profiles on the original early French guns do the Flats go all the way around or just "As needed"?

 

[alex efremenko]

usually just as needed. If it was not seen,it was not done. I poseted pics a while back of an original FDC barrel,both top and bottom views.

 

[Mike Brooks]

"The Rifle Shoppe does,thier St. Etienne FDC is identical to one in the Parks Cananda collection."

Gottchya Alex, I saw you had mentioned them as having one I just did not repeat it in my post,what on earth would they g to a single lock bolt? is tha a totaly new lock or an existing plate "lock modle" that was modified like the did with the C/D locks? as to the "American" fowlers how early were they and be identifyable from Euro fowlers?

As to the barrel profiles on the original early French guns do the Flats go all the way around or just "As needed"?

My original Fusil de Trait barrel has all the flats on top and a bottom flat. The two oblique bottom "flats" are round. I have seen cheap english guns done this way as well.
I always enjoy my own hand filed wedding bands...they're as crooked as the originals were! :haha:

 

[bnail]

"The Rifle Shoppe does,thier St. Etienne FDC is identical to one in the Parks Cananda collection."

Gottchya Alex, I saw you had mentioned them as having one I just did not repeat it in my post,what on earth would they g to a single lock bolt? is tha a totaly new lock or an existing plate "lock modle" that was modified like the did with the C/D locks? as to the "American" fowlers how early were they and be identifyable from Euro fowlers?

As to the barrel profiles on the original early French guns do the Flats go all the way around or just "As needed"?

My original Fusil de Trait barrel has all the flats on top and a bottom flat. The two oblique bottom "flats" are round. I have seen cheap english guns done this way as well.
I always enjoy my own hand filed wedding bands...they're as crooked as the originals were! :haha:

Mike:
what kind of markings are on that barrel?
do you know what kind of gun that came off of?

 

[Mike Brooks]

"The Rifle Shoppe does,thier St. Etienne FDC is identical to one in the Parks Cananda collection."

Gottchya Alex, I saw you had mentioned them as having one I just did not repeat it in my post,what on earth would they g to a single lock bolt? is tha a totaly new lock or an existing plate "lock modle" that was modified like the did with the C/D locks? as to the "American" fowlers how early were they and be identifyable from Euro fowlers?

As to the barrel profiles on the original early French guns do the Flats go all the way around or just "As needed"?

My original Fusil de Trait barrel has all the flats on top and a bottom flat. The two oblique bottom "flats" are round. I have seen cheap english guns done this way as well.
I always enjoy my own hand filed wedding bands...they're as crooked as the originals were! :haha:

Mike:
what kind of markings are on that barrel?
do you know what kind of gun that came off of?

No markings at all. In it's present state it's a New England gun stocked in cherry with a back action percusion lock. It has the same stock archetecture as a ca. 1745 french gun....they must have traced the old gun over the new stock blank. :idunno: It has the original French barrel and breech plug, hand forged buttplate and trigger guard, and the original trigger and trigger plate. I must admit it's ugly as sin..... :haha: The barrel is oct/fadiing to round with a sighting plane down the length of the barrel. I believe it was collected in or around New Hampshire.
It's basically a restocked fusil detait stocked in new england probably 1840-70 using all the old french parts except the lock and stock.