channel cut across breech face...

[Keith High]

New to the forum. Certain this has been discussed, but it's new to my experience. I recently acquired a rifle from a well known maker, and upon examination, I discovered that the touch hole liner hole cut a channel 3/4 of the way across the breech face. I've owned and shot flintlocks for a decade, but have never seen this. Can't judge the depth of the channel...the liner is so tight it won't budge. Concerned that the rifle will have ignition and cleaning issues........

 

[Zonie]

It's unlikely to have ignition problems but whether it has a cleaning problem or not depends on how you clean it.

If you use the bucket of water and plunger method where you pump the patched cleaning jag up and down forcing water in and out of the touch hole, the undercut breechplug face will clean up nicely.

If you just use a wet patch on your jag it might miss some fouling in the undercut.

Perhaps a bigger problem is the face of the breech plug is supposed to seal the rear of the bore. If it is tight against the shoulder where the bore ends, little if any water will get into the breech plug threads.

With the undercut breech face this seal won't exist so cleaning water can get into the breech plug threads.

Using a water displacement like WD40 can drive the water out of that area or, heating the breech of the barrel to above the boiling point of water can be used to get the water out of that area.

A good dose of a rust preventing oil following cleaning will protect the breech plug threads.

 

[Curtis Makamson]

I have the identical problem in a gun made by a well-known Italian manufacturer. There are no problems shooting. That groove does lead to an extra step in cleaning. Wire slightly smaller in diameter than the touch hole will remove the crud from the groove. It is an aggravation.

 

[Stophel]

It's not a "problem". No doubt it was done on purpose. It helps get the touch hole further back, and helps to center the prime flash at the rear of the charge.

And like Zonie said, you swoosh it clean. Black powder barrels are "washed", they don't have to be "scrubbed". Water (yes, just plain ol' water) squished through the touch hole will blast it all clean.

 

[Flintfan69]

It's not a problem. There are countless original guns, made by the best gunmakers the world has ever seen, that treated the face of a simple breech plug this way. Take a little extra care in cleaning, and it will never be a problem.

 

[Keith High]

The rifle in question is my 7th flintlock, the fourth from the same maker, but the only one with this characteristic...

 

[Curtis Makamson]

I have looked at five other guns of this same model from that same maker and none of them had that groove. It has no effect on the functioning of the gun but it is rather perplexing. Hey, it works. It shoots better than these bifocaled eyes looking through a sea of cataracts are capable of doing.

 

[M. De Land]

I'd sure like to get my bore scope in some of these barrels that are made perfectly clean with slooshing water around in them only! My experience shows baked on fouling cake takes more than multiple sluicings with water to get it out, especially if it has burned on petroleum in it from barrel oilings not removed before loading and firing.
The reason is now your dealing with carbon fouling not just black powder residue.
This can be tough as barrel leading to get out and needs brake or carburetor cleaner to cut it, you can sluice till dooms with water and never touch it.
Just finished cleaning a ROA and two single shot pistols used in our annual 1000 point match today and the Ruger had caked on fouling that had been both in hot soapy water and warm rinse water. The cylinder face required a bronze brush to remove the baked on cake for a tooth brush, warm water and soap were not enough, even after soaking.
The grease from the base pin is blown out and mixes with the powder fouling creating carbon fouling.
I suspect many muzzle loaders are not nearly as clean on the breech face and corners as some folks think they are. The good news is that carbon fouling does not cause pitting as far as I know at this time but it does build up and can strip lead from a greased bullet. I don't know if it can build up enough to tear patches. Mike D.

 

[Rifleman1776]

baked on fouling cake takes more than multiple sluicings with water to get it out,

A barrel cannot be cleaned with the plunge/flush method unless it is removed from the stock. This is not usually done unless the gun has a patented breech. (e.g. TC style).
It is my practice to plug the touch hole with a round toothpick and pour a couple ounces of hydrogen peroxide down the barrel. I let it set about two minutes then slosh back and forth a couple time and then finish cleaning conventionally. My theory is the H2O2 gets into cracks and crevices, softens and removes the carbon fouling that is then removed with soapy water cleaning.

 

[gunnar26]

"baked on fouling cake takes more than multiple sluicings with water to get it out",

"A barrel cannot be cleaned with the plunge/flush method unless it is removed from the stock"

#1 Yes, a patched jag is a good Idea to follow up with using whatever cleaner turns yer crank.

#2 Not so. All my cleaning starts with a flush clamp. I have never removed the barrel to do this nor have I ever had a drop of water leak by. There is plenty of flat to grip to. Care in placement so as to not Gouge stock-absolutely! Tooth pick never worked for me. Blew out too many and streaked my finish.

 

[pargent]

In Hamilton's Colonial Frontier Guns there is a reproduction of Diderot's Encyclopedia which shows a cut across the breech face , this must have been relatively common .

 

[Stophel]

It was very common. :thumbsup:

 

[Bruce Bogart]

It was very common. :thumbsup:

Still is.

 

[pargent]

Cheers

 

[Rifleman1776]

Yep. I forgot about those clamp on flush tube thingys. Never used but I think I'll look into getting one.