bullet question

[tna]

are maxi-balls and conicals the same thing? i've also come across ball-ets. these any good in a mid twist barrell (1 in 48)?
i don't get any consistancy with a hunting load using prb. at 60grns it's right on the money but it gets worse as i bump up the load so i don't use them for hunting. i use what i would call conicals w/ 100grns and its right on the money. but damn theyre getting expensive. can get twice as many ball-ets for the same price.

 

Be'n a roundball shooter, 'bout tha "only thing" I know 'bout maxi-balls and conicals is,.... they ain't tha same!!

YMHS
rollingb

 

[Ohio Joe]

I too only shoot the roundball... You'll find that a 60 grain charge is about common for good accuracy in a 1 in 48 twist barrel, using a roundball.

My T/C Hawken will shoot benched 3/4 inch groups at 50 yards using a .530 RB with 63 grains of 2fg Goex... The barrel twist is of course 1 in 48... I have no problem with taking deer size game with this load.

Now some will say that 1 in 48 is a good twist. Well, it's not :imo:, at least not in the larger bores .50 caliber and up... It does not handle the heavy charges with a roundball very well at all. Heavy charges and conicals??? I don't know???

 

[tna]

the reason i'm using conicals is that i didn't think that 60grns would be enough for whitetail. well i know that shot placement matters just as much but id rather not wound anything. my 1st bp deer was take with that load and it didn't go far. but that was a double lung hit and i might not be as lucky next time. i would rather use prb's. if i could keep them under control.

 

[cayugad]

A T/C maxiball is a conical bullet. Just like a 460 grain No Excuses Conical is a conical bullet. A R.E.A.L. conical is a true conical. Just a different style and different weight. There are a lot of different makes of conicals out there that you would have to try, but if the maxiballs shoot well then you have it made. A concial bullet to me is a true caliber projectile being, .50, .54 or what ever. Check out Black Jack Hill's for some cheap maxiballs. His prices include shipping.

As for the ball-et, I shoot them out of my Hawkins with 70 grains of Goex 3f and the accuracy is excellent. I shoot the 245 grain Buffalo Ball-ets.

 

[tna]

ok what about miniballs? just keep hammering away and maybe after a few swift blows to the head i'll figure it out.

i'll give the bal-lets a try. thanks.

 

[tna]

do you patch the bal-lets?

 

[musketman]

do you patch the bal-lets?

NO, the checkered side acts as a lead patch...

 

[brushbuster]

one of my gunsmith freind showed me a box of conicals made by hornady designed for barrels in 1:66 twist ,has any body tried them ?i've been using hornady products for years and usually had good results

 

[Ohio Joe]

the reason i'm using conicals is that i didn't think that 60grns would be enough for whitetail. i would rather use prb's. if i could keep them under control.

Whitetail aren't armor plated. 60 + grains of 2f or 3f Black Powder (Goex) is more then enough to turn Whitetail into table fare at 100 yards.

.445 RB - 60g 3fg = 1819 fps, 975 ft./lb ME, 291 ft./lb @ 100 yards... 32 inch Brl...

.495 RB - 60g 3fg + 1554 fps, 964 ft./lb ME, 356 ft./lb @ 100 yards... 32 inch Brl...

.535 RB - 60g 3fg = 1359 fps, 901 ft./lb ME, 404 ft./lb @ 100 yards... 34 inch Brl...

:imo: The conical has not yet been invented that will out perform a good old patched roundball at 100 yards, or less.

Shot placement is everything no matter what your using. Miss a good kill shot with a round ball and you have put a smaller hole into the wounded Whitetail. Miss a good kill shot with a conical and all you've achieved is a larger hole in the wounded Whitetail...

Make kill shots! Don't rely on a more massive hunk of lead to take up the slack of a poorly placed shot. It doesn't work that way, though in some cases it might once in awhile?

This is just my opinion. I'm sure other's will disagree, but that's their privilege... Good luck with your hunting! :thumbsup:

 

[Slamfire]

My CVA .50 with 48" twist likes round balls with 50 grains of Pyro RS, or Buffalo's 245 grain ballets with 75, grains of the same. It don't like anything heavier though. :results:

 

[tna]

Make kill shots! Don't rely on a more massive hunk of lead to take up the slack of a poorly placed shot.

ohio joe,
it's not that i'm relying on a bigger piece of lead. i'm trying to use a more accurate load so my shots go exactly where i want them to, which is the kill shot. on another post i was told that 6ogrns ffg would be marginal at best for whitetail at 100yrds. i probably wouldn't take a 100 yrd shot but that's what i want. i'm relying on a diffrent load for more accuracy. if i use a hotter load (which i have been led to believe is necessary) w/ a prb i lose accuracy making a wounding shot more likely. this is unacceptable to me. so for now untill i try some of the advice i've gotten here i'm going to use the most effective load i can. make no mistake. i have never and will never shoot to wound. that is why i took the advice and worked up a hotter load that retained accuracy.

i hope i didnt give the impression that i would take anything less than a kill shot. nothing could be further from the truth. this is why i'm asking for advice. to lessen the chance of a wounding shot.

now i don't know what to think about the 60grn load though. everyone from the last post said this isn't enough.
.

 

[tg]

I have found 60 gr 3f to be quite enough in a .50 with rb, I think one should set a limit of 75 yds with any ML and open sights, but that is just my consevative nature comming out.....set up a lifesized deer cutout at 100 yds with no bull or reference point to aim at and see how close your group is offhand and where the group is, then decide if 100 yds is a good max range. I don't know where this 100 yd thing comes from maybe to much football???

 

Hawkin50, I am as traditional a shooter as ever walked with flintlock in hand. I also own several artifacts that are conical and egg shaped and were intended to shoot from origional rifles.

You shoot what you need to in order to hit where you intend with enough force to confidently insure a humane kill.

Traditional projectile or not, our sport does not need wounded deer roaming and dying without being claimed. I agree that 60 grains is borderline power. I use 50gn for small game and two measures full as a full charge.

Your logic is sound.

Do what you have to do. You might even look into using plastic sabbots with heavy cast lead pistol bullets as a cheap alternative.

:m2c:

 

[tna]

i guess you're right about the 100yrds. just a good round number. but as i said i will probably never take that shot. only in perfect conditions and i've never had that in the feild.

thanks ghost. you've made me feel better about my choice.

i have been getting excellent accury with 275 maxihunters and 100 grns. actually didn't even have to move the sights from my usual 60 prb load. the prevous owner of my gun (my father inlaw and all around muzzleloading god, hell some people on this forum probably know him) said he had great results w/ball-ets so i'll give them a try.

and for everybody else, don't worry i haven't forsaken patched round balls. i will continue to shoot the hell outta em. just that my rifle with it's 1in48 twist dosent like them with big game loads. thanks for all your input.

 

[Ohio Joe]

My apologies Hawken50,

It was not my intent to suggest that you would not take kill shots. As I said earlier, I have yet to see a conical out perform the patched round ball at 100 or less yards. I haven't seen everything however. If a conical with a heavy load gets you to where you want to be, that's great! What ever works for you is what's important. :thumbsup:

 

[tna]

sorry. after rereading my post i realize i got a bit over defensive. no apology needed

 

[jim gray]

one of my gunsmith freind showed me a box of conicals made by hornady designed for barrels in 1:66 twist ,has any body tried them ?i've been using hornady products for years and usually had good results

The bullets you re talking about are Hornady PA conicals. They shoot well for me from a 1:48 and a 1:66 twist both. I even shot them for a friend's 1:28 inline and held great groups. The .50 cal.s weigh 240 grains. The groups did seem to improve, however as the rate of twist increased, but it was more than adequate for deer hunting from the all three guns.

 

[roundball]

i guess you're right about the 100yrds. just a good round number. but as i said i will probably never take that shot. only in perfect conditions and i've never had that in the feild.

thanks ghost. you've made me feel better about my choice.

i have been getting excellent accury with 275 maxihunters and 100 grns. actually didn't even have to move the sights from my usual 60 prb load. the prevous owner of my gun (my father inlaw and all around muzzleloading god, hell some people on this forum probably know him) said he had great results w/ball-ets so i'll give them a try.

and for everybody else, don't worry i haven't forsaken patched round balls. i will continue to shoot the hell outta em. just that my rifle with it's 1in48 twist dosent like them with big game loads. thanks for all your input.

If I could offer some friendly advice, don't try to make to many absolute decisions right away until there's been time to discuss, study, and try a variety of things.

For example: "round balls in the 1:48" twist barrel"

Actually RB's usually shoot very accurately in 1:48" barrels, usually requiring a good snug patch/ball combo. 1:48" twist barrels have been around for a long, long time and for example, I get excellent accuracy with mine using full power hunting loads with .018" pillow ticking patches.

There's a lot of variables so there's a lot to consider...enjoy the journey

 

[tna]

roundball,
i'm using tc .018 prelubed pillow ticking patches the work great for my small game load. thanks :thumbsup:

season opens in t- 7 hrs. i feel like a kid on xmas eve