Brass lock plates.

[Ethant]

Hello all. I was wondering if someone could help me with a musket question.
What is the history behind brass lock plates. Where and when were they used?
Who used them?
What time periods are they appropriate for?
Or any other random info you have about them would be hugely appreciated.
Thank you.

 

[rich pierce]

Rare. Sometimes bronze was used for sea service muskets.

 

[Commodore Swab]

Here are some examples
Carlsbad, early 1700's

Berlin, early 1700's brass barrel as well

And another Berlin circa 1700. This one even as far as a brass cock and brass frizzen with steel shoe.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Rare. Sometimes bronze was used for sea service muskets.

Exactly, some "brass" gun parts that bear a lot of stress like barrels and lock plates are actually misidentified bronze. Brass is pretty soft and the hole for the tumbler would likely wear itself out of true in a short amount of time.

LD

 

[Commodore Swab]

Exactly, some "brass" gun parts that bear a lot of stress like barrels and lock plates are actually misidentified bronze. Brass is pretty soft and the hole for the tumbler would likely wear itself out of true in a short amount of time.

LD

Brass vs bronze was often confusing. So confusing that "bronze" cannons were often specified as "gun metal" rather than bronze or brass.

If you want to have fun ask a bilingual (spanish/english) if they know the difference between brass and bronze (in english) the answer should be "yes." Then ask them the Spanish word for bronze and you will get "bronce" and then brass. . .Odds are it will be "bronce" along with a confused look on their face.

 

[Uncle Miltie]

Brass lock plates were used well into the percussion era. I have seen a number of original Ohio rifles with brass lockplates.

 

[Pete G]

Chambers offers all of theirs in brass.

 

[Rudyard]

Well that's interesting, if agree bronze would wear better , I've used cast brass for 17c locks of various nationality's what wear they have is I think practically trifling with the use they will get from me and you could bouch the bearing hole if wanted .
A' Steel' of brass faced with steel is a new one on me but cant argue Very nice pistols . I did see a new brass rifle barrel at a R vous( 2nd Shawnee from memory).and ide use one not that there is much gain but Got to be stylish! .I made a rifled carbine' after' Felix Werder c1650 noted Zurich maker who made much about brass barrels of his 'Invention' But I stocked it in a steel barrel but the lock was brass & at least some homage to this noted maker .Some where on these posts is 'Felix' is a good photo but I'me hopeless with E gajets so might get my youngest daughter to put one up to illustrate 'Felix '& similar early pieces .
Regards Rudyard

 

[bpd303]

I have seen a number of original Ohio rifles with brass lockplates.

I honestly can't remember if my grandfathers Ohio 36 cal flintlock had bronze or steel lock plate.

 

[Capt. Jas.]

Well that's interesting, if agree bronze would wear better , I've used cast brass for 17c locks of various nationality's what wear they have is I think practically trifling with the use they will get from me and you could bouch the bearing hole if wanted .
A' Steel' of brass faced with steel is a new one on me but cant argue Very nice pistols . I did see a new brass rifle barrel at a R vous( 2nd Shawnee from memory).and ide use one not that there is much gain but Got to be stylish! .I made a rifled carbine' after' Felix Werder c1650 noted Zurich maker who made much about brass barrels of his 'Invention' But I stocked it in a steel barrel but the lock was brass & at least some homage to this noted maker .Some where on these posts is 'Felix' is a good photo but I'me hopeless with E gajets so might get my youngest daughter to put one up to illustrate 'Felix '& similar early pieces .
Regards Rudyard

 

[Rudyard]

Dear Captain Jas . Thank you for putting up the two pics of my 'Felix Werder' based rifle its a 45 light oct swamped barrel , I only saw one side so I put a discreet period tool box in the reverse side. I seem to be drawn to uncommon stock shapes its been a very pleasant rifle and used to bowl pigs the feather is a vent plug if its wet,( I generally drill three small holes to take such quills in rifles meant for hunting) Are their any other brass locks I made, pics ?.
Regards Rudyard

 

[Rifleman1776]

Brass is pretty soft and the hole for the tumbler would likely wear itself out of true in a short amount of time.

My first thought also. But, couldn't that be remedied with the insertion of a hardened steel bushing?

 

[Loyalist Dave]

My first thought also. But, couldn't that be remedied with the insertion of a hardened steel bushing?

Of course but that would be a modern thing. I don't think any of the non-steel lock plates have such a bushing, nor even an iron one.

LD

 

[Commodore Swab]

Bearing material is often softer as it is made to wear. I tend to think though of the many later boxlocks that had brass/bronze little tabs for the frizzen spring to ride on. Definitely a wear area.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Bearing material is often softer as it is made to wear. I tend to think though of the many later boxlocks that had brass/bronze little tabs for the frizzen spring to ride on. Definitely a wear area.

Yeah, but isn't a box lock just different enough, than a sidelock? I mean you have a spring on the box lock is applying pressure to the actual hammer/cock, and that rests on an axle.... while the sidelock the spring pressure is on a tumbler, so you have pressure to rotate the tumbler, but as the pressure is off center, the tumbler is also being pushed to tilt inwards toward the main spring.

 

[Commodore Swab]

Yeah, but isn't a box lock just different enough, than a sidelock? I mean you have a spring on the box lock is applying pressure to the actual hammer/cock, and that rests on an axle.... while the sidelock the spring pressure is on a tumbler, so you have pressure to rotate the tumbler, but as the pressure is off center, the tumbler is also being pushed to tilt inwards toward the main spring.

I assume you are referring to an early unbridled tumbler?

 

[Rudyard]

I don t recall the original having a bridle but I snook one into mine anyway, A sort of' side saddle' affair I should look & check but wouldn't alter the tale & theirs no point to make .At that date conventiality wasn't much of a factor, In think you could 'go nuts' and no one could say you neigh. or that might be nay. I doubt spelling was remotley hard & fast either .
I did look the bridle has just one screwing from above dosnt link with the scear pin
Regards Rudyard

 

[Rudyard]

I looked it has a bridle contrived to support from just one 'pin' (Screw ) Never saw original internals just seemed better than non Maybe pic later.I seem to have made numbers with brass locks mostly Scots sorts
Regards Rudyard