Blowing Down Barrel

[Coot]

I could be wrong, but did blowing down the barrel come from battle tactics where they had to fire rapidly with much less potent powder than we have today? I've tried it, and found spent black powder tastes awful! :barf:

Interesting question. I have never seen any instruction for troops to blow down the barrel. Von Steuben's instructions of 1779 can be seen at www.2nc.org/steubman.htm

It should be obvious from previous locked discussion (and now this one) that some people feel very strongly on the subject and have no interest in reconsidering their position.

Not directed at you, flintlock62, but as a general comment, my Grandfather's advice was and is good enough for me. He said that no one had ever been shot with an empty gun but more than a few had been shot with a gun that they were certain had been empty.

 

[ChrisHarris]

But seriously, aren't the greatest dangers in muzzleloading brought about by the distractions provided by range companions?

Yes. I loaded a dry ball today and snapped 2 caps before I realized I'd forgot to pour the powder down the barrel.

Was talking and loading at the same time. :nono:

 

[hanshi]

I don't have strong feelings one way or the other about BDTB; I just happen to do it a lot. If you choose to do it blow from a few inches away; avoid mouth/muzzle contact as it's not needed or recommended. Fouling is not part of the food pyramid :rotf: .

 

[David W.]

......avoid mouth/muzzle contact as it's not needed or recommended. Fouling is not part of the food pyramid .

NOW you tell me! :rotf: Twas an accidental encounter not to be repeated, for sure! :nono:

 

[Zonie]

Speaking of ranges that prohibit blowing down the barrel here's another thought that may be behind it.

One of the first rules many people learn is, "Do NOT point a gun at anything that you don't want to kill."
There are other ways of saying it but they all boil down to the same rule.

Of course, the guy who sticks his gun barrel into his mouth is (hopefully) not planning on killing himself but right off the bat he/she is violating that rule.

Then we get to the bystanders who are watching.

Most of them will think, "He's breaking one of the most important rules." which is true but there are others watching who don't know about the rules and they are very impressionable.
I'm talking about kids.

I am not one of those "For the Children" guys when it comes to a lot of things but gun safety and kids rates very high with me.

Getting back to what the kid sees and a possible result:

The kid sees a grown man casually sticking a gun barrel into his mouth so the kid ends up thinking, "It is OK to stick gun barrels into my mouth. I saw the man who was shooting do it."

Without going into details I'm sure most of you can see where this is going.

Kid is at home. Kid finds dads trusty (loaded) pistol. Wants to be like the "Mountain Man he saw yesterday ......
Or, kid is at home. Kid wants to show his friend what he learned watching the Mountain Man at the shooting range and remembers his dads (loaded) pistol or rifle.
Says, "Hey Billy. You be the Mountain Man. I'll tell you what to do with this......


As I've said before, I never point my gun at something I don't wish to kill so I don't stick any gun barrel into my mouth.

If others here want to stick a gun barrel into their mouth and they are alone I'll say, "Be my guest!"
If they are around others, especially kids I'll be the first to object strongly.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

I personally do not blow down the bore, though I sometimes blow across the muzzle, which will produce a small puff of smoke at the nipple or touchhole,

This is what I do, but cup my hand over the muzzle to achieve the back pressure. I don't put my mouth on the muzzle as that will chip the teeth if somebody bumps the butt of the stock.

And let us not assume that past poets who wrote about shooting had any actual experience with shooting folks. They might; they might not.

LD

 

[reddog]

"People make muzzle loading a lot harder than they need to"

Ain't that the durn truth!

 

[Dphar]

Did anyone run any scientific tests which show the effectiveness of blowing down the barrel in a traditional ML gun? Probably not.

The term cook off would mean:
the barrel became so hot from shooting that it would ignite the powder just dumped in the barrel. If a barrel really gets this hot (at reenactments where you only shoot powder your barrel can get super hot during a battle)one would burn his lips just touching the barrel then. Definetely not recommended.
Cook offs occur in automatic weapons, if the operator does not change the barrel in regular intervals. For example at an air cooled machine gun, you are supposed to change the barrel every 150 shots or so,when you shot it without interruptions. And you better use a heat proof glove to touch the thing!
If you don't change the barrel, the next cartridge could actually cook off because the powder would ignite because of the heat of the barrel chamber. This is an uncontrolled ignition of your cartridge and may lead to problems.

Deflagration can not occur with black powder, because it is a mass explosive.

Accidential ignition of the powder charge because of a residual glowing amber from the previous shot can be prevented with several other methods than blowing down the barrel. A moist patch will do the same for example.

Blowing down the barrel does 4 things imho:

1.It softens the fouling because you blow in moist air

2. It shows that your touch hole/ignition channel is not obstructed by fouling.

3. It helps to load a second shot without cleaning because of the softened fouling

4. It may blow enough oxygen in there, that the obscure residual glowing amber combusts fully and gets blown out.

The last point is a maybe or maybe not. I would like to see that tested in a clear tube, similar like they show the spin jag working the rifling with the patch better than a normal jag.

Personally, I do the blowing down the barrel on my private range for points 1-3 or I use a moist patch.
The 4th point for me is like the old wife's tail in archery, that the cock feather should point out or that a right-handed archer needs right-wing feathers and a left-handed archer needs left-wing feathers on his arrow.
These old wifes tales were proven to be wrong by intensive industry testing procedures.

And I think we should stop the blowing down the barrel discussion in this thread.

A ML is not going to cook off because the barrel is so hot the powder ignites.
Automatic weapons can but its not as common as people might like to think.

I have no idea about the "glowing ember blown out" thing. But if I blow I blow till no smoke exits from the vent.

I DO know that people have been seriously wounded when a heavily fouled gun was loaded and it fired as the charge was being seated.
Examination showed the breeches were very heavily fouled and the culprit was believed to be a hot piece of fouling and the compression of the load put the powder against the hot spot. BP has a low enough ignition temp that a "glowing coal" is not required.
But large jagged clumps of fouling coupled with 2000+ degree burn temps means that the thick coating of fouling could insulate a portion of the mass so that it held enough heat to ignite the powder if the charge was pressed tight against the fouling. This is a form of "cook off" but different that what would be seen in a modern belt fed for example.
It could be that blowing, assuming some significant airflow through the vent, could cool the hot spot or simply the extra time taken up by the process could cool the hot spot to below ignition temp. Speculation but I think its pretty good.
I will not shoot so many shots as to have this level of build up. It is also possible the heavy build up was the result of improper cleaning and was cumulative over more than one secession of shooting.

So long as the postings remain civil I see no reason to stop the thread. It will eventually die out on its own.

Dan

 

[jethro224]

Here's the thing about the embers; Blowing is not meant to blow them out, or cool them off, but to finish the burn. Ever notice how a small ember, like when you catch a spark in char cloth, will flare and burn brighter when blown on? The theory is that blowing down the barrel will cause any small glowing embers of unburnt powder to flare up and burn completely before new powder is poured in.

A heavily fouled barrel, one with a plugged touch hole or nipple, can cause a "dieseling" effect which can ignite the powder. Same way a fire piston works.

 

[LRB]

I have posted this before, but here goes anyway. Over the years, I have personally met and talked with two different people that had a load go off while pushing the ball down. In both cases the ball and ramrod went through their hand leaving it usable but entirely without feeling. In both cases they were involved in a quick reload situation and did not blow down the bore as they both normally did. OK, I did not witness this myself, but both did tell me about it person to person. Decide for yourselves. I did. I blow down my bore after each and every shot before reloading. To each his own.