Best Elk Rifle?

[glrerun]

The question is what makes the best rifle, caliber, rate of twist, ammo, etc. for hunting elk in the western states where the country is open and the shots are long?

 

[BrownBear]

Conical or round ball?

 

[Roguedog]

That's a wide open question sir. Folks use many different calibers and types of arms to kill elk. I'm not sure there is a "best" gun. It seems generally folks like to have .50 cal or better, especially if using roundballs. As far as guns, twist rates and such, I guess the sky's the limit. There may be as many different types of guns and loads as there are hunters.

Jeff

 

[glrerun]

I already have my own thoughts, I am leaning towards flintlock .58 PRB with 1-56 twist. 44 inch barrel in a Longrifle, or 36 inch in a Hawken style rifle.

Before I plop a chunk of money down on another gun, I would like to hear others thoughts and experiences.

I am thinking .58, but also concerned that the shear weight and size of the .58 would be a trade off between Knockdown power and distance. I am happy with PRB or a conical, but will not use belted or sabots

 

[Dave K]

How long a shot are you capable of? Check the state you would hunt in. Many have a minimum bullet weight, that will take some rd. ball out of the picture.

 

[roundball]

IMO, the .58cal .570"/ 279 grain PRB would be very hard to beat.
More powerful than a .54cal, better trajectory than a .62cal.
Smaller lighter balls might be a faster at the muzzle but run out of gas / fall off quicker / deliver less energy at distance than a slightly heavier ball.

 

[Roguedog]

I've never hunted elk but I do have a .58 cal rifle and with round balls it sure does do a number on deer.

Jeff

 

[satx78247]

I shoot a Remington "contract carbine" (It's really a reproduction of no WBTS weapon.) for everything bigger than foxes/coyotes & load it with homebrew 530 grain Minie balls. = For the low/moderate price (Re-enactors don't like the Remington replicas, so prices are usually low.), I think that that rifle/Minie combination is hard to beat for big game, inasmuch as every such replica that I've seen is VERY accurate/hard-hitting with a suitable load, even on feral hogs to 500#.

just my OPINION, satx

 

[longcruise]

There is no way you will go wrong with a .58 and a round ball. A .54 would serve well too, but bigger holes are better! If you are comparing identical guns in .50, .54 and .58, the .58 will be lighter. Either choice you stipulated will work great.

Forget the wide open and the long shots scenario. Strictly for the modern gun crowd whose elk knowledge is limited to the cover of Field & Stream! Elk are best hunted in timber. Even if you locate them in the open, during the season they rarely get touched by the sun.

So, just sayin, don't concern yourself over distances. Instead study the animal and work on a hunt strategy.

 

[BrownBear]

...leaning towards flintlock .58 PRB with 1-56 twist. 44 inch barrel in a Longrifle, or 36 inch in a Hawken style rifle.

I'm certainly a fan of 58 caliber round balls, but you need to consider weight versus recoil compared to a 54 when it comes to trajectory for shots over 100 yards if you plan them. You really have to stuff some powder down a 58 bore to approach the trajectory possible with a 54. I doubt you're going to like it much lighting off 120-140 grains of 2f in a rifle lighter than 10#, and you're not going to want to carry one much heavier. My GRRW 58 caliber Hawken (36" barrel tapered 1 1/8" to 1" at the muzzle) weighs in at a whopping 12.5#, and it's a chunk to carry long distances, day after day. It's a pussy cat with the 140 grain charges it likes, though. That one is about as flat as the hotter loads in any of my 54's, but they're pussycats producing the same trajectory with around 100 grains of powder while weighing only 9#. Big difference.

I'd have no qualms about longish shots for elk with a 54 and those charges, but I'd probably settle on a 9#-10# 58 cal with a longish barrel for elk, just cuzz I like 58's.

 

[LaBonte]

The question is what makes the best rifle, caliber, rate of twist, ammo, etc. for hunting elk in the western states where the country is open and the shots are long?

I've hunted elk in many different places here in the west - from the west coast of Washington to the high desert country of New Mexico - over the last forty years and my first question would be where do you plan to hunt?
The reason is that the country varies considerably and it's a common mis-conception that all elk country is open and the shots are long here in the west.
FWIW - I've taken 22 elk in that forty years - 16 of them with muzzleloaders and have been in on many, many more kills (a bunch while working as a guide in my salad days). The longest shot I ever took was 125 yards (FWIW - the longest with a smokeless ctg gun was 175 yards). Most shots in the type of country I've mostly hunted - brushy foothills and timbered country have been under 75 yards - the shortest shot was 15 yards and 50 yards can be a long shot in many areas such as Northwest Montana and northern Idaho. So while yes there are the high desert/plains areas and the big open high country meadows where longer shots are more common, but far from all of the west is such open country with long shots.
My most commonly used gun was a 54 caliber using a .530"round ball, pillow ticking patch, and 90-110 grains of mostly 3F dependent on the rifle's likes. Put such a shot in the boiler room of even the biggest elk - and yes compared to deer they are big and heavy boned - and it will go down.
If I were to go with a dedicated elk rifle I might consider the 58, but for general usage in my experience the 54 can do it all and do it well in a lighter package than the 58 as long as you do your part. And it will do it with a flatter trajectory and without unpleasant recoil. I have no doubt that this is why the 54 caliber was by the 1830's the most popular caliber used by the mountain men and other pro hunters of the past - kind of like the 30-06 of the muzzleloaders.

 

[LaBonte]

BTW - that longest shot was to take down a wounded bull (the hunter had broken a leg only and while that bull moved pretty darn good on three, it wouldn't have lasted and would have suffered a lot) that weighed in around 600 lbs - we were in mostly timbered country so I was carrying my original Potsdam smoothbore musket with a cut down 30" long 11 ga barrel. The load was something like 140 grains of 2F under a big old 625 grain patched round ball. The only shot was a Texas heart shot after the bull broke out into a small meadow and it traveled the length of the bull (about 4') and stopped in his brisket. The best "lucky" shot I ever had, although I knew as long as I had a good hit into the pelvis region it would at least break him down so he couldn't travel very far and the shot needed to be taken because if he'd gotten back into the heavy timber on the other side of the meadow it would have been tough to follow up since it was near dusk and there was a good chance we would have lost him.

 

[LaBonte]

dbl post

 

[Britsmoothy]

Well I am not qualifiedto advise but a 20g trade gun crossed my mind! At lleast you could feed while waiting!
Feller on here I think uses one regularly!

B.

 

[BrownBear]

I've hunted elk in many different places here in the west - from the west coast of Washington to the high desert country of New Mexico - over the last forty years and my first question would be where do you plan to hunt?
The reason is that the country varies considerably and it's a common mis-conception that all elk country is open and the shots are long here in the west.
FWIW - I've taken 22 elk in that forty years - 16 of them with muzzleloaders and have been in on many, many more kills (a bunch while working as a guide in my salad days). The longest shot I ever took was 125 yards (FWIW - the longest with a smokeless ctg gun was 175 yards). Most shots in the type of country I've mostly hunted - brushy foothills and timbered country have been under 75 yards - the shortest shot was 15 yards and 50 yards can be a long shot in many areas such as Northwest Montana and northern Idaho. So while yes there are the high desert/plains areas and the big open high country meadows where longer shots are more common, but far from all of the west is such open country with long shots.
My most commonly used gun was a 54 caliber using a .530"round ball, pillow ticking patch, and 90-110 grains of mostly 3F dependent on the rifle's likes. Put such a shot in the boiler room of even the biggest elk - and yes compared to deer they are big and heavy boned - and it will go down.
If I were to go with a dedicated elk rifle I might consider the 58, but for general usage in my experience the 54 can do it all and do it well in a lighter package than the 58 as long as you do your part. And it will do it with a flatter trajectory and without unpleasant recoil. I have no doubt that this is why the 54 caliber was by the 1830's the most popular caliber used by the mountain men and other pro hunters of the past - kind of like the 30-06 of the muzzleloaders.

Great post! :hatsoff:

 

[Sean Gadhar]

Forget the wide open and the long shots scenario. Strictly for the modern gun crowd whose elk knowledge is limited to the cover of Field & Stream! Elk are best hunted in timber. Even if you locate them in the open, during the season they rarely get touched by the sun.

So, just sayin, don't concern yourself over distances. Instead study the animal and work on a hunt strategy.

Nope, yep, kinda :hmm:

Optics should be your distance concern. Finding elk can mean "looking over" Wide expanses, If your eyes hurt after 20-30 min. looking through your binoculars your in for a hard elk hunt.

I think every elk I killed with a centerfire was well under 200 yards, most were just about 100 yards give or take. So your really talking about skipping some shots & moving just a bit closer on the rest & almost all could have been 80 yard M/L shots.

And I think I had binoculars to my eyes Looking over ridge lines, bowls, & saddles on average :idunno: 18-20 hours over 4-5 days finding each of them.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Great voice of experience reply.
I was going to leave the thread when I saw the "long" shot part of the question. Too many wannabe ml hunters do not understand, or refuse to accept, the ml with round ball is an obsolete firearm with limited capabilities. Within it's effective range it is an excellent killer. I know nothing bout shooting mls with conicals. :shake: The TV shows with some popular "Great Hunter" using an inline on game in the mountains at many hundreds of yards is very misleading and designed to only sell rifles.
Stick with skilled hunting and a rifle you like. I'm sure you will bring home the bacon....or elk. :wink:

 

[satx78247]

AGREED. - Even with 530 grain Minies (which retain "killing power far better than a PRB) out of an accurate .58 caliber WBTS-era rifle, I don't even consider shots at game beyond 125M.

just my OPINION, satx

 

[Vaino]

I agree w/ those espousing the .54 w/ PRB to achieve a "practical" trajectory w/ a 100 yd zero.....which can be easily "stretched" to 125yds. My load and one that has shot a few elk at ranges of 20-107Yds w/o a "loss"....120 grs 3f and a .535 PRB. Recoil is moderate w/ this load but to achieve the same or similar trajectory w/ a .58, the powder charge is much larger and the recoil for some can be a problem.

I do try to get as close as possible to an elk, but sometimes it's not possible and that's when the 100 yd zero is just the ticket.

Don't think the .58 offers that much more "killing power" than the .54 and my experiences w/ my .54 tells me....doesn't need any improvement.

For a very versatile MLer for hunting elk, the .54 is hard to beat......Fred

 

[LaBonte]

Words of wisdom - Most of the accomplished elk hunters I know spend 75% of their time scoping out the potential of an area and the rest is the actual hunt..