18th century pistol buckets

[JOHN F]

has anyone ever made their own?? Have seen some masterpieces made by S. Lilley but was interested in trying my hand at it.. Let me know or see anyone elses' experience.. thanks guys

 

[JOHN F]

no one has taken on this kind of project???

 

[LRB]

Thought about it for a Brit heavy Dragoon, but haven't done it. I know about the way I'd go about making it.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Wassa pistol bucket? :idunno:

 

[BrownBear]

Watched the guy at Williamsburg finishing off a pair. Wow. Sure inspired me. They had hair-on bear hide for flaps, which he told me was "period" waterproofing. Wow, again. Don't have the pistols or the horses any more, but the impulse to make a pair is still lingering.

 

[JOHN F]

wick was hoping you chime in. any thoughts on how to start..

 

[Rifleman1776]

Wassa pistol bucket? :idunno:

One of these? :wink:

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[Claude Mathis]

Wassa pistol bucket? :idunno:

 

[matt denison]

Did they look like this?
http://www.bisonsaddlery.com/historicalreproductions/detail.asp?ID=6732

 

[BrownBear]

Here is what they were calling "pistol buckets" at Colonial Williamsburg. Scroll to the bottom of the page. Funny angle on the shot until you spot the butt of one pistol. It's a pair of buckets designed to hang across a saddle, with the bear hair flaps I referenced clearly visible. Click on the image to enlarge for a better look. Easy to see why they were called "buckets."

 

[LRB]

I'm gunna crawfish. The more I look at them, the more questions I also have. If it was to look like the ones I'm seeing.

 

[George]

Here are a couple of originals from the Tom Wnuck collection, called pommel holsters.



They are mentioned in the newspapers of the day, but I've never found the term "bucket" there.

The Pennsylvania Gazette
April 24, 1793
An ACT for the regulation of the Militia of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. ”¦.the commissioned officers of the several troops or horse shall furnish themselves with good horses of at least fourteen hands and an half high, and shall be armed with a sword and pair of pistols, the holsters of which shall be covered with bear-skin caps;

The South-Carolina GAZETTE
October 1, 1772
CHARLES-TOWN
JOSHU A LOCKWOOD, Has just imported, in the ship PALLAS,
Silver-mounted Saddle Holsters,...

Spence

 

[BrownBear]

BTW-

When you look at the stitching at the bottom or "muzzle" end of the buckets, you may come away scratching your head.

I've made lots of round cases ranging from fly rod tubes to map cases and camera lens cases, and you're off in a different direction than most stitching you'll encounter in sewing simple shooting bags. This book got me started in the right direction, but this one was a useful addition, too.

In my experience 7 tpi stitching is about as big as you want to go, and 9 tpi is better for small cylinders like you see on the buckets in the link. Trouble is, you seldom find overstitch or "pricking" wheels finer than 7 tpi. This is what I finally ended up with.

 

[necchi]

9tpi?
Wow, what'r ya using for needles an thread when it's that tight?

 

[LaBonte]

9tpi?
Wow, what'r ya using for needles an thread when it's that tight?

18/3 or 25/3 linen thread using a #3 (not a 000)harness needle is commonly used for 8-10 stitches per inch (SPI) - most pre-1900 or so hand sewing tended to use finer threads with stitches in the 8-12 SPI range.
For fine thread counts at 12 SPI plus I prefer silk thread since it is the strongest natural thread. There 's a glove in the Leather craft museum in London sewn at 60 threads per inch - don't ask me how but it is there...

Brown Bear - for finer overstitch wheels check the vintage leather tool sellers like Bruce Johnson who has bunch right now http://brucejohnsonleather.com/con...titch-markers-stitch-groovers-and-channelers/
For anything tighter than 10 SPI I prefer pricking irons rather than a wheel - easier to control. You'll also need to narrow and/polish and awl blade to match the size.

 

[BrownBear]

Agreed about Bruce's sources, but here's the real distinction about the tool I linked:

These are not like the normal overstitch wheels that you often see. Each tooth creates a diagonal line instead of a point and are very sharp.

You can read the whole description here. What it boils down to is that in contrast to a conventional pricking wheel such as Bruce lists, these are a series of little tiny blades set on the diagonal. What you get is a row of little lines at the perfect angle to help you orient the awl for really neat stitches. Dunno about anyone else, but that's been a real problem for me on small stitches going around curves and corners. Nothing to do with muzzleloading leather, rather it's on other stuff for other uses. But man, does it ever make a difference. Their irons appear to be the same, but I haven't tried them.

I know what you're saying about irons, but I have the same problems going around curves and corners with irons.

Good call on the needles, thread and awls for small work. This little gem from the same source is a dandy for small work, too.

 

[Capt. Jas.]

I have a whole set of pricking wheels from about 4-15 spi but I always go for my irons on just about everything.

 

[JOHN F]

thanks for all the responses so far. I made a pattern the other day from paper . it looks good so far except for gettingthe very top to be straight . mine is tending to peak a touch on the sides..

 

[BrownBear]

Keep us posted on the results. I'm real interested. I woulda spent the whole day watching and talking to the guy at Williamsburg, but traveling with family limits such options. Not so when a creative guy like you takes it on and shares on the web. Thanks!

 

[Rick Son]

Buffler,close but no cigar..I bet David Carrico would know~