Shots between swabing

[kohana]

Hi All,

New here and saying hello.

I have a CVA flintlock 45 cal Kentucky rifle kit that I built in the early 70s and never shot. I have recently renewed my interest in BP C/P revolvers and thought about this rifle that I have carried around for 30 some years. I asked on another forum if anyone knew if these old CVA Repos were safe and found that several have and still used the same gun thou most in percussion.
So I took it to the range for a try. I fired 3 rounds then ran a cleaning patch through the barrel 1 time then on the next 3rd load the ball locked up solid about 8-10 in below the muzzle.
I was amazed at how tough it was to pull it.
Anyhow, to my point, I use Geox 3f, .440 ball (45cal bore) and .015 cotton patch material lubed with Bore Butter. How many shots should I take before cleaning and how to clean for continued shooting.

As a PS I was surprised at how cool the Fjavascript:void(0) :grin: lash-Boom of a Flinter is. As a left hander I get to enjoy the flash part more than most. :grin:
Thanks for any info
Bob

 

[Stumpkiller]

Welcome!

I stop and wipe with a cotton patch briefly held on my tongue every 5 to 10 shots - depending on the humidity and how hard that makes it in keeping the fouling soft.

 

[BrownBear]

That doesn't sound like a very happy combo. I have the impression that you're lubing the patches yourself, rather than buying prelubed. You might just try upping the amount of lube on the patch. And I'm guessing that patch/ball combo loaded pretty easy before the fouling buildup.

The whole point is to try to have soft fouling that simply slides down the barrel when you seat the next ball after firing. Lotta guys use liquid lubes (Hoppes #9Plus, spit, olive oil, Windex, and lots of others) for shooting incredibly long strings without swabbing. I have to swab about every 3 shots if I use Bore Butter in 50's and larger, but I have no experience with 45's. I will say that using Mink Oil Grease from Track of the Wolf I swab every 10 shots out of habit more than need. With a blend of deer tallow and olive oil I never have to swab.

And yeah, welcome!

 

[Sunkmanitu Tanka]

I wipe between every shot in order to keep loading easy, and to keep the condition of the barrel the same each shot i make...

 

[Mike Brooks]

You might try a .020 patch.

 

[Greenjoytj]

Dito! Just one wipe between every shot.

This keeps the bore in the same lightly fouled state for every shot. This between shot wiping greatly tightened up my target groups.

I keep a small can on the loading bench when shooting a the range for colection of the waste wiping patches.

 

[ApprenticeBuilder]

All of them.

If you change to a liquid lube instead of the paste your using and go with a tighter patch there is a very good chance you'll not need to swab between shots at all, ever, again.

Just a thought :wink:

 

[rafterob]

The variables affecting this are weather conditions (mainly humidity), lube, powder and patch/ball combo. My first thought however, is that your rifle having sat for so many years, is the bore clean and smooth? If there is old gummed up preservative/residue that could certainly cause the conditions you encountered. Otherwise, particularly dry weather or not enough lube contributes to harder fouling. A loose ball/patch to bore fit will allow excess fouling build-up.Address all of these issues and you will have good results. As others have already posted,wiping between shots with a damp patch will eliminate the problem. I, personally only wipe when loading becomes sticky. Sometimes that is 5 shots, sometimes it is never needed.

 

[jamesthomas]

I swab about every other shot when using a grease lube but I can shoot 15 to 20 before I swab if I use spit or Hoppe's #9 blackpowder lube. Also to save money on cleaning patches (they're $12.00 per 250 ct down here) I buy 2 square yards of cotton flannel at the fabric store, get around 500+ for $8.60 this way. Also most of us use a Range Rod made of brass or stainless steel with a T handle on it, works a lot easier than a ram rod.

 

[Rifleman1776]

I had one of those CVA 'kentucky' flintlock rifles in the earl '70s. It was my second ml gun and second long gun. Pure junk all the way. Two piece stock was matched with a two piece barrel. Running a patch down, or worse, trying to load was near impossible. Hung up everytime. Lock sparked some of the time.
Enneyhow, consider you have an inferior barrel.
If you can get a patch or load down, you are lucky. Bad or good rifle, my practice is to swab with every shot.

 

[ebiggs1]

I never swab and I use Bore Butter. I don't have nor have I ever shot a CVA but I don't see why yours would be any different. I would suggest you thoroughly clean the gun first. Use plenty of lube and try a .018 pillow ticking patch.
I never swab and I advise others not to either because it can cause more trouble than it ever helps. I have tried all the lubes the guys brag about but always come back to Bore Butter or just plain olive oil.
Bore Butter is just the best all around lube, not the best in certain situations not the worse. It is easy to get. It is NOT a rust preventative as some suggest it is.
Spit is the worst besides who wants to chew on patch material anyway?
Clean your gun thoroughly, first.

 

[mr.flintlock]

I'll offer a couple of things. For patch lube I use a mixture of olive oil and water 50/50 mix with just a little alcohol. I believe the alcohol helps the oil and water mix. I keep in a little squirt bottle. I use .018 pillow ticking for my Shooting patches and as someone else suggested I buy flannel by the yard and cut my cleaning patches.

With the mixture I described for a patch lube I can fire a twenty minute relay without swabbing. I usually run a spit patch down the bore when I start a new relay. I always put my finger over the tip of the bottle and give it a little shake before squirting it onto the patch.

As to your rifle: I do hear some complaints about some of the old CVA rifles but I hear a lot of positive things also. From my own personal experience I can tell you that I have had two of them and that were both good shooters and they both gave me good service. I do believe that when you find the right patch,ball, lube and powder load combination you will enjoy your rifle. Also, after you have shot a box or two balls through it you should find that your rifle will load and shoot better.

 

[jerrywh]

I never swab. I use 50% winterized windshield washer fliuid and 50% liquid dove hand soap as a lube. The washer fuid has ancohol in it so the lube won't freeze at low temp. We shoot here when it is near zero times.

 

[kohana]

Thanks for all the responses. It looks like I have many things to try. The barrel is one piece and in good shape but for the rifling groves which have some chatter marks. I guess that was CVAs level of expertise at the time. Someone suggested a thicker patch and I am wondering what the theory is there.
Bob

 

[ApprenticeBuilder]

The theory is,

A tighter ball patch combination allows for the cleaning of the bore upon loading, each shot is consistent.

I use a liquid lube that I procured the recipe for so no longer need to purchase or pull it from the blanket, I load a .495 ball and .026 denim patch and do not swab between shots at all, period.

Once past the crown of the muzzle it loads like a dream, a solid slap of the short starter is all it takes.

Chronograph, new target frame, unlimited liquid lube, as well as a solid supply of grease type lubes, there will be some serious load work going on this summer.

 

[Wayne/Al]

I have one of those old CVA Kentucky rifles. Mine started as percussion but I converted it to flint.It has always been a good shooter. I use goex 3f 60 gr, .020 pillow ticking patch lubed with olive oil and a .440 ball. In my gun thats a good snug fit. I have to use a ball starter to start the ball. Once you get your load figured out you may have a good shooter. Good Luck.

Wayne/Al

 

[C Barker]

"I use 50% winterized windshield washer fliuid and 50% liquid dove hand soap as a lube."

Jerry, you know I gotta ask: with that liquid dove hand soap do you blow bubbles out the muzzle? :rotf:

 

[Twowithone]

I can get 2 shots out of her before its hard to start another ball. 3f powder 65 grs .018 patch 490 roundball. Should I try maybe .020 patches.

 

[Old Salt]

I have a 33" CVA barrel on a small .45 flintlock rifle. I use about 43 grains of 3f powder, a .440 ball and pillow ticking. I use spit patches and never wipe between shots. A typical day of shooting will be 25-30 shots.

In my experience if the bore is very clean when you start the day you won't have problems loading during the day.

 

[Ray-Vigo]

My strategy is consistency more than anything else. I have a .50 and use a .495 ball with a .017 patch. I use liquid on the patch. I know I can get 3 shots down smoothly. I usually can get a 4th. A 5th is iffy. Beyond that I usually notice it getting tight. So I swab every 3 shots whether it feels like it may need it or not. I know I'm good to go another 3, and it does keep the bore relatively clean.