pasties {the food kind}

[Loyalist Dave]

Chicken, Raisin and sour cherries, some habanero sauce for some heat.

What an interesting combination! I must try that today!

Claude wrote:

The first pies, called ”˜coffins’ or ”˜coffyns’, were savoury meat pies where the crusts or pastry was tall and straight-sided with sealed-on floors and lids. Open-crust pastry (without tops or lids) was known as ”˜traps’. These pies held assorted meats and sauce components and were baked more like a modern casserole with no pan (the crust itself was the pan, its pastry tough and inedible).

Ah yes and even into the 18th century certain dishes were enclosed in an inedible dough-covering and then cooked, and set aside to cool while other cooking was done. They were not served as we do pies today. If the dough based shell is not edible...is it really a type of "pie" as we use the term?

LD

 

[NeilMacleod]

The crust was not edible since it was heavily salted to preserve them and they were hard to not vulnerable. Maybe the early version of tack lol

 

[coloradoclyde]

Perhaps it was a "market" or "street" food baked at a bakery and meant to be portable....The crust serving as a container and cooking vessel.

 

[tenngun]

I’ve made a short paste for baking meat pies and they were tasty crust and all. Then made Cornish style meat pies that have very simple crust that were good with the innards.
Bread used as a trencher by nobles then discarded to the poor is mentioned in medieval literature.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Perhaps it was a "market" or "street" food baked at a bakery and meant to be portable....The crust serving as a container and cooking vessel

I know that I've seen a sort of 18th century meat loaf encased in a crust, which was more of a protection from insects and such as it sat and cooled, and was served cooled later in the day when it was made. It also freed up the oven for other dishes and a pie, and those dishes were served hot. So it could very well be the container before newsprint or tin foil was used for tranporting foods.

LD

 

[coloradoclyde]

Check this out...Look familiar?

https://youtu.be/aZlfY7wWfKA?t=6m4s

Here are dumplings cooked in cow dung. The dough serves as a cooking vessel.

https://youtu.be/pM8x0gTiSdA?t=8m51s

It's easy to see how these principles are adapted around the world

Here is a chicken wrapped in salt dough, similar concept but slightly different
https://youtu.be/0G6ugOHuDto

 

[NeilMacleod]

Been wanting to do a salt coat roast for many years, Salt and Egg whites, like a natural pressure cooker and the meat falls apart and is juicy.
:thumbsup:

 

[coloradoclyde]

like a natural pressure cooker

I was watching a video of people cooking in rural Nepal over a fire and they were using a pressure cooker to cook their food. It seemed odd to me that they were using a pressure cooker to cook everything....Then it dawned on me.....ALTITUDE.

 

[Pukka Bundook]

Now this is interesting Gents;
I've now lived in Canada 34 years, and don't reckon I've met anyone here yet who knew what a pastie was!
To us they were Cornish pasties, as mentioned above.
Used to eat them at least once a week back home.

As Dave says, originally the crust was just the way to transport them to work, (think tin miners in Cornwall, but all miners seemed to eat them)
They could be carried in a pocket, and broken open to eat, the pastry being discarded.
At one time, a pastie would have a dessert -type filling in one end, (Apples or whatever)and the mean and taties in the other. (This According to an old Cornish lass who seemed to know about these things.
These, and pork pies I Miss!
Got very passable at pork pies, but never tackled pasties myself.

I do find it a puzzle that they should be known so well in the US, but not up here in Canada, at least not in this area of Alberta.

Thanks fo all the info in this thread all.

Richard.

 

[Black Hand]

Drive South to Montana and you can eat as many as you like. Butte is well-known for pasties, though pasties can also be found elsewhere in the state...

 

[Loyalist Dave]

At one time, a pastie would have a dessert -type filling in one end, (Apples or whatever)and the mean and taties in the other. (This According to an old Cornish lass who seemed to know about these things.

Please see the Bedfordshire Clanger. Make the meat portion with bacon and you get a bacon badger

LD

 

[Pukka Bundook]

Thanks for the link Dave, I will look it up.

Just did look it up, and it sounds about right!

Richard.

 

[NeilMacleod]

http://www.goodtoknow.co.uk/recipes/550269/bedfordshire-clanger

 

[Kansas Jake]

I had never heard of them until we visited my daughter in Michigan. I like them. Down here we have bier rocks and in Nebraska they have Runzas. Those two are similar. They are a pastry filled with meat(usually ground beef or ground pork sausage or a combination)with cabbage and onion and spices and then baked. Spices often are just salt and pepper.

 

[nhmoose]

HC/PC hot pocket if you warm it on the side of the fire or your armpit before eating. :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

 

[Loyalist Dave]

The first I ever had were Jamaican pasties...spicey and sometimes made of goat (so I was glad of the spices). Then we got a woman in our group from Michigan, and she made pashties, which were similar, but not the spice, and more of a doughy shell (more akin to a soft pretzel than the flaky dough of its Jamaican cousin). I had a Cornish pasty made by an English woman which was very similar to the Michigan version, and I've had a few clangers which were in a crust similar to a thin pizza crust, like a calzone....OH yeah, don't forget the Calzone in all of this!

I don't include Perogi's in this, as I think they belong with Ravioli. Of course that's assuming that I've seen enough versions of Perogi that I have a good handle on the product.

Like the history of the Cornish Pasty, we found that issuing the lads a couple of pasties when they were going from camp before noon, and going to be in skirmishes on and off until return at about tea-time..., worked very well. Most ate one right after heading out..., and then had the other at about 2 in the afternoon. Saved a lot of cleaning in camp, and saved on wood.

I'd think they'd be excellent for folks venturing out from the hunting camp for the day, especially in cold conditions when one needs more calories and finds the body temp dropping while sitting still for several hours to ambush a deer. Also an excelling item for carrying in one's haversack for lunch when at a market fair.

LD

 

[coloradoclyde]

"Calzone"....How did I miss that one...

 

[satx78247]

ALL of the "authentic" Cornish/Welsh pasty recipes that I've found on "the Worldwidewierd" include "Swede" as an ingredient. - I tried to look that up & found that "Swede" is "turnip" with no other description.

Do any of our members know WHICH sort of turnip??

yours, satx

 

[George]

Swede is rutabaga.

Spence

 

[satx78247]

THANKS. = All of the usual search engines say: TURNIP.
(At least to me, a rutabaga is not the same vegetable.)

yours, satx