FFFFFG Swiss?

[ozark57]

I am making a powder order and need priming powder. Has anyone tried Swiss fffffg (5F) ? I was told it flashed real good, gave faster ignition.

 

[Dphar]

I am making a powder order and need priming powder. Has anyone tried Swiss fffffg (5F) ? I was told it flashed real good, gave faster ignition.

Its called "Null B" Swiss and its faster by timing that FFFFG GOEX but if you can tell the difference shooting you have faster ears than I do.
I like the stuff.
Dan

 

[paulvallandigham]

Null B is faster than 4Fg Goex priming powder, but it also takes on moisture faster. Fine for dry humidity, but not the best choice, even on a range, when its raining. As long as you understand its advantages and disadvantages, you won't be caught by surprise and disappointed. Its also a lot more expensive than Goex powders.

I know one serious target shooter who uses it for Match Shooting, ONLY, and uses Goex 4Fg priming powder when practicing, or doing informal shooting. To Each his own....... :blah: :youcrazy: :shocked2: :surrender: :thumbsup:

 

[Ranger1759]

I was at The Columbus, Ohio Deer and Turkey Expo this past weekend, there was a booth set up by one of the larger blackpowder deales,( new in-lines) I think from Maine, can't remember the name...anyhow, we got talking about that same topic, as he deals with Swiss and Goex....he likes both and stated the mentioned advantages and disadvantages of both, but for what you get, I can't see paying $27.00 per lbs for the Swiss vs. $14.00 lbs for the Goex....My .02...Ranger

 

[oldarmy]

I have used NullB in the poring rain at least a dozen times.. Never had a problem with it.
I love it, While it's more expensive.. just a pinch will do you.
Have the same can from over a couple years and I shoot quite a bit.
If you buy a can you will be pleased with it.
Had a "shooter" tell me flintlocks don't work in the rain or high humidity.. Yea what-ever

 

[Dphar]

I was at The Columbus, Ohio Deer and Turkey Expo this past weekend, there was a booth set up by one of the larger blackpowder deales,( new in-lines) I think from Maine, can't remember the name...anyhow, we got talking about that same topic, as he deals with Swiss and Goex....he likes both and stated the mentioned advantages and disadvantages of both, but for what you get, I can't see paying $27.00 per lbs for the Swiss vs. $14.00 lbs for the Goex....My .02...Ranger

Depends on the usage. For priming no. But I ordered a case so ordered a pound of Null B just to try.
People that buy powder in 5 pound lots and have it shipped pay virtually as much for some of the lesser powders as I do for Swiss by the case.
The haz-mat on 5 pounds is as much as for a case for example.
And Swiss is more accurate, is very popular in competition, fouls less and needs about 10% less powder for a given velocity or will generally allow replication of old BPCR velocities with the same powder charge.
I have a Nock breech in a rifle that will shoot all day with Swiss and will block passage to the antechamber with flakes of fouling with some powders and stop working in 3 shots.
Which, as an aside, indicates to me they had pretty good powder in the late 1780s in England when this breech was invented.

Dan

 

[necchi]

I have seen guy's using Null-B.
All I can say is "WOW!". Instant ignition! A very desirable trait for target shooting.
Was an RO at a territorial shoot a few years back, the wind was awfull that weekend a gusty 10-20 quatering away that was knocking over our staked target frames from time to time.
The rock tossers where struggling, except for a few guy's, and tucked in their shooting boxes was Null-B. They were NOT sharing the "secret" with others.

 

[Walks with fire]

I use it for hunting deer here in PA and the weather is always damp and high humidity. Null-B has been outstanding in my flinters in all weather; the only drawback is that your pan/frizzen/barrel must have no gaps or it will leak out easy because it's fine. One L&R lock is snug fitting all around and does not leak but my TC has big enough gaps that it does.

The more I use Swiss powder in the bore the more I like it(not Null-b); even if it does cost a bit more I use it for more velocity than Goex gives with my higher BC bullets and fast twist flinters. Swiss yields 250-280 fps. more velocity than the same load of Goex. It's much faster. I still use good ol Goex for my ball launchers though and my ball guns seem to prefer the Goex powder anyway.

 

[roundball]

I think Larry Pletch ran some sophisticated testing on different brands of priming powder, including Null-B...don't recall him including Swiss 5F though...maybe he'll see this thread and jump in.

Anecdotally, it does seem that if Swiss Null-B was so much faster than Goex 4F that only select shooters who used it were winning matches, word would be out everywhere by now and everybody would be using it...dunno.

As far as my hunting goes, I manage my lock & Goex 4F prime in such a manner that (knock on wood) I've never even had a delayed ignition taking shots during high humidity weather, and 3-4 times I've gotten caught out in actual rain.

Add to that, old habits die hard and if I simply accepted that Null-B was fantastic enough to switch to, I'd still go through those same lock & prime management steps while hunting so I guess switching would not be high on my priority list...and I lke the convenience of ordering a case of Goex mixed one can 4F to 24 cans of 3F.

 

[Walks with fire]

I think the one can of Swiss Null-B that I bought will be around longer than I will. I am sure it's faster and would bet it's hotter as well.

 

[necchi]

Anecdotally, it does seem that if Swiss Null-B was so much faster than Goex 4F that only select shooters who used it were winning matches, word would be out everywhere by now and everybody would be using it...dunno.



Add to that, old habits die hard.

They are, but the winners don't share the edge secrets they have, that's why they win and not someone else. Matter of fact some become quit beligerant about sharing or showing anything!

And you said it, Even with the word out as it is right here,right now, some just won't change.
They'll find any excuess to validate their opinion and stay with what works for them.
In this case it's usually cost and availablity

 

[oldarmy]

I am a big BUY AMERICAN GUY.
So when I went to the Maine powder house to buy 50lbs of powder..
I wanted to buy American made powder..Period... Didn't care about velocity, fowling, what-ever.. It's black powder and I don't shot competition anyway.
Now he told me there are "no nitrate" plants left in the USA and all of our nitrate comes from overseas.. SO Goex is only "assembled in the USA" Not made here.. Don't know if he was blowing smoke, or telling the truth.
I know we still make ammonia nitrate here. It's fertilizer, but as far as the black powder stuff :idunno:
As much as I like the GERMAN and SWISS STUFF. If I knew for a fact that Goex was "AMERICAN MADE" I would buy it.
In fact I need to buy some more powder in the next few weeks/months.. supply is getting low and Like to have 25lbs or more on hand.

 

[roundball]

Black powder also requires sulfur too but I doubt Goex has it's own sulfur manufacturing plant.
Chemicals are used as ingredients to "make" black powder and I'm sure Goex buys their various chemicals from various chemical suppliers.

The Goex manufacturing plant is located in LA.
http://goexpowder.com/

 

[oldarmy]

That's a great point Roundball. :thumbsup:
Getting to the point where I need to re-stock my supply and I am leaning towards buying Goex.
However that NullB is still the "bees knees" :rotf:

 

[Larry Pletcher]

I think Larry Pletcher ran some sophisticated testing on different brands of priming powder, including Null-B...don't recall him including Swiss 5F though...maybe he'll see this thread and jump in.

To my knowledge Swiss 5f is not a term that Swiss uses. I expect it's someone else. When I bought powder for the priming test article, Swiss Null B and Swiss 4f were the only priming powders that Swiss marketed.
Regards,
Pletch