shock wave?

[Jason Lewis]

correct, the design of the nose of the bullet has a great effect on the amount of bow wave produced by the bullet.

 

[George]

I was looking for something in my hunting journal and ran across a doe I killed which is appropriate for this discussion. In Oct., 2005, I killed a big doe by shooting her between the eyes at 30 yards with a .600" round ball over 80 gr. 3F. The result was amazing to me at the time, and still is. The ball took the complete top of the doe's head off, including her entire brain. It was as if her head had been sawed straight across just above her eyes, all the brain, bone, muscle and skin was simply gone. I found only one palm-sized piece of the top of her skull 12 feet away from where she was shot, and the brush around her was splattered with brains and tissue. There was only a slight indication of an entrance wound, hard to find because all the head above it was gone. What is called the brain pan, the double cup shaped flat part of the skull where the brain rests, was completely open, and was all there was to see of her head from there up.

With my hunting load in that gun I get a muzzle velocity of about 1475 fps. At 30 yards the ball still traveling at about 1200 fps.

Thinking about the two events, I'm struck by the similarity of the result on the doe at 30 yards and those jugs of water at 50 yards with basically the same load. Her head exploded from inside the same way the jugs did. I personally have no doubt hydraulic shock plays a significant part in the killing of game using round balls. I can't imagine anything else which can explain the results I've seen.

Spence

 

[nhmoose]

Dead is dead, I have killed deer with a 40cal 50cal, 16ga muzzle loaders all under 50 yards, 2 moose with a 54cal. all dead within 30 yards.

I have also killed many deer with Modern suppository guns in cals .30, .35, .45 with both Jacketed and cast boolits. the .45 and .30 cast's are reliable killers IMHO for my ranges however it is very hard to hunt with other than my .62 SB flintlock.

 

[Okie Hog]

I think bullet construction is one of those things that can result in a lot of variation in the cavitation effect. The difference in cavitation between an FMJ and an identical bullet designed to disrupt dramatically will be considerable.

i've killed dozens of wild hogs with one of the military rounds that Dr. Martin Fackler wrote about, the M193 5.56mm ball round.

At ranges up to about 150 yards, when fired from a 20 inch or longer barrel; the 55 grain bullet of the M193 ball round often bang flops large hogs shot in the crook of the front leg. The lungs are jellified, the spleen and liver are often badly damaged or destroyed, especially in hogs under about 100 pounds. The bullet breaks in two at the cannelure and fragments.

At ranges of about 175 yards the bullet loses it's magic.

i've also killed a lot of wild hogs using .50 muzzleloaders. Most were killed with those guns we don't discuss here.

Couple years ago i started hunting with patched round ball. Killed a couple dozen wild hogs using patched round balls fired from .50 and .54 New Englander guns. Those .50 and .54 round balls kill just as dead as any center fire rifle i've ever used.

i generally refuse to shoot hogs and deer in the shoulder. Sometimes take a high shoulder shot on deer: When done right the deer bang flops.

 

[Zonie]

To all

Please limit your discussions to muzzleloading guns , lead slugs and patched roundballs.

After all, those are what the Forum is all about.

Thanks

Zonie (Jim)

 

[inthex]

Sounds to me like Spence is having more fun. If ta deer drops or ta jug explodes and your enjoying your self then have at it!

 

[George]

I went squirrel hunting this morning, and decided to add a little data to my experiment. I should have shot an empty jug as a control before I blasted the water filled ones, so I did that, today. I used the same load, .600" ball over 85 grains Goex 3F, but instead of shooting at 50 yards I just stepped off about 7. The results are what I expected, a clean entrance hold and a clean exit hole, no explosion, no blowing up from the inside.

Entrance without water:


Exit without water:


And this is what typically happened with water:


The ball should be still traveling about 200 fps faster than when I shot the water filled jugs.

Spence

 

[Wes/Tex]

Still just a matter of the hydrostatic shock to tissue high in liquid! :wink:

 

[MJMarkey]

A very simple analogy:

Little kid barely able to get a heavy bowling ball started down an alley...but if it stays out of the gutter and finally reaches the pins, it continues to plow right on into them.

I was bowling once and a little kid rolled the ball and after a time the ball hit the head pin and STOPPED. I couldn't believe it. Swear it's true.

 

[larry wv]

I bet that doesn't happen very often. :grin:

Larry

 

[nkbj]

Testing with jugs of water to produce shock. http://vid791.photobucket.com/albums/yy192/SNARGLEFLERK/NewEnglanderTesting_zps22134406.mp4