Nipple "really" frozen!

[Nor Cal Mikie]

Got a TC Hawken and it looks as someone built it,never finished it, fired it and never cleaned it! :cursing:
Got the rust out of the barrel as best I could but the nipple is frozen. Rust around the hammer/nipple area leads me to believe that it was fired and not cleaned.
Couple of questions.
Can I apply heat to the nipple block? Freed up lots of frozen bolts that way.
Can the block be removed from the barrel?
It's stuck too! :cursing: Started to round the flats so I quit!
If I can heat the nipple/block area I might be able to free it up.(the nipple that is.)
And the nipple is plugged! When I started cleaning the barrel it was somwhat clear.
I popped 2 caps on it and it's plugged!
I suspect the burn channel is rusted too.
Soak with penetrating oil for a week or so?
Ideas and opinions please.(and thank you)

 

[Ridge]

The first thing that I would do is soak it in Kroil...if that doesn't losen it then you can rule out penetrating oil.

 

[user 2647]

You could use heat as a last resort, why not give the post on electolysis for bore rust removal a look. Hope you can get it cleaned out. :thumbsup:

 

[Blizzard of '93]

if certaqin there is no charge in it then heat the nipple and while still hot apply oil. let it set a few and tap with a small hammer firmly a few times and repeat. when cool give it a try.

 

[Nor Cal Mikie]

If it "had" a charge in it, it's dead now! :wink:
I ran a couple of cans of lube in it with scratch pads and steel wool to remove the rust in the barrel. On and off all day! Got it as clean as I could. If I can get the nipple out of it I'll go after the barrel again.
Need to shoot it to see if the barrel is worth a hoot!
Once the nipple is out I'll go after the burn channel. I suspect it's loaded with rust too. :cursing:

 

[silverfox]

I'm working on the same problem except the rust is old enough to be patina. The rifle a 1865 springfield. I've been hitting it with kroil for 2 weeks now without any sign of it coming loose. A few more days and will try the heat treatment. Let us know if you get yours loose first.
Fox :hatsoff:

 

[Bubba45]

After you are sure that it isnt loaded, you can heat the nipple with a propane torch and touch a candle to the nipple and heat it .The wax will work into the threads and while still warm you should be able to back out the nipple.

 

[J.D.]

Can I apply heat to the nipple block? Freed up lots of frozen bolts that way.
Can the block be removed from the barrel?
It's stuck too! :cursing: Started to round the flats so I quit!
If I can heat the nipple/block area I might be able to free it up.(the nipple that is.)
And the nipple is plugged! When I started cleaning the barrel it was somwhat clear.

I popped 2 caps on it and it's plugged!
I suspect the burn channel is rusted too.
Soak with penetrating oil for a week or so?
Ideas and opinions please.(and thank you)

Do not try to remove the breech plug. Its not made to remove. The nipple should come out with judicious use of alternating heat and penetrating oil. The process can take several weeks.

I suggest that you make sure this gun is not loaded prior to applying heat. Heat + loaded gun = bad accident
J.D.

 

[pegesus59]

Try PB Blaster. It is available at Wal-Mart and Auto Parts stores. Just follow the instructions on the can. We have used it numerous times, and always seems to work.

 

[xxgrampa]

greetings no cal,

if it is an older tc, the breach block was made to be removed. the way to tell is, if the breach block clean out has a slot for a screw driver or for an allen wrench it is removable.

the newer tc's have the cleanout ground flush with the block. there is no way to remove the cleanout or block.

if it is an old one. clamp the bbl in a padded vise, use a big padded wrench on the plug and unscrew.

have about a dozen of the old ones. two cresant wrenchs always removed the breach plug with out a pblm.

good luck and ..ttfn..grampa..

 

[410-er]

PB Blaster eats rust!

 

[walruskid1]

did you drop a rod down the barrel, mark it and then hold it on the outside to verify that it was really empty?

 

[jdixon]

All of the suggestions listed here may work and should be tried first. If all else fails you may have to drill out the frozen nipple. Use a drill bit that is slightly larger than the barrel of the nipple itself. Using a drill press, drill down the center of the nipple through to the bottom, then insert something into the enlarged hold and attempt to twist the remaining portion of the nipple out. If that didn't do it, step up another 1/64th" and drill it again. Keep doing this until you get all of the nipple out. You may then have to re-tap the threads. I have used this method successfully on nipples frozen in pistol cylinders, no reason to believe it would not work here so long as you can access the nipple location with a drill.

 

[Nor Cal Mikie]

I'am headed to the range today to do a little "male bonding" and let the guys check out the "new toy". Might swing by the shop on the way home and warm the nipple area up with a torch.
Or, I might drill the nipple so I can drop it in a tank and let the "electricity" do a little rust removal.
Not in a hurry so I'll do more thinking on it. :hmm:
If I can get the nipple clear, weather it's drilled or removed, that will let the cleaning solution get into the barrel/nipple area and do a better job at getting at the rust.
Don't expect it to be a easy job to remove the nipple either way.
On the rust removal with the battery charger, does anyone know if a "trickle charger" will work for power? Less power will take longer but get the job done? Anybody "been there,done that"?
And I really appreciate all your input. Thanks.
I'll keep you posted with the results. :wink:

 

[spottedpony]

On the rust removal with the battery charger, does anyone know if a "trickle charger" will work for power? Less power will take longer but get the job done? Anybody "been there,done that"?
And I really appreciate all your input. Thanks.
I'll keep you posted with the results. :wink:

Ive used EER for rust removal for lots of things through the years, and found at least an 8 or 10 amp charger is the minimum. I use my 200 amp charger set to 40 amps with good results.
A lot of good info can be found on this procedure, just google "Electrolytic Rust Removal"
and per some articles, be sure to do this outside or at least where theres good ventilation. According to what ive read in some articles, it does produce flammable gas.

 

[Mulebrain]

The nipple on the barrel I was socking the juice to was frozen as well! After 12 hours I tried it, and it came free :wink:
[url] http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/211267/[/url]

Need a charger capable of at least two amps constant dc

 

[bwhoffman]

Mike,
all said and done, If you end up somewhat oversized on the hole, Dixie has oversized nipples in their catalog.
leave the breech on, its not really made to be removable.
the clean out hole, you can always re-tap and go up in size, its really a plug from drilling the snail/drum for the fire channel.
There are some great ideas here and persistance will win in the long run!
you can also try a left handed pitch drill bit. often the reverse twist along with the heat generated by the drilling, will back out stuck bolts/screws.
another fyi....antique tractor restores often "unstick" frozen motors by pouring "CocaCola" in the cylinders. the acidic value does something to the rust.

 

[Nor Cal Mikie]

Brian: I checked out your post and it really looks like it might get the job done. :thumbsup:
I also have "left handed drill bits" if it comes to that. I'll take my time and see what it takes to get the nipple out. Don't want to damage anything else. Thanks guys.

 

[MercerLake]

:v Try dabbing a little "Blue and Rust Remover" solution to the the nipple or just pour it down the barrel if you want to preserve the Blued finish of the barrel exterior.
Use Coca-Cola or a 10% Nitric acid solution down the barrel, the acid will not harm the clean barrel steel it only atacks rust and bluing. If you use the nitric solution use rubber gloves or it will etch your fingers. :grin: The Coca-Cola has Phosphoric acid which is the main ingredient in the Blue and Rust Remover, that's why your stomach doesn't rust! :hmm:

 

[Dave K]

J.R. and brett sr., I agree 100%. Been there and done that. I am not worried about the expense of the nipple, just getting it out of the gun. Many times as I carefully drill them out, I get to the point where I can collapse what nipple is left. Also, go to a Harbor Frieght store and buy some left handed drills. Sometimes, they will work real well getting stuck things, unstuck. I would prefer not to use heat and injure the bluing if possible.