MVT French Model 1733 Pistol

[Tom Carr]

Jacklord:

Make sure your gunsmith knows the in's and out's or black powder and flintlocks.

Many gunsmiths are quite good at working with modern guns but they don't know squat about flintlocks and what it takes to shoot them.

Also, there is practically no published information on what the correct proof charge for a muzzleloading pistol is. In fact, except for the published information in the Dixie Gunworks Catalog I know of no other.
(see STANDARD MUZZLELOADING CHARGES,
1887 MUZZLELOADING PROOF LOADS
Provisional Proof, Definitive Proof )

Those proof charges appear to be intended for shotguns, not pistols so they may be much more than what is really needed.

For instance, a .710 caliber(13 guage) charge that is listed is 328 grains of powder under a 493 grain bullet for the Provisional Proof! :shocked2:
It shows a powder charge of 178 grains under 729 grains (1 2/3 oz) of shot as the Definitive Proof for the 13 guage and a Service Load of 89 grains of powder under 547 grains (1 1/4 oz) of shot.

Obviously not a pistol load.

Anything I say is just a wild guess about the proper load for your pistol but, if I were guessing I would think of the following:

A large number of the Definitive Proof loads they show for the powder charge are twice the service powder charge load.
The projectile of the Definitive Proof loads are 1.333 times the service load.

As getting a projectile that weighs 1.333 times the service weight of the projectile for your gun might be almost impossible I would suggest that you have the gunsmith test your gun using twice the load that you will ever use, using 3Fg powder under a tightly patched service ball that you intend to shoot.
While this is a little less than a real Definitive Proof load would be it is probably more than enough to test the safety of your gun.

By the way, from what I've read many times this Proof test will be conducted twice on a gun, the second time using slightly less powder to make sure the first test didn't do any invisible damage to the barrel. The slightly reduced powder charge was intended to test the gun without fully stressing it repeatedly.

An example of this for your pistol is if you never intend to use over 40 grains of powder under a roundball as a service charge I would test the
gun with an 80 grain powder load once and a 75 grain powder load for the second test.

I would also stress the need for the gunsmith to fully clean the barrel and to test it with a penetrating fluorescent dye following each part of the test.
If no cracks appear in the barrel it should be safe to shoot with a 40 grain charge.

Thanks Zonie! Lots of good advice. I'll print this out and give it to whatever gunsmith I get to do the job.

 

[Tom Carr]

I found a couple of links that pertain to this discussion.
A French site with the same pistols as can be had at Middlesex Trading but with excellent pictures with different angles. You get an idea of fit and finish from these. If mine is as nice as these, I dont think I will have any real complaints. http://www.armae.com/Zanglais/contemporain/14xixxxsieclecadre.htm

The second is someone firing a replica French 69cal handgun, though it doesnt look like one of the models on either site. Does a lot of buck and ball and I assume a heavy loading of 80 grains of powder. http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=TYyz1FdcBfo

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

I don't know what pistol they copied, but that looks about as much like a 1733 French cavalry pistol as a mule resembles a racehorse. As a generic early to mid eighteenth century pistol of indeterminate origin it might pass muster--except they probably used teak or rosewood for the stock. A very dark refinishing job should help with that but it's still going to be way too heavy.

 

[Tom Carr]

Yeah that 1733 model didnt really look right to me either. The long sea service model I have coming looks much more like the what you find in Neumann's "Weapons of the American Revolution".
Wont be able to tell anything till it shows though. Im keeping my fingers crossed.