Frizzen resistance?

[guncobbler]

I have an L&R lock on an ERA fowler kit and I'm not getting a great shower of sparks. Looking at the frizzen face I can see where the flint strikes the frizzen about half way done the face. The flint seems to scrape along the face for less than 1/4 inch before the frizzen gets kicked out of the way. There is also a little scrape about 1/3 to 3/8 below the first scrape making me think that the frizzen bounce back and gets hit a second time. Is there a way the frizzen can be slowed down to hold it in contact with the flint longer? Would a stronger frizzen spring do that? Thanks, GC

 

[Le Grand]

GC, Are you sure that's an L&R lock? I ask that only because L&R's stuff usually works real well.
Okay, with the lock at half-cock, does the flint just about touch the frizzen? If not, the flint is too short and that will cause it to hit lower on the frizzen. Also, most L&R locks are designed to have the flint put in the jaws of the cock with the bevel up, or the sharp side of the flint on the downward side. Give us a few more details with your come-back and be just a little more specific about things. Le Grand

 

[paulvallandigham]

Are you wrapping the flint in soft leather in the jaws? That would account for the bouncing, or rebounding of the flint and the gap in the scrape marks you see. Try using lead to wrap the flint, and see if that doesn't help the lock spark better, and the scrape to go all the way down the face of the frizzen, beginning about 2/3 of the way up from the bottom.

Use a plastice protractor, to measure the angle where the edge of the flint hits the face of the frizzen. The base line should be along the bottom of that cutting ege of the flint, bevel up. The angle line is done putting a straight edge from the point where the edge touches the flint and running it up to the inside edge at the top of the face of the frizzen. A proper angle is between 55 and 60 Degrees. If the angle is smaller or larger than those, the bottom jaw of the cock needs to be moved to correct that angle. With the correct angle, and a correct length flint, the flint will scrape steel off the face, and not gouge it out of the face, shattering the flint, and leaving grooves in the frizzen face.

 

[guncobbler]

Thanks Paul - I did have a softer piece of leather in the jaws and replaced it with a harder thinner one. That improved the spark a little. The angle of strike on the frizzen bevel down is maybe 75 or 80 degrees and strikes 60% up the face, bevel up it in the 55-60 range but only strikes half way down. I'm going to check with the L&R folks to see if they can replace the frizzen. Don't think it should be gouged up like this. If they can't I'll pull out the can of Kasenite. Thanks, GC

 

[paulvallandigham]

I am surprised to hear those angles on an L& R Lock. That has not been my experience or observation. Did you put the flint in the jaw bevel down? That wouldexplain the more direct angle. When you mount the flint in the jaw, the bottom surface of the flint should be parallel with the line of the bottom jaw. The bevel- the angled surface on one side of the flint, leading from the top flat to the edge of the flint - should be up, or on the top side of the flint as you look down at it in the jaws.

Once in awhile, a supplier get a non-hardened frizzen through inspection, and gets in a lock. It happens to all the companies that job out the casting or forging operations to subcontractors. Only the inhouse operators are likely to escape this problem. If you are getting sparks, I don't think the frizzen is soft.

 

[guncobbler]

Hi Paul - I sent the lock to L & R after speaking with Tim. Just got it back. They rehardened the frizzen and it is noticibly harder when I touch it with a file. The file teeth don't dig in 1/2 as much. Tim's note stated that this was the Queen Anne lock and that they often gouge right where the flint initially strikes. The lock does spark better. I see more of the sparks that blossom after they have flown two inches or so. Before reheating the sparks looked more like what you get from cold rolled steel on the bench grinder. I still get the chatter with the harder leather so I'll try mounting the flints with some soft lead. The flint bounces away from the frizzen and doesn't reconnect for almost 1/4 inch of downward travel. The following marks still show some bounce so hopefully the lead will stop that too. Flinters sure are fun! Just remembered that I have pounds of lead dental Xray backer that is shaped almost perfect for this. Let you know how that works our. GC

 

[LRB]

Just something to think about. L&R and Chambers, will not warranty their locks if you use lead for your flint.