Don't Carve That Stock!

[Comfortably_Numb]

Would you really want to be part of a club that would have you as a member?

BTW when is the next meeting of the sarcastic old bastards club? I did not see you at the last one.

I've been busy running the crabby old man club. It's a tough job.

 

[Compressorguy]

...Unless you are good at it.
I've seen a lot of well made rifles, some even with very nice metal engravings, but then come the photos of the cheek piece or whatever, with some terribly done carvings (or more like attempts at carving).
Bad carving can absolutely ruin your fine gun.
Take the time to develop the skill, know your skill level and proceed with caution. It's better to leave it plain sometimes, honestly.
Cheers.

Redirecting

I really, really wanted to try my hand at relief carving on this “rebuild” but took your advice Pathfinder and didn’t attempt to carve it. I have pretty good confidence in most of my building skills but carving isn’t one of them (yet). Hopefully I can practice drawing and carving on some scrap before ruining a perfectly good build or rebuild, lol. Plus i think with the silver barrel pin inlays, the silver acorn, the modified silver entry pipe and fire blued screws are “enough” and just decided to keep it simple. Sometimes less is more? I’m sure I’ll try carving at some point but not until I’m comfortable and proficient that I won’t ruin a lot of work!

 

[PathfinderNC]

Redirecting

I really, really wanted to try my hand at relief carving on this “rebuild” but took your advice Pathfinder and didn’t attempt to carve it. I have pretty good confidence in most of my building skills but carving isn’t one of them (yet). Hopefully I can practice drawing and carving on some scrap before ruining a perfectly good build or rebuild, lol. Plus i think with the silver barrel pin inlays, the silver acorn, the modified silver entry pipe and fire blued screws are “enough” and just decided to keep it simple. Sometimes less is more? I’m sure I’ll try carving at some point but not until I’m comfortable and proficient that I won’t ruin a lot of work!

View attachment 257229

I would love to see the rest of that rifle- from that little glimpse it looks good! I totally agree that “ less is more” in many instances. And a fine looking rifle is a poor choice to practice untrained carving skills on, in my humble opinion. Cheers

 

[LSB]

I've been busy running the crabby old man club. It's a tough job.

The rest of us crabby old men appreciate your efforts. Keep up the good work.

 

[Snooterpup]

What is happening in this world. Is there no middle ground on any subject. It seems to me that whatever the topic is anymore, it has to become a pi$$ing match and name calling. Can't one simply respectfully disagree. When these topics turn hateful, it becomes unenjoyable kind of like watching the news.

Comedian John Cleese said something to the effect of ‘There are way too many people out there just waiting for the thrill of being offended.’
My opinion is all of this has exploded exponentially since covid and the last two years of of stellar guidance.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Those that want to carve should consider taking a carving class. There are several offered by several different very talented gun makers.

 

[oreclan]

I'll refrain from being judgemental about other's work, especially if I can't do it myself.

I don't want to be part of that snob club........

I think anyone who has studied carving on guns, even if they are novices or non-carvers can appreciate those that are well done. There are some originals that I don't like. I think observing the Golden Mean in Rococo Art is very important.

I have been carving wood since I was a Boy Scout, in fact I still have my neckerchief slides, but I am a novice at carving gunstocks. It's all in the planning, drawing and three dimensional finish with chisels and scrapers; but most importantly patience.

 

[Snooterpup]

Redirecting

I really, really wanted to try my hand at relief carving on this “rebuild” but took your advice Pathfinder and didn’t attempt to carve it. I have pretty good confidence in most of my building skills but carving isn’t one of them (yet). Hopefully I can practice drawing and carving on some scrap before ruining a perfectly good build or rebuild, lol. Plus i think with the silver barrel pin inlays, the silver acorn, the modified silver entry pipe and fire blued screws are “enough” and just decided to keep it simple. Sometimes less is more? I’m sure I’ll try carving at some point but not until I’m comfortable and proficient that I won’t ruin a lot of work!

View attachment 257229

More photos please!

 

[IanH]

Not really true. It's not about whether they are published or not, but rather if they exist. When you study these in person and don't just rely on books you'll see that most have at least a bit of decoration.

It IS about whether they are published or not if you live 2000 miles from Pennsylvania and are limited to published data for research. I don't have the advantage of a lifetime of immersion in the history and industry that you and Mike and so many others have, so in a way we on these boards rely on solid input from folks like you who have a much broader perspective of reality as history as it is left to us versus what others choose to publish....or not publish....or may not even be aware of.

 

[Compressorguy]

I would love to see the rest of that rifle- from that little glimpse it looks good!

Thanks Pathfinder! Not wanting to hijack your thread but since you’re the OP and you asked. Here’s the link to my recent post with pic’s of this pistol.

Please everyone DO NOT reply to this here(not that you would), it’s Pathfinders OP and should stay on topic. You are more than welcome to reply to my post linked below if you like.

https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/pedersoli-kit-build-then-rebuild.169920/

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

It IS about whether they are published or not if you live 2000 miles from Pennsylvania and are limited to published data for research. I don't have the advantage of a lifetime of immersion in the history and industry that you and Mike and so many others have, so in a way we on these boards rely on solid input from folks like you who have a much broader perspective of reality as history as it is left to us versus what others choose to publish....or not publish....or may not even be aware of.

I got this thing called a truck. I get in it and drive to where the gun shows are. I have been doing it for years.

 

[Kmcmichael]

I got this thing called a truck. I get in it and drive to where the gun shows are. I have been doing it for years.

Good, get yer old carcass in it and drive to Texas. I am sure you could drum up some other lost souls to take a carving class and likely you can supplement your other profession of demonic possession, not the exorcism but the initial action.

 

[TDM]

it would be awesome if Mike @Comfortably_Numb could/would do a carving class closer to home. Wouldn't mind driving 4 or 5 hours if I had too.

 

[CuNosecap]

You guys crack me up!

 

[James Kibler]

It IS about whether they are published or not if you live 2000 miles from Pennsylvania and are limited to published data for research. I don't have the advantage of a lifetime of immersion in the history and industry that you and Mike and so many others have, so in a way we on these boards rely on solid input from folks like you who have a much broader perspective of reality as history as it is left to us versus what others choose to publish....or not publish....or may not even be aware of.

What I was saying is that whether a certain style of gun is published or not is not necessarily an indication of how prevalent they were in the period. So again, I'm saying most guns of the period had at least a little decoration.

Whether you have access to them is beyond the scope of my comment.

 

[Hatman/2nd line]

I'm just a mediocre builder and did the carving on this rifle, not the best but I did it!

 

[Hatman/2nd line]

Thanks Pathfinder!

 

[54ball]

I guess I’ll comment.

The solution or answer to to all this is rather simple.
Study the material culture of the period. Do not make the Colonial-Federal era into a 1980s trailer park.

90% of the comments and 99% of the soapboxes would not exist on this thread if there was a basic knowledge of period material culture.

Some great makers such as Isaac Haines, did make make very plain rifle. It’s featured in the RCA books and most good building books.
Was it the norm? Probably not but it exists.

The Haines rifle mentioned has incredible architecture. If you get the architecture right you can have a very nice rifle.

People want it and they want it now. People expect to pick up a chisel and be Isaac Haines. It does not work that way.
If want to carve the gun. Learn what period carving actually is. Then learn how to do it.
Classes
Gun shows
Books
Study
Videos
Or how about this
Learn how to draw it then learn how to carve it. It’s just wood. It grows on trees.

Then there what I call architectural embellishments.....
Fore stock moulding
Butt stock moulding
Beaver tails
If you can do that you do a little bit of incised gee-gaws behind the cheek.....or not.

Yes most period rifles had some decoration.
Gain the skill do it.... or not.

Let’s not forget....
J.P. Beck stole Isaac Haines lunch money.

 

[Coinneach]

I guess I’ll comment.

The solution or answer to to all this is rather simple.
Study the material culture of the period. Do not make the Colonial-Federal era into a 1980s trailer park.

90% of the comments and 99% of the soapboxes would not exist on this thread if there was a basic knowledge of period material culture.

Some great makers such as Isaac Haines, did make make very plain rifle. It’s featured in the RCA books and most good building books.
Was it the norm? Probably not but it exists.

The Haines rifle mentioned has incredible architecture. If you get the architecture right you can have a very nice rifle.

People want it and they want it now. People expect to pick up a chisel and be Isaac Haines. It does not work that way.
If want to carve the gun. Learn what period carving actually is. Then learn how to do it.
Classes
Gun shows
Books
Study
Videos
Or how about this
Learn how to draw it then learn how to carve it. It’s just wood. It grows on trees.

Then there what I call architectural embellishments.....
Fore stock moulding
Butt stock moulding
Beaver tails
If you can do that you do a little bit of incised gee-gaws behind the cheek.....or not.

Yes most period rifles had some decoration.
Gain the skill do it.... or not.

Let’s not forget....
J.P. Beck stole Isaac Haines lunch money.

Thank you for your detailed post, I'm starting a left hand Jim Chambers Isaac Haines kit and appreciate your input advice.

 

[Nazgul58]

I've been busy running the crabby old man club. It's a tough job.

And you are doing a great job!

My application for membership is in the mail, my wife and her mom wrote the recommendation ...

Don