Ball/patch confusion.

[John May]

I went to the range today with my Ardesa Underhammer to check out some different load combinations for an upcoming competition and realised when I got there that I had packed the wrong size patches. It's a .40 caliber and I use either a .395 swaged RB or a .390 cast RB both with a 20 thou patch. All I had was a pack of 10 thou patches.
Rather than miss the opportunity to shoot I used the 10 thou patches with some surprising results.
The balls started easily without using a mallet and I expected poor groups but amazingly I shot 3 of the best cards ever with a high score of 95 and superb groups.
The general consensus at my range is the thicker the patch the tighter the group and ideally the ball should show signs of weave imprint from the patch.
I picked up a few of the shot patches and there were a couple with minor signs of blow-by but nothing serious.
My question is, was this a fluke or has anyone else an opinion about ball patch fit?

 

[cynthialee]

I suspect that it is a shooter thing rather than a patch thing.

You didn't expect to do well with the "undersized" patch. There was no pressure on you so you just shot to shoot. Without the pressure to shoot good you got outside of your head and the need to worry about everything and zen shooting resulted.

 

[bpd303]

It wasn't a fluke. All of my patched ball pistols shoot better and more accurate with a thinner patch that I can thumb start. A couple do like a filler like cream of wheat though.

 

[biliff]

Not sure why, maybe the lower powder charges, but my pistols all shoot very well with a "loose" ball patch combination, at least compared with a rifle.

 

[Zonie]

As you know, using a tight ball/patch combination is commonly done with rifles.

These tight loads do a good job of sealing the high gas pressure that comes from the large powder charges rifles often use.

Rifles are big and heavy and starting these tight ball/patch loads isn't much of a problem.
The mass of the rifle will absorb the shock from short starting the ball and the rifles size makes grasping it during loading easy.
It also has a stock that can easily transmit the forces needed to load it directly to the ground (or a padded surface)without damaging it.

None of this is true with a muzzleloading pistol.

They are small so they don't have much mass. Their grip is not designed to take the shock of starting and loading a tight fitting ball/patch and more than a few pistol grips have been broken by those who tried resting their pistol on its grip while loading.

Pistols typically use light powder loads that don't need tight sealing patches like the rifles.

Using a thin .010 thick patch is often enough to give very good accuracy and the reduced loading force needed to load it makes it unnecessary to rest the grip on a hard surface.
Using a one hand grasp on the barrel is often enough to get the job done.

 

[Wes/Tex]

Never say never when it comes to muzzle loaders! Just when you think you know all the answers, they'll prove you wrong. This is the very reason I encourage all shooters to try different patch thicknesses, lube and material. I've seen two identical guns from Pedersoli within 100 serial numbers of each other require totally different patches to work properly!

 

[John May]

I certainly did feel that this would just be an opportunity to practice trigger release and not worry too much about good scores, all I need to do now is to get into that 'zone' every time I shoot!!

 

[Rifleman1776]

As often happens Necci sez it all before I do. Tight patching and heavy charges are not necessary with pistols.

 

[Billnpatti]

My opinion is that you need to shoot whatever your particular gun likes. Obviously, your gun likes the thinner patches. Stick with them and whatever ball and powder charge works best for your particular gun. These muzzleloading guns are like children in that each seems to have its own preferences. Feed it what it likes and it will help you bring home the prizes and ribbons.

 

[cmdrted]

"without using a mallet "
This may be your answer also. having to bang on that ball can cause a deformity on the nose that would show up as bad groups.

 

[F.G. Ford]

Hi,
Also try a lubed wad ( dry ) over the powder, it will prevent patch blow by, and reduce stress on the patch, and also will swab the barrel between shots.
Fred