I was just looking at the auction catalog of an auction in town that is going to have an Albert Greener double barrel shotgun made in London. There is a good chance it would go for under $300. Would it be ok to shoot? I just don't know if people actually shoot those antique guns.
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Anyone Shoot Original Shotguns?
- Thread starter luieb45
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paulvallandigham
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It all depends on the condition of the gun. Some can be shot, and are. Others are wall-hangers. You generally get what you pay for. If a Greener were in good condition to shoot, it would be expected to go for much more than $300.00. And, then, the owner would not shoot it!
On the other hand, this may be a Damascus steel barreled gun, which until very recently, folks were told to never shoot. The "Common Advice" was that any Damascus Steel barrel was too weak and unreliable to trust to shooting. Recent testing, with results published in the Double Gun Journal these past couple of Quarterly issues, indicate that the Damascus steel barrels actually can take much higher pressures than previously believed, and that even those with obvious rust can be shot, and repaired.
Who'd A Thunk it????? :idunno:
On the other hand, this may be a Damascus steel barreled gun, which until very recently, folks were told to never shoot. The "Common Advice" was that any Damascus Steel barrel was too weak and unreliable to trust to shooting. Recent testing, with results published in the Double Gun Journal these past couple of Quarterly issues, indicate that the Damascus steel barrels actually can take much higher pressures than previously believed, and that even those with obvious rust can be shot, and repaired.
Who'd A Thunk it????? :idunno:
I don't know how to put a link on here but you can see the gun by going to sullivanauctioneers.com then go down to the auction scheduled for January 18 and the gun is on that first page. I am not really totally trying to get this gun no matter what, but if it goes for somewhere around 200 and somethin' I'd take it. It will probably go cheaper than usual due to the lack of muzzleloading interest in the area and the fact that it will be a pretty lame gun auction compared to most.
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Mike Brooks
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I shoot an original SXS flint gun made circa 1810.
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I have an 1850's cap lock that I shoot some. It's a nice gun.
$300 seems "too good to be true", much as I respect William Greener.
$300 seems "too good to be true", much as I respect William Greener.
no, it is an albert greener shotgun. At the last auction over there I am still kicking myself about not buying the pedersoli double 12 gauge they had because it went for under $300 and was in excellent shape. I don't think I'll try to buy that original anymore because it does sound like a ton of responsibility.
JayDee Flohr
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Glad I never heard that advice. Of course I wouldn't of paid it no never mind anyway. :shake: It was always common knowledge around my neck of the woods to not shoot modern loads in the breech loading damascus barreled guns. Never any trouble with black powder loads in either kind. I'm glad the "experts" over at the gun journal now give those of us that have been shooting them for decades the ok to use them. :thumbsup:
As for using an original........if it's a quality gun with decent bores, get it and shoot it! The only difference between it and a reproduction is that the bores won't be as shiny and smooth and will take a few more patches to clean.
If it were me, I'd buy it if the price is right and enjoy hunting with a gun our forefathers used.
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Under $300? I saw that one, too. I noticed how the prices for the initial bids were low on a lot of guns, but then I also know that those auctions do attract people with some gun smarts but not wallet smarts. Your chances of getting that gun for under $300 are about as good as the snow melting here by tomorrow! :v:
Did you notice that they had a Colt Lightning listed as a rough Colt?
The Doc is out now. :v
Did you notice that they had a Colt Lightning listed as a rough Colt?
The Doc is out now. :v
JayDee Flohr
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Nice looking piece :thumbsup:
Here's my current two row...........
1860's English 16 bore.
Here's my current two row...........
1860's English 16 bore.
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I just got back a .12 ga. percussion that I think was from about the 1850's from a friend who was checking it for me. I got it years ago from a fellow who gave it to me to restore. I did a cosmetic restoration but not an internal. The tumbler was shot and there was no half-cock. The friend and another fellow put a replacement tumbler in, checked out the barrel and pronounced it sound. Then they broke the mainspring. In making a replacement, they could not get the gun to cock. That was just a matter of adding material to the sear where the spring meets it and then filing it down. That worked and now I am waiting for some shot to load it.
I figure it will also take a round ball, too, but I have not gone that far with it yet.
Have to take a photo of it one of these days.
The Doc is out now. :v
I figure it will also take a round ball, too, but I have not gone that far with it yet.
Have to take a photo of it one of these days.
The Doc is out now. :v
Unfortunately it is the internal condition of the bore that matters. I've had a couple of old originals which looked pretty good on the outside but when running wads down the bore it would become very loose and have a gravely feel about 6" from the bottom. I think it is quite common to find the bores eaten up by corrosion near the breech as a result of the old corrosive caps.
Fifty years ago one could pick up "ordinary" side by side muzzleloaders for 25-30 bucks at any gun show. Of course those days are gone and those guns, which may have seen little use before being replaced by breechloaders, have now seen another fifty years of use and the guy who bought it for $25 may not have treated it as a prized possession. My dad had one of those $25 guns and it shot great. Then one day he was letting a friend shoot it and when he fired the left barrel he let out a holler and started inspecting his left hand. A tiny rust pit had blown out and blew rusted metal and powder fouling into his skin. There was just a 1/16" hole in the barrel.
Those old guns, even the cheap Belgium made guns, were as well built as anything today, but I wouldn't buy an original with the intention of shooting it unless I could closely examine the condition of the bores.
Fifty years ago one could pick up "ordinary" side by side muzzleloaders for 25-30 bucks at any gun show. Of course those days are gone and those guns, which may have seen little use before being replaced by breechloaders, have now seen another fifty years of use and the guy who bought it for $25 may not have treated it as a prized possession. My dad had one of those $25 guns and it shot great. Then one day he was letting a friend shoot it and when he fired the left barrel he let out a holler and started inspecting his left hand. A tiny rust pit had blown out and blew rusted metal and powder fouling into his skin. There was just a 1/16" hole in the barrel.
Those old guns, even the cheap Belgium made guns, were as well built as anything today, but I wouldn't buy an original with the intention of shooting it unless I could closely examine the condition of the bores.
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That is why I gave it to the friend. He makes and shoots his own guns. He has the tools (bore scope, gauges, etc...), that I don't have, to check the bore. He says he would shoot it, and if he would, it will be good enough for me. Apparently the bore was not as bad as I thought it might be after a century.
There are only three things missing on it at the moment, all cosmetic. A button for the ramrod, (and maybe a hickory ramrod), a front sight, and a screw to hold in one side of a barrel pin plate on the stock.
I've got to take a photo of it one of these days.
The Doc is out now. :v
There are only three things missing on it at the moment, all cosmetic. A button for the ramrod, (and maybe a hickory ramrod), a front sight, and a screw to hold in one side of a barrel pin plate on the stock.
I've got to take a photo of it one of these days.
The Doc is out now. :v
Sure do shoot original shotguns all the time. Both perc. and flint. The condition of the gun is paramount, not really who made it. Another thing about barrels, a good barrel is a good barrel. I really don't care how it is made as long as it is good. I realize that may sound silly,but for years Damascus,Laminated,Twist barrels, otherwise known as composite barrels got a bad rap. If these barrels are in good condition, they are good barrels and can shoot the loads that they were designed to shoot. Barrel makers of the time wanted the buying public to shy away from these barrels as they were expensive to make and the fluid barrels were cheaper and therefore more profitable to make. Now dangerously pitted, corroded barrels are not safe and I don't care how they were made either. Rust is rust, damaged is damaged. Just use good barrels as they were designed. Below are original guns that are in action. The first is a late 1700's 20ga. flinter, then there are the 14ga. and the 12ga. of probably around mid 1800's.
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Very interesting colors there on the rear of the barrels of that percussion double, Dave. :thumbsup:
The Doc is out now. :v
The Doc is out now. :v
Mike Brooks
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That is a nice one Mike. I have a real problem not loving a SxS flinter. I have an original one on the bench now. It is very similiar to the flinter with the doves in the top picture. If I was a betting man, I would say it even came from the same shop. Probably late 1700's to real early 1800's. It is a 20ga. with 38" barrels. The original locks were converted to perc. but I have a new pair of flint locks with a little welding, etc. will drop right in to the original mortice with no changes, except to the locks. I sure hope to have her ready for at least next dove season.
Mike Brooks
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I need to finish the barrels on the one above, it has beautiful thumb print figured damascus, just like the high grade lC Smith guns of a 100 years later.
I have two fixer upper flint doubles around here, one by SWALLOW that needs converted back to flint and another in a box by H.NOCK that needs converted and a stock. both are 20 bores.the pictured gun above is a 18 bore and has a cheek piece.
I have two fixer upper flint doubles around here, one by SWALLOW that needs converted back to flint and another in a box by H.NOCK that needs converted and a stock. both are 20 bores.the pictured gun above is a 18 bore and has a cheek piece.
