20 Gauge Smoothbore Questions

[Swamp Buck]

I have a few questions about using a 20 gauge smoothbore muzzleloader.

I have ordered a Pennxylvania Fowler from Jim Chambers Flintlocks and can't wait for it to arrive so I can start working on it. Anyway, my question involves the correct or best wad/card and round ball diameters to buy/make and use.

I am figuring on using a .600" diameter roundball and ordering wads/cards of .625" diameter for a 20 gauge from Track of the Wolf.

If other sizes work best, please let me know.

 

[Le Grand]

You should be swamped with answers. Your selections sound just a bit tight to me but some 20 ga. barrels do like those sizes. Most of 'em, probably. Either way, you should try some .600 balls before getting a mold. Try 'em with some different patch thicknesses to find the best combination.

 

[Wayne/Al]

I'm in the process of trying to work up a load now for my 20 ga. fowler. I have found that the .600 ball with pillow ticking is really tight and not easy to start. I'm thinking about going to a smaller ball. One that I can thumb start.

My 12 ga. bore is.725" and I can use a .700" ball with pillow ticking for a patch and thumb start it.It shoots better groups than I can :wink: .

Good Luck with your fowler.

Wayne/Al

 

[Darkgael]

I use 20 gauge 0.125" nitro cards from Ballistic Products. Along with them I ordered some 1/2" hard card wads and some 1/4" felt wads. OS card on top.
Mostly two nitro cards work pretty well.
For RBs...I use .600 bare with a fouled bore. With ticking, I use .575 -.580, otherwise it's too tight.
Pete

 

[ronrryan]

I found a 595 ball and 18 ticking spit-patched shot very well. 600's were hard to start and had to use a thin patch, less accuracy. Never tried the bre ball .Good smoke, Ron

 

[Swamp Buck]

Thanks for the info. For starters I was going to order some .600 round balls from Track of the Wolf to see how those worked - probably with .015" patches. In the worst case, if those balls are too tight I can always melt them down. Track of the Wolf sells .595" diameter round balls but if that is the size the gun uses best I don't think that Lyman makes a mold for that size.

Anyway, I plan on using the gun with birdshot for the most part.

 

[Jason Lewis]

i ordered some .600 cast round balls from track and they weren't round. more egg shaped. otherwise i use .600 swaged ball with a .005 prelubed patch over a 1/2" fiber and 1/8" nitro from circle fly. shot is the same only i also use the 20ga OS from circle fly.

 

[Le Grand]

Lyman doesn't make near the mold sizes they used to have. But it is good that there are other mold makers than Lyman, good mold makers too.

 

[rabjr]

I would think the .595 ball would be about right. However you can get away with a thin patch by using something between the powder and prb. Like in my .12ga that has a .735 bore I cut the fiber wads in half and roll in bear grease, or whatever lube you use, I use that and a .015 bear greased patch around a .715 ball. Works great for me.

So you can go thin with the patch if you put a firewall, wad, between the powder and patch. :thumbsup:

 

[paulvallandigham]

Sorry. You are going to have to wait to actually have the barrel in hand, so that you can measure the bore yourself, to decide what size wads to buy. Same with RBs. My brother made the mistake of assuming all 20 gauge barrels would measure the nominal .615". NOT SO. It turned out the guns he had made for both of us have bores that measure almost 19 gauge- at .626-.627" The .600 balls he ordered are too small for best accuracy, and the 20 gauge wads were too small to hold properly. We ordered 19 gauge wads, and that has improved everything. We now have some .610" balls to try, and different thicknesses of pillow ticking to try with them.

There will be plenty of time to order wads and RBs after the gun arrives, while you are putting it together. SLOW DOWN, and wait. :thumbsup:

As to powder charges, someone here has shot some very terrific groups at 50 yds, using 60 grains of FFg powder behind his .600" RBs. I think its Greenmountainboy. There were some pictures of his groups posted a week or so, and you should be able to find them. He listed all his components of his RB loads. I meant to write them down, but can't seem to find any notes. Grrrrrr. Probably just a senior moment. :shocked2: :rotf: :grin: :thumbsup:

PS: I found the info I was referring to. Go here:
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/237331/fromsearch/1/tp/1/

for his load data.

 

[Le Grand]

Yes, wait on getting the balls for your 20. Or, if you must get some now, get some 595s. If those are a bit too small you can always use a thicker patch.

 

[scobrien]

Hey Swamp Buck. I got the Chambers smoothrifle last year and it is quickly becoming one of my favorite guns. I decided to go with 28ga. and the Long Hammock bbl. I hope you are well satisfied with the fowler when you get it done.
I suspect that most of the responses that you have gotten thus far are right on and that you may want to have the bbl. in hand to determine what size of ball/patch combo to try. Many smooth bores that I have been around get along fine with a .600 ball but some needed a smaller diameter including my own Caywood. I dropped down to a .595 for it with good success. I am getting ready to order a .585 diameter for my most recent purchase, a 20 ga. smoothrifle. One thing that I have found to work well for my own personal needs/requirements regarding patched ball in a smooth bore is to have at least a .015 patch. That thickness will absorb enough bear oil lube to keep fouling soft which ensures continuous shooting without the need to ever swab between shots. I found anything thinner to be lacking in that ability (especially .010, the thinnest material that I have ever tried.)
Regarding wads, I have found that the .625 fiber/cushion wads from Circle Fly are easily compressed into any 20 ga. bore regardless of the actual bore dimensions as are the .025 overshot cards. However, I have no personal experience with the .125 overpowder cards in a front stuffer and only use them in brass hulls utilized in breech loaders. I would say it is a safe bet to order 20 ga. Circle Fly fiber or over shot wads before you get the gun, but not so much regarding round balls.
Any way, good luck with the new gun and I hope you gets lots of opportunities to wear the frizzen down some!
Steve

 

[rwiliff]

Swamp Buck,

I've just started using .565 cast balls with a cotton duck patch. Used to use a .600 cast ball with a thin muslin patch. Both ways work just fine in my gun. Gun is a 20 gauge North Star West.

Warmest Regards,
Robert

 

[Ketchakah]

Hello,
I shoot a 20 bore exclusivley. I have found that .600 is a bit tight for my favor. I do use a patched ball instead of over under wads for ball and that will definetly make a differnce. You might be ok with O/U wads.
My mould is a 595 for patched ball. But have shot well with balls as small as .50 cal with a heavy patch. Your 20 bore will throw about anything with the right patching. I have shot pretty well with a .54 cal ball in a doubled patch. I am going to be tring some .58 cal balls.
There is alot of versitillty with them smoothys.
As Paul said, I too have had trouble with the "20 guage" wads. I will go with 19s should I buy any more. Most of the time i just use a wadded patch.

 

[29caliber]

In my 20 gauge fusil, the .595 roundball loaded easier and was less expensive than the .600, so I went with it. Using a .025 lubed pillow ticking patch, my groups were running around 3-4" at 25 yards until I put a lubed felt or fiber wad between the powder(60 grains Swiss 3F)and patched round ball. My groups then shrunk to a clover leaf. I've taken two deer with this load, one being at 60 yards. I'm now using a .595 bag mold and casting my own roundballs.

 

[squirejohn]

I have a Chambers PA fowler in which I use a .600 ball {Lyman mold} and about a .012 cotton duck patch lubed with either bear graese & beeswax or Stumpy's moose snot. I can thumb start this combo but it's a bit tight and if shooting over 10 or so shots I'll use a short starter.

 

[Tajue17]

where did you get the bear grease and stumpys moose snot, are those good in single digit temps????

also have any of you guys tried Montana pitch blend (all natural) which I used on my traditional archery gloves but I wonder how it would do as a patch lube in a smoothie?

 

[Ketchakah]

Thats Outstanding My friend,
I will have to give that a try. Ive been wanting to do some timkering with loads but havent been able to do that lately. I will try your idea. Thanks.

 

[cptleo1]

My Tulle just loads hard with most any patched ball load.

I use 1/2 a Crisco soaked fiber wad under a .610 ball with a little tow for patching to hold the ball in place.

Shoots all day long and loads easy.

Worth a try.

 

[squirejohn]

I got the bear fat from friends who shot bears. I rendered it down and mixed it with beeswax. In cold weather I use a higher percent bear grease (no formula;just wing-it). Go to the archives for how to make Stumpy's moose-snot.