Pedersoli Carbine...

[Preacher]

I ordered, and arriving tomorrow, a Pedersoli Cook & Brothers Carb .58 percussion. In the mode of a Confederate reproduction carbine I had no prior knowledge of its history, but appreciate learning about it. I have their Pennsylvania and really like the fit/finish & accuracy in .50 cal, as a high quality production gun. Most of my shooting is in the woods (hunting), so the carbine style should work great. I just switched to Swiss 2Fg, so I'll be learning & making some adjustments as I get up to speed with it too.

I'd appreciate you sharing your experience with this model (if any), opinions and recommendations. Primarily I'll be using it to hunt deer. I'll share pictures when it comes in. Now, I have to figure what to do with my Lyman Deerstalker that is similar in characteristics.

Thank you

 

[Old Hawkeye]

Haven't shot that model, but have shot a similar 58 cal rifle with the same 48 twist, 5 groove, .004" deep rifling. The maker says it will shoot both PRB & Minies, but I have found the Minies recoil to be more than I like, especially from a light carbine like yours, but each has is own tolerance level. With the shallow rifling & the groove diameter listed by the maker, I would recommend a .570" ball with fairly thick lubed patch. A .018" ticking patch would be a good place to start, but you may end up going thicker as each barrel has it's own quirks. 60 grains of BP for starters, as well & working up from there. You'll just have to experiment with patch thickness & powder charges to see what gives the best performance. Too much powder & too thin a patch can cause the PRB to slip that shallow rifling resulting in poor accuracy, but once you find the right combo that barrel will shoot better than you can. Not going to mention any specific lube because others here will immediately chime in and tell you I am all wrong & only their home brewed lube concoction will work. Please post pics & your shooting results when you can, as I'm curious how that carbine does. Good Luck.

 

[Preacher]

Here's some pics of my new Pedersoli Cook & Brothers Carbine .58 percussion, along with a target result from 25 yrds, minies, using 50gr Swiss 2Fg. Out of the box I was pleased with the shot placement (only 5 shot 3.5" grp, 2 fliers), and the way it handles (balanced & light), but I have a lot of work to do to improve my accuracy...

 

[dave951]

Good start. At 25yd, you should be getting one ragged hole when it's been through some load development.

 

[F.G. Ford]

Size your minie bullets to .001" less than bore diameter.
You will never be able to hit much unless your minie balls ( bullets ) are tight in the bore.
Yes shooting a typical minie ball will enlarge on firing, but not enough. A rifle with minie balls ( bullets ) .001" or tighter will shoot ragged holes at fifty yards.
You will have to slug bore your barrel to get exact bore diameter.
Message me if you do not know how to check for true bore diameter.
Fred

 

[F.G. Ford]

Here's some pics of my new Pedersoli Cook & Brothers Carbine .58 percussion, along with a target result from 25 yrds, minies, using 50gr Swiss 2Fg. Out of the box I was pleased with the shot placement (only 5 shot 3.5" grp, 2 fliers), and the way it handles (balanced & light), but I have a lot of work to do to improve my accuracy...

Sorry for the second post, I did not see your pictures, until I was just posting the second post. That is a fine looking rifle, If I may say!
That is not a group....that is a shotgun smooth bore pattern! No insult intended.
It takes a little bit of coaching to get these puppies shooting............then you are hooked.
They can shoot!
Can you get someone near by to help hone the trigger. You need a gun with better than thirty (30 ) pounds to hit something.
About three pounds is nice!

 

[Preacher]

Size your minie bullets to .001" less than bore diameter.
You will never be able to hit much unless your minie balls ( bullets ) are tight in the bore.
Yes shooting a typical minie ball will enlarge on firing, but not enough. A rifle with minie balls ( bullets ) .001" or tighter will shoot ragged holes at fifty yards.
You will have to slug bore your barrel to get exact bore diameter.
Message me if you do not know how to check for true bore diameter.
Fred

I appreciate sharing your experience... My trigger is fine. I don't have a gauge to measure the pull but I guess it's ~4#. Those rounds are .577, 530gr, from a Lyman mold designed for Enfield, which is what my model is. The poor pattern is my fault. I need to get better positioned other than setting on a 5gal bucket in high-freez'n-winds... The gun will shoot much better than I displayed. I will pick up some .579, as you suggest, when they become available.

 

[F.G. Ford]

I appreciate sharing your experience... My trigger is fine. I don't have a gauge to measure the pull but I guess it's ~4#. Those rounds are .577, 530gr, from a Lyman mold designed for Enfield, which is what my model is. The poor pattern is my fault. I need to get better positioned other than setting on a 5gal bucket in high-freez'n-winds... The gun will shoot much better than I displayed. I will pick up some .579, as you suggest, when they become available.

Hi again,
When you know the bore size of your rifle, get someone you know to make a steel sleeve, .0005"-.001" less than your bore size. Put your cast bullets in this sleeve and then with steel pins on both end squeeze ( with a vise ) the bullet to size. It may sound complicated, but it is easy.
You will have to swab between shots to keep the barrel clean, and fowling soft. If you don't, you will have difficulty loading the bullets down the barrel.
The whole purpose way back when, was the ability to throw the bullets down the barrel, and the gun would shoot. But today you are not in a battle scene, you want the gun to shoot to it's maximum ( accuracy wise )
Up here at Connaught Range the guys shooting the .577 Snider rifles and the Parker Hale, and Pedersoli rifles shoot a ragged hole at fifty yards, and very close to that at one hundred yards.
For the longer ranges they are using peep sights.
Your rifle is capable of this accuracy, and it is fun to kick ass at the local range with one of these rifles. Especially when the fellow beside you is shooting a five inch pattern with his 30-30, 30-06, .308 or whatever. It is fun!

 

[Preacher]

Hi again,
When you know the bore size of your rifle, get someone you know to make a steel sleeve, .0005"-.001" less than your bore size. Put your cast bullets in this sleeve and then with steel pins on both end squeeze ( with a vise ) the bullet to size. It may sound complicated, but it is easy.
You will have to swab between shots to keep the barrel clean, and fowling soft. If you don't, you will have difficulty loading the bullets down the barrel.
The whole purpose way back when, was the ability to throw the bullets down the barrel, and the gun would shoot. But today you are not in a battle scene, you want the gun to shoot to it's maximum ( accuracy wise )
Up here at Connaught Range the guys shooting the .577 Snider rifles and the Parker Hale, and Pedersoli rifles shoot a ragged hole at fifty yards, and very close to that at one hundred yards.
For the longer ranges they are using peep sights.
Your rifle is capable of this accuracy, and it is fun to kick ass at the local range with one of these rifles. Especially when the fellow beside you is shooting a five inch pattern with his 30-30, 30-06, .308 or whatever. It is fun!

I hear ya, but sleeving that gun is NOT going to happen... It's a brand new Pedersoli... It will perform, in its virgin state, beyond what I will ever require.

 

[Grenadier1758]

@F.G. Ford was suggesting a sleeve to use as a sizing die to better fit your Minie ball to the barrel. This is not a suggestion to install a liner in your barrel.

 

[Old Hawkeye]

I hear ya, but sleeving that gun is NOT going to happen... It's a brand new Pedersoli... It will perform, in its virgin state, beyond what I will ever require.

You might consider a hearing aid. What Grenadier1758 said!

 

[Preacher]

@F.G. Ford was suggesting a sleeve to use as a sizing die to better fit your Minie ball to the barrel. This is not a suggestion to install a liner in your barrel.

Thanks for the clarification... I'll read up on that to better understand.

 

[Preacher]

You might consider a hearing aid. What Grenadier1758 said!

Actually, I had a set of $6K hearing aids before the spring broke & they became useless. I tried a less expensive pair to replace the originals, but they are worthless. But, you're right. I do need help, not just to hear better, but to understand the technical language of what's on this board. I'm trying...

 

[Preacher]

@F.G. Ford was suggesting a sleeve to use as a sizing die to better fit your Minie ball to the barrel. This is not a suggestion to install a liner in your barrel.

I purchase pre-cast bullets. It appears the sizing die will trim an oversized bullet. How about those smaller than the die? What do you do with those? Not use them?

 

[F.G. Ford]

I purchase pre-cast bullets. It appears the sizing die will trim an oversized bullet. How about those smaller than the die? What do you do with those? Not use them?

With a sizing die, you can reduce the overall diameter, or increase the overall diameter, simply by pressing the bullet into the die, or placing the loosely fitting bullet in the die, and then a shaped pin at the base, and a shaped pin at the top, then squeezing it in a a vise, then pushing the sized bullet out.
It takes more time talking about it than doing it.

 

[dave951]

I purchase pre-cast bullets. It appears the sizing die will trim an oversized bullet. How about those smaller than the die? What do you do with those? Not use them?

The BEST source of precast minie type bullets is this guy-

Pat Kaboskey
https://www.lodgewood.com/Bullets_c_7.html
You can get sizing dies from this guy-
https://www.northeasttradeco.com/online-store/SIZING-DIES-Threaded-c22095488
He also has them unthreaded for use in an arbor press.

And NO, a sizing die does NOT "trim" a bullet. What it does is to swage a bullet into round and a certain diameter. You can swage different bullets to varying degrees. Some designs won't tolerate much while others can be swaged as much as .008. NO, a sizing die does not increase a bullet's diameter.

 

[dave951]

I trust Pat Kaboskey because he's a fellow North South Skirmish Association competitor who knows what it takes to make a quality minie and Lodgewood is a supporter of the N-SSA and muzzleloading military arms in general. S&S is also a good source for military black powder arms. Track and the others are fine for round ball rondy stuff, but when you want to play with minies, that's a completely different world.

 

[Preacher]

I trust Pat Kaboskey because he's a fellow North South Skirmish Association competitor who knows what it takes to make a quality minie and Lodgewood is a supporter of the N-SSA and muzzleloading military arms in general. S&S is also a good source for military black powder arms. Track and the others are fine for round ball rondy stuff, but when you want to play with minies, that's a completely different world.

Thanks for the insight, Dave. I'm interested in the N-SSA, as Winchester, VA is nearby. They had their Snowball skirmish this weekend, but I wasn't able to attend. I get my BP from one of the lead members there.

 

[dave951]

Thanks for the insight, Dave. I'm interested in the N-SSA, as Winchester, VA is nearby. They had their Snowball skirmish this weekend, but I wasn't able to attend. I get my BP from one of the lead members there.

Well we're getting a "wintery mix" here so the Snowball was off my agenda for this year. Come on over to Nationals and you can get pretty much everything you need and even get to meet Dave from Lodgewood and the good folks from S&S. While you're there sample the gastronomic delicacies of the Ruritans. The morning sliders are great. Check out Back Creek on your way out to get a supply of the holy black and caps.

 

[Preacher]

The BEST source of precast minie type bullets is this guy-

Pat Kaboskey
https://www.lodgewood.com/Bullets_c_7.html
You can get sizing dies from this guy-
https://www.northeasttradeco.com/online-store/SIZING-DIES-Threaded-c22095488
He also has them unthreaded for use in an arbor press.

And NO, a sizing die does NOT "trim" a bullet. What it does is to swage a bullet into round and a certain diameter. You can swage different bullets to varying degrees. Some designs won't tolerate much while others can be swaged as much as .008. NO, a sizing die does not increase a bullet's diameter.

Is Kabosky with

Well we're getting a "wintery mix" here so the Snowball was off my agenda for this year. Come on over to Nationals and you can get pretty much everything you need and even get to meet Dave from Lodgewood and the good folks from S&S. While you're there sample the gastronomic delicacies of the Ruritans. The morning sliders are great. Check out Back Creek on your way out to get a supply of the holy black and caps.

Just might do that. Back Creek is where I get my BP. John invited me to the N-SSA. I live in Harper's Ferry. Just started snowing here...