Rust In The Bore

[pooch156]

Denatured preferred, or methanol. Isopropyl usually contains water (up to 30%) it doesn't make sense to add water when you are trying to remove it. The exception would be gas line antifreeze (100% isopropyl) .

I use 91% isopropyl from the drug store.

 

[pooch156]

FishDFly and Marinekayak,

The difference you are seeing between the two rifles is more likely associated with the surface finish of the bore in the rifles than the differences in the steel alloy. Rusting is a chemical reaction and can be accelerated by activation sites such as sharp points and sharp ridges. Those that have tried to rust brown a barrel or lock plate that they have polished with a fine grit abrasive soon learn this. The rust/browning process will start much easier on a surface that was sanded with 220 grit paper that a surface that was sanded down to 600 grit or finer.

Also, once a surface starts pitting, even if they are small and shallow, it will be more prone to rusting than one that remains smooth and clean. Roughness in a bore can also trap fouling and make it more difficult to remove which in turn can contribute to more corrosion from the salts in the trapped fouling.

I am most certainly in your corner! On any new barrel (BP or Modern smokeless) I use what is known as bore polish method. It was introduced to me by a man named Gary (Onandaga) over at Cast Bullet Association forum. It, quite simply involves the use of patches and Turtle Wax Chrome polish. Yes, I did say Chrome polish! You'll use 10 patches. Saturate a patch with the Chrome Polish and run it in and out of the barrel 10 times. Do this with all 10 patches. Then clean the residue out of the barrel with alcohol on a patch(s) Then oil your barrel. This method removes any whiskers and polishes the steel. I had a .40 Cal. Green Mountain barrel that stood in my shop for 10 years untouched. I pulled it out some months ago to finish that build. I noticed that there was surface rust in the grooves in the barrel. Then I thought of Garys' bore polish method! The bore is now shiny and rust free! Thank You Gary! RIP.

 

[Idaho Ron]

I’ve been using One Shot for a few years now.

My supply has gotten low so I decided too reorder..

Hornadys says it was discontinued 2 years ago, at least the muzzleloader cleaner/lube version.

One shot was case lube for resizing cases in the reloading process. I have a can of it.

 

[Idaho Ron]

No ...I said lube, but it’s a cleaner/ protectant.
Although I used it for a patch lube......

I have never seen that stuff before.

 

[Flinty Scot]

Last time I poured hot water down a bore for cleaning was 1974. I clean my bores with a wet patch, several wet patches, then dry patches till it's dry, then a liberal dose of Hoppes. I pull the nipple and put several drops of Hoppes down the breech. Clean the nipple and fence then screw the nipple back in. Set the hammer on a dry patch and put it away. Here is a patch I just used to check a rifle that has not been fired for over seven years. Been in the gun rack all the time. Here's the patch and rifle. Fairly expensive rifle so I do try to take care of it.

That is a seriously beautiful target rifle. Not surprised you take extra good care of it.
Just out of curiosity, what caliber is it?

 

[Flinty Scot]

Any high % alcohol will absorb water. That - and it's fast drying- is why I use it for my swabbing patches/tow. I normally use 90% rubbing alcohol but switch to Everclear for very cold shooting. I've had damp-fouled powder using a spit-wet swabbing patch w/out following w/ a dry patch, but never using alcohol.

Just don't get alcohol on your fingers in cold weather. I have a tiny flask to carry it in, so it's fairly easy to hold the neck against the paich and control both the amount in the patch and to keep it off my hands.

 

[Josephg]

That is a seriously beautiful target rifle. Not surprised you take extra good care of it.
Just out of curiosity, what caliber is it?

.40, Left hand picket twist

 

[Carbon 6]

Any high % alcohol will absorb water.

I'm pretty sure the holding power of water for an alcohol is at best a 1:1 ratio or 50% by volume. So that means that if your Isopropyl is a 70% concentration over the counter, that it's water absorbing ability has been reduced by 60%. It will still work, but less than half as good as pure alcohol.

 

[smo]

I have never seen that stuff before.

A Friend of mine from Virginia had some when he stopped bye my place a few years back. 2016 I think...

It worked well as a cleaner, but I didn’t trust it as a preservative.

It worked well for me as a patch lube..I simply put a few drops on the patches in a cap tin and close the lid.
I also used it on 1/2” wads in my smoothbore using them in a version of the Skychief load.

They wads help keep the fouling soft as well.

I ordered mine from Midway, they no longer have it.

 

[Rudall]

I'm pretty sure the holding power of water for an alcohol is at best a 1:1 ratio or 50% by volume. So that means that if your Isopropyl is a 70% concentration over the counter, that it's water absorbing ability has been reduced by 60%. It will still work, but less than half as good as pure alcohol.

Water and alcohol (ethanol and others) are totally miscible in any proportion. If that were not true then there would be no beer at 5% alcohol, wine at 13% and whisky at 35%. It is therefore not accurate to say that alcohol ‘holds’ water. If you put 70/30 alcohol/water in your bore, then once the alcohol has evaporated you will be left with the water portion.
Unless someone knows better, which is always a possibility.

 

[Rudall]

MAP is often mentioned and is something I don’t understand. Peroxide will dissociate readily into water and oxygen. When this happens doesn’t that simply leave water in the bore? And what is the peroxide supposed to be doing anyway?

 

[FishDFly]

MAP is often mentioned and is something I don’t understand. Peroxide will dissociate readily into water and oxygen. When this happens doesn’t that simply leave water in the bore? And what is the peroxide supposed to be doing anyway?

Not sure, know it's popular with a lot of folks.

Hydrogen peroxide is only 3%, remaining is purified water.

My mentor use to get old barrels that would not shoot very well. He would plug the nipple and pour hydrogen peroxide down the barrel and let it sit over night. Next morning the nastiest grey liquid would have boiled out of the barrel. I t was squeaky clean.

 

[Rudall]

Hydrogen peroxide is only 3%, remaining is purified water.

Yes, I’d forgotten that. Stronger stuff is easily available, at least here, but your observation makes my point even more cogent.

Most of the time I use MAP - (Murphys, Alcohol and Peroxide) to wipe the bores and breech out.

Wouldn’t just the MA part be better?

 

[FishDFly]

In the past I used MAP. Last time I mixed some up, some kind of reaction occurred and it over pressured the spray bottle and left a mess on my wood shelf. No more.

I actually use Black Solve at the range for cleaning between shots and plain water and soap at the end of the day.

There are many concoctions created for cleaning and for the most part, they are not needed.

 

[Rudall]

In the past I used MAP. Last time I mixed some up, some kind of reaction occurred and it over pressured the spray bottle and left a mess on my wood shelf.

That would be the peroxide dissociating into water and free oxygen gas.

 

[CaptainKirk]

My $.02.
There’s no chlorine in boiled water. Cl2 doesn’t stay in solution well, and even less as the water temperature rises.

Next time I may try hot water out of the tea kettle, rather than the tap.

 

[Josephg]

In the past I used MAP. Last time I mixed some up, some kind of reaction occurred and it over pressured the spray bottle and left a mess on my wood shelf. No more.

I actually use Black Solve at the range for cleaning between shots and plain water and soap at the end of the day.

There are many concoctions created for cleaning and for the most part, they are not needed.

I know there are people who truly enjoy cleaning their rifle. In some cases it's more important than it's function or shooting it.

 

[Carbon 6]

Water and alcohol (ethanol and others) are totally miscible in any proportion. If that were not true then there would be no beer at 5% alcohol, wine at 13% and whisky at 35%. It is therefore not accurate to say that alcohol ‘holds’ water. If you put 70/30 alcohol/water in your bore, then once the alcohol has evaporated you will be left with the water portion.
Unless someone knows better, which is always a possibility.

Umm, sure, but once you exceed 1:1 or 50/50 it's no longer a case of the alcohol absorbing the water, the water is absorbing the alcohol. A 5% alcohol solution will have no benefit to the shooter as it will not remove water from the bore.

 

[Carbon 6]

MAP is often mentioned and is something I don’t understand. Peroxide will dissociate readily into water and oxygen. When this happens doesn’t that simply leave water in the bore? And what is the peroxide supposed to be doing anyway?

I'll share a story with you about peroxide that I've shared before.

"Yesterday I was working on the house (putting in new windows) and I noticed my hummingbird feeder was empty. So, I decided to make a new batch. (boil one cup water and 1/4 cup sugar) I put the water and sugar on the stove and forgot about it, (got distracted with working on the house). Well, I'm on a ladder and I hear the fire alarm going off. Oh, manure! Luckily it didn't burst into flames or boil over, but the house was full of smoke and did smell like a burnt marshmallow. All the water had boiled out and the sugar had completely burned to carbon. The pan was ruined I thought. It spent the night outside. Today I grabbed a stick and tried to scrape some off. Yep stuck tight, the pan was ruined. Burnt sugar can be very hard to remove but I thought I would give it a try. I soaked the pan for an hour in oyx-clean. No change.
Then I decided to test hydrogen peroxide. I filled the pan with over the counter hydrogen peroxide and brought it to a boil. The carbon began to start lifting. About ten minutes later the pan looked new and the carbon was all gone. No scrubbing or anything.

When people wonder what hydrogen peroxide does, I'll just smile."

 

[griffiga]

My regimen is clean after shooting. Soap water, rinse water, clean until patches are clean. Dry and apply oil. Then I clean 3 days after, 3 weeks after and 3 months after shooting. I apply good quality gun oil to the bore and parts. No rust.

Man o live Jeff, if you can give your gun a "three month after" cleaning, that tells me you need to get out shooting more often.