Who's killed an elk with a round ball?

[Wink]

I presently shoot a TC 54 Renegade with a .015 patch and an OP Wad. Does anyone use a similar or different patch for this gun?

 

[longcruise]

I presently shoot a TC 54 Renegade with a .015 patch and an OP Wad. Does anyone use a similar or different patch for this gun?

Won't really matter what I or anybody else uses. Even though quality control at TC has been pretty good, there is no guarantee that your bore will be identical to someone elses. TC button rifles their barrels so they can vary with the amount of wear on the button being used, etc.

Only thing I can suggest is to work up a load powerful enough (IMO, that means 80 grains or more of ff or fff) that gives adequate accuracy. Try as many patch materials as you can find with both .530 and .535 balls.

Look for a load with enough power, adequate accuracy and that you can manage in the field with your on-board loading rod.

As far as OP wads go, I don't consider them a necessity in any of my shooting but, heck, they can't hurt so you may as well use em if you like em.

 

:bow: greenmtnboy is ablolutely right when he talks about glassing every couple of steps, as Ishi said, "walk little look big". I continually tell myself this as I hunt and that will do more for your hunting sucess than hiking for miles.

 

[Capt. Fred]

Yup, you beat me to it. I use a small pair of Nikons and I glass every time I stop if I'm stalking. Even if I can only see 30 yds due to the thickness of the cover I still use the glasses.

I don't know squat about Elk but white tailed deer will let you walk right by from real close if they think you haven't seen them. The glasses will pick up the line of a leg, the outline of an ear, the line of white between the tail and the rump, etc.

 

[tg]

" IMO, it's not about sealing gasses so much as it is about increasing the initial resistance of the ball to movement which in turn results in a cleaner and more efficient powder burn."

I have to go with that, sealing gases is the least most purpose of the patch, it holds the ball tight enough to offer resistance and spin the ball as it goes, this is also is what the boys who are deep into ML performance shooting with PRB will tell you

 

[Hntr79]

Thanks for all the info. I just got a chance to read it. The night after I made the post that started this string, someone bet their life that they could come in my backdoor and grab my laptop without waking me up. They won this time.

So! Has anyone shot an intruder with a .44 cal roundball from an 1851 revolver? What kind of penetration did you get? Any bloodtrail?

Just kidding...sort of.

 

[Idaho Ron]

Like most ungulates, Elk "listen", through their FEET, to the ground as their early warning system.

:rotf: :rotf:
Alrighty then.

Breaking brush is always an ALARM signal to all animals. Learn to listen to the birds, and squirrels, and other small animals in the woods or mountains. They are the look-outs for all game. Elk and deer will stop and listen whenever they hear an alarm call by small game and varmints, or birds.

I have had elk bugle when they here foot steps. It all depends on the circumstance of the hunt.
Have you ever hunted elk? Have you ever killed ellk? Ron

 

[Idaho Ron]

When guiding I will softly cow call with noisy hunters or if the woods are crunchy.
When alone I don't make any noise until I need to manipulate the elk I stalked in on.
I don't like to advertise my location when I am alone.
even a skilled hunter may over look a bedded elk or deer all the wile cow calling and moving slowly.
Also if stalking dark timber I take three maby four steps and glass my surronding area.

I agree!!!
Ron

 

[tg]

I have shot a couple of Grouse with a '51 36 cal I sold a few years back, it used to be holstered to the leg of the nightstand on my side of the bed,never had to shoot it other than to clean and reload a couple of times a year.

 

[rabjr]

Lewis and Clark and company killed lots

 

[Herb]

I do not have a Hodgdon Manual that shows black powder loads, but 1670 fps with 90 grains of Goex 2F is faster than my most of my tests show. The Lyman Black Powder Handbook and Loading Manual, 2nd edition, shows a .54 32" barrel, 1-60" twist,.535 RB, 90 grains of Goex 2F producing 1480 fps. (And 90 grains of Goex 3F getting 1475 fps!) I tested this to see if it was so. But first, here are some 90 grains of Goex 2F and round ball velocities from some rifles I built:
a 42" barreled Christian Hawken caplock, 1606 fps.
A 42" barreled Henry Albright flintlock, 1636 fps.
A 32" custom LH Bridger Hawken, .535 RB, 1521 fps, .530 RB 1479, 1546, and .520 RB, 1500 fps.
My 34" Green River Leman, .530, 1641, 1694 and 1738 (heavy patch).
My 32" custom Bridger style caplock Hawken, old Moosic, PA (1978) powder, 1638 fps, new mfgr Minden, LA powder, 1515 fps.

You can see photos of groups shot with 80 to 120 grains of Goex 2F and 3F in this Hawken, with velocities, in the General Muzzleloading forum, my post "Comparison of Goex 2F and 3F Velocities in a .54 Hawken", 12/21/08. Post number is 657638. That barrel liked 110 grains of Goex 2F. I'd go for 110 to 120 grains of Goex 2F.

 

[tg]

You will best be served by practicing at life size Elk cutouts from various distances with no "bull" to aim at and be able to judge very closely the range when the time for the shot comes...or appears to.

 

[Vaino]

When originally determining the PRB elk load in a .54 cal "hawken" w/ a 33" bbl, I looked at the tables in some BP manuals and noted the velocity increase for every 10 gr increase of 2f. The velocity increase was linear up to 130 grs. but w/ 10 gr. increments above 130 grs., the velocity increase wasn't as great. Since then I've backed off to 120 grs. 2f w/o any loss in accuracy. Mainly I wanted a 100 yd. zero w/ a practical mid-range height and either load achieves that. No doubt a somewhat lesser charge would kill an elk, but wouldn't have as low a mid-range height. As I stated in a previous post, the last elk was killed at a paced off 107 yds and last fall my son short a whitetail at 55 yds which reinforces the versatility of these loads....Fred

 

[Kentuckywindage]

I agree, get something close to a life size elk target. Get rid of the bullseye and start practice shooting at a body form. I did that today with my flintlock at 56 and 75 yards off hand and out of breath. When an elk steps out at 100 yards in real life, its like a mid 1970's buick rolling out in front of you :haha:

 

[tg]

"When an elk steps out at 100 yards in real life, its like a mid 1970's buick rolling out in front of you "


They are impressive for sure, the life size target practice can really give an edge to someone who is not familiar with Elk, their distance can ge quite deceiving the first time you see one in the wild.

 

[BS]

I hunt PRB only and have harvested an elk and deer every year for the last six years and a lion this year.
I shoot only Greenmtnbarrels and large game with a 54.
My load is 110 grns of FFG Goex Express a 530 RB and a .030 canvase patch.
60 yrds on out I usally get clean pass through or my ball stops in the hide on the far side.
At close range 40yrds and under my ball is going fast enough where is flattens out to a 50 cent piece and usally it will stop in the center lung area.

I have never has an elk or deer go further than 50 yrds than drop.
:thumbsup:

Pay close attention to this post.....High Power Loads tend to flatten and result in less penetration, but give a large wound channel at close range.

I like exit holes, so I used a Hard Lead ball out of my 54, at 40 yards broadside, 100 FFF, double lung and exit, the bull covered over 100 yds down hill........probably wouldn't have traveled as far, but my hunt'in buddy ran him down and shot him high in the neck. Probably wasn't needed, BUT!

His short barreled Renagade 54, 120FF and PRB will shoot thru a Cow at 50yds broadside.[double lung] dropped in 40 to 50 yds.

Best advice that I can give you is:

Think Like a Bow Hunter, broadside, double lung! No Bone!

Good Hunting!
Bruce

 

[hawk]

"Think Like a Bow Hunter, broadside, double lung! No Bone!"


sound wisdom.

 

[longcruise]

"Think Like a Bow Hunter, broadside, double lung! No Bone!"


sound wisdom.

Yes, but, IMO, with the caveat that one think like a traditional bowhunter. :haha:

Seriously, Some of the bowhunters I know have equipment that allows them to make precise shot placement up to 75 yards if they have a rangefinder. And, many of them do it.

We ml hunters lament the loss of the "traditional" aspect of the hunt, but when you look at what has happened to bow hunting.... Well, sadly, I think you are then also looking at the future of "traditional" ml hunting. They just had a head start on us what with the wheel bow coming along in the '60's.