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Rust stopping oil

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Original Colt loading and cleaning manual said to use hot water , dry and oil. I've always used that with good results. However muskets are not as easily cleansed. My Zouave never stops showing dirty patches until I plugged both ends and almost filled it with Fluid Film and let stand for a week. A bit messy but like a new bore.
Well, actually, the Colt Manual said, "warm water".
Below is a copy of the Colt Pistol instructions.


DIRECTIONS FOR LOADING COLT'S PISTOLS.

First explode a cap on each nipple to clear them from oil or dust, then draw back the hammer to the half-cock, which allows the \par
cylinder to be rotated; a charge of powder is then placed in one of the chambers, keeping the barrel up, and a ball with the pointed end upwards without wadding or patch is put into the mouth of the chamber. turned under the rammer, and forced down with the lever below the surface of the cylinder, so that it cannot hinder its rotation
(Care should be used in ramming down the ball not to shake the powder from the chamber, thereby reducing the charge).
This is repeated until all the chambers are loaded. Percussion-caps are then placed on the nipples on the right of the lock-frame, where, by drawing back the hammer in the full-cock the arm is in condition for a discharge by pulling the trigger; A repetition of the same motion produces the like results with six shots without reloading.

It will be safe to use all the Powder the chambers will hold, when loading with the flask, leaving room for the Ball, whether the Powder is strong or weak. Fine grain Powder is the best. Soft lead must be used for the balls. The cylinder is not to be taken off when loaded. The hammer, when at full cock forms the sight by which aim is taken.
To carry the arm safely when loaded let down the hammer on one of the pins between each nipple, on the end of the cylinder.
The arm should be throughly cleaned and oiled after firing, particularly the arbor-pin on which the cylinder turns.

DIRECTIONS FOR LOADING WITH COLT'S FOIL CARTRIDGE

Take the white case off the Cartridge, by holding the bullet end and tearing it down with the black tape. Place the Cartridge in the mouth of the chamber of the cylinder, with the pointed end of the bullet uppermost, one at a time and turn them under the rammer, forcing them down with the lever below the surface of the cylinder so that they cannot hinder its rotation.
To ensure certainty of Ignition, it is advisable to puncture the end of the Cartridge, so that a small portion of gunpowder may escape into the chamber while loading the pistol.

DIRECTIONS FOR CLEANING

Set the lock at half-cock; drive out the key that holds the barrel and cylinder to the lock-frame, then draw off the barrel and cylinder by bringing down the lever and forcing the rammer on the partition between the chambers. Take out the nipples. Wash the cylinder and barrel in warm water, dry and oil them throughly; oil freely the base pin on which the cylinder revolves.

TO TAKE THE LOCK TO PIECES, CLEAN AND OIL

First--Remove the stock, by turning out bottom and two rear screws that fasten it to guard and lock-frame, near hammer.
Second-- Loosen the screw that fastens mainspring to the trigger guard and turn spring from under tumbler of the hammer.
Third--Remove the trigger guard by turning out the three screws that fasten it to the lock-frame.
Fourth--Turn out the screw and remove the double arm spring that bears upon the trigger and bolt.
Fifth--Turn out the screw pins that hold the trigger and bolt in their places.
Sixth--Turn out the remaining screw-in and remove the hammer with hand attached, by drawing it downwards out of the lock-frame. Clean all the parts and oil them throughly.
TO PUT THEM TOGETHER--Replace the hammer with hand-spring attached, then the bolt, the trigger, the sear spring, the trigger-guard, the mainspring, and finally the handle, returning each screw to its proper place, the arm is again in for use.
 
OK,

So my RIG grease came today and I took the opportunity to clean out the oil I finished with only last Saturday evening (two days ago).

The patch on the bottom was the first patch to come out the Hawken, the patch on the top came out of my cannon with a stainless steel 316 cannon barrel. The Hawken patch is covered in rust, the cannon patch has only oil.

https://ibb.co/LYpn0C7

Both weapons were cleaned at the same time, in the same way and stored in the same gun cabinet. The oil I used to line the Hawken barrel was Abbey Gun and rifle Oil. I know you are all going to say I can't clean or store a rifle, and you are welcome to your opinion. However, I am perfectly able to pump water, patches and oil up and down a barrel just like the next man with a fully working pair of arms!

I live in the UK and my guns are stored in a centrally heated brick home kept at a temp of about 19c and we have a dehumidifier running all the time.

Anyway, the barrel was patched until clean and a RIG grease soaked wool mop pumped up and down the barrel. I will report back in about a week with a pic of the patch from the Hawken before the first shot.
 
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The 300 series of stainless steel almost never shows signs of rusting, even if corrosive salts are present. That is why your 316 cannon barrel didn't show any sign of rust.
 
The 300 series of stainless steel almost never shows signs of rusting, even if corrosive salts are present. That is why your 316 cannon barrel didn't show any sign of rust.

Yes, I am fully aware of that, 316 is tough stuff. I showed that picture to show BP deposits were removed and oil applied.
 
If you are concerned with staying " all natural", consider Fluid film, it is solvent free and consist of an all natural lanolin base. . .:D

Not quite all natural.That's what I thought, too, until reading the label. Fluid Film also contains several petroleum by-products. (Refined petroleum oil, hydrotreated heavy paraffinic, Petroleum gases, liquified, sweetened, Calcium petroleum sulfonate.)

I had hoped for a non-petroleum product that might replicate the fabulous performance I've experienced from LPS 3 for 50 years or so. No such luck. I continue to use LPS 3 on external surfaces for rust protection. The inside of my bore gets the same beeswax/olive oil I use for a lube. I check it very regularly to make certain I'm safe. I am, but I'll continue my watch.

Here's a link to the technical data on Fluid Film. Clicking it will download a PDF.

safety data sheet - Fluid Film
 
Not quite all natural.That's what I thought, too, until reading the label. Fluid Film also contains several petroleum by-products. (Refined petroleum oil, hydrotreated heavy paraffinic, Petroleum gases, liquified, sweetened, Calcium petroleum sulfonate.)

I had hoped for a non-petroleum product that might replicate the fabulous performance I've experienced from LPS 3 for 50 years or so. No such luck. I continue to use LPS 3 on external surfaces for rust protection. The inside of my bore gets the same beeswax/olive oil I use for a lube. I check it very regularly to make certain I'm safe. I am, but I'll continue my watch.

Here's a link to the technical data on Fluid Film. Clicking it will download a PDF.

safety data sheet - Fluid Film

Ya, I know, the old fluid film was, guess the SDS wasn't the only thing that changed. Nothing like replacing a quality product with cheap petrochemicals.
 
Well what could be more Natural than (fish oil)WD-40? If you are really serious about getting the rust out use some PB-Blaster and a brass bore brush. I started using WD-40 on the old ignition magnetos and distributors of old antique cars and then PB-Blaster to remove rust from the moving and non moving parts of the old cars.
Once after hot water cleaning my .50 Hawken I put it up without enough drieing and next week saw rust on my cleaning patch, looking down the barrel it was brown, damn rust! I got out the PB-Blaster and went to work with a .44 bore brush and then followed it with WD-40 when it came back bright and rust free after a hour of cleaning, then i ran a Hoppes # 9 wet patch and then put it away for a few weeks. Never after that did I do the hot water, that I didn't follow up with WD-40 and Hoppes 9 and after 20 years without being loaded the bore is bright and shiney.
I have never had any LPS, but I'm gonna buy some and try it on my guns, modern, classic and old timey.
 
Well what could be more Natural than (fish oil)WD-40? .
According to the company.

WHAT A FISH STORY!
Myth: WD-40® contains fish oil.

Fact: Consumers have told us over the years that they have caught some of the biggest fish ever after protecting their fish hooks and lures with WD-40®. We believe this legend came from folks assuming that the product must contain fish oil since it appears to attract fish. Sorry Charlie®, it just ain’t so.
 
A couple of questions from the peanut gallery....
  • You have cleaned your barrel and applied your ‘rust stopping oil’ of choice. For some reason the bore rusts, yet the outside of the barrel doesn’t rust. Why? Did you use a different rust stopping oil on the outside of the barrel? Could it be the bore wasn’t clean or moisture was left in it? Maybe it’s air flow......
  • Some of us have smokeless centerfire guns. Do the bores of these guns rust? If not, why? Is it possible the bores of the muzzleloaders are not as ‘clean’ as the smokeless centerfires? Do centerfire guns have better air flow? Shouldn’t make any difference as long as muzzleloader and centerfire barrels are clean, yet don’t hear much about rust in centerfire gun’s bores. Is it remotely possible that the muzzleloader bores are not as clean as some claim or believe?
  • ??
  • In my opinion, those with rust in their muzzleloader bores have not completely cleaned them. Thoughts?
 
Dear mr./Mrs. Carbon 6:Some folks still believe the earth is flat, what makes you an expert on WD-40 anyway?
Charlie.


Person that asked
"You have cleaned your barrel and applied your ‘rust stopping oil’ of choice. For some reason the bore rusts, yet the outside of the barrel doesn’t rust. Why?
Answer: why the bore rusted and the outside of the barrel didn't: You didn't burn blackpowder outside the barrel, bur you did inside the bore!
 
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Person that asked
"You have cleaned your barrel and applied your ‘rust stopping oil’ of choice. For some reason the bore rusts, yet the outside of the barrel doesn’t rust. Why?
Answer: why the bore rusted and the outside of the barrel didn't: You didn't burn blackpowder outside the barrel, bur you did inside the bore!
So you agree, you did not properly clean blackpowder residue from your bore, causing rust, regardless of your rust stopping oil. Correct? You didn’t or couldn’t clean your bore from blackpowder residue. Rust ensued. What is your argument is?
 
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Dear mr./Mrs. Carbon 6:Some folks still believe the earth is flat, what makes you an expert on WD-40 anyway?
Charlie.

According to the company.

WHAT A FISH STORY!
Myth: WD-40® contains fish oil.

Fact: Consumers have told us over the years that they have caught some of the biggest fish ever after protecting their fish hooks and lures with WD-40®. We believe this legend came from folks assuming that the product must contain fish oil since it appears to attract fish. Sorry Charlie®, it just ain’t so.


What I said was a direct quote from the WD-40 company.
https://www.wd40.com/myths-legends-fun-facts/

Oh, and the earth is round, and it's not even up for debate, anyone that thinks otherwise can prove me wrong by walking to the edge and jumping off.
 
A couple of questions from the peanut gallery....
  • You have cleaned your barrel and applied your ‘rust stopping oil’ of choice. For some reason the bore rusts, yet the outside of the barrel doesn’t rust. Why? Did you use a different rust stopping oil on the outside of the barrel? Could it be the bore wasn’t clean or moisture was left in it? Maybe it’s air flow......
  • Some of us have smokeless centerfire guns. Do the bores of these guns rust? If not, why? Is it possible the bores of the muzzleloaders are not as ‘clean’ as the smokeless centerfires? Do centerfire guns have better air flow? Shouldn’t make any difference as long as muzzleloader and centerfire barrels are clean, yet don’t hear much about rust in centerfire gun’s bores. Is it remotely possible that the muzzleloader bores are not as clean as some claim or believe?
  • ??
  • In my opinion, those with rust in their muzzleloader bores have not completely cleaned them. Thoughts?

I don't know why I get patches like this SDSmlf? (lower patch)
https://ibb.co/LYpn0C7
This is why I started this thread.

As far as I can tell, the bore is clean and dry.
My last clean:-

Warm water with dish soap,
(dry patch),
IPA wash,
(dry patch),
IPA patch,
(dry patch),
Wool mop soaked in gun oil.

However, same process, but with RIG grease on the mop for my last clean a day ago, so I will report back in a week or so for the first patch result.
 
I don't think putting oil, etc... on a patch and running it up and down a couple of times is sufficient for rust protection. I use aerosol spray oil and spray enough down the bore until it comes out the nipple hole. Then I'll run a loose patch saturated (dripping) with oil and do a couple of swabs. There's usually enough spillage to do outside of the barrel and around snail, hook etc... If your patch soaks up all the oil, you're not getting enough in all the grooves and breech.
 
I don't think putting oil, etc... on a patch and running it up and down a couple of times is sufficient for rust protection. I use aerosol spray oil and spray enough down the bore until it comes out the nipple hole. Then I'll run a loose patch saturated (dripping) with oil and do a couple of swabs. There's usually enough spillage to do outside of the barrel and around snail, hook etc... If your patch soaks up all the oil, you're not getting enough in all the grooves and breech.

Sorry.. disagree!
Excess oil will not make any difference to the formation of rust. Particularly with modern oils such as Sheath/Barricade only a very small quantity is needed as it binds to the metal surface. These compounds also have a vapour phase effect that will protect metal surfaces.

Excess oil in a gun will however have a seriously detrimental effect on the wood. Oil soaked wood is a major cause of failure in old guns. Depending on the oil, it can cause the wood to break down, and I suspect is one of the factors in promoting under wood rusting. I spend significant amounts of time soaking old stocks in solvent trying to leach out old oil. It is bad enough in two piece stocks where the head of the butt stock has to be soaked, but full length muzzle loading stocks are a PITA to sort out as there is a patch of oil soaked wood in the breech area where the oil has seeped out of the touchhole/nipple!

DON'T DO IT! Oil the bore lightly and put a vapour phase pad or a heater/dehumidifier in your gun box if you live in the "steam belt". Ideally you should store your long guns muzzle down so that any oil runs out the muzzle and not into your wood!

By all means put a barrier layer of wax or grease on the bore under the stock. This will protect the metal, but not soak into the wood. You should ALWAYS take the metal out of the wood on an annual basis to check for deterioration.

DO THE MAINTENANCE!
 
What I said was a direct quote from the WD-40 company.
https://www.wd40.com/myths-legends-fun-facts/

Oh, and the earth is round, and it's not even up for debate, anyone that thinks otherwise can prove me wrong by walking to the edge and jumping off.
Fish are attracted to the SMELL of the WD-40. I have heard that other smells such as that trout bait dough and garlic at attract fish
 
Fish are attracted to the SMELL of the WD-40. I have heard that other smells such as that trout bait dough and garlic at attract fish

That's not the point of argument. But, anything that smells different to an animals natural environment can be an attractant, and make them curious.
 
I’m gonna put my riot gear on now for the response’s . I owned One Pedersoli 36 blue ridge years ago that was the same way. It was just a rust magnet because it had a bore finish as porous as a new lodge cast iron skillet.
 
OK, i started this thread and it is now 5 pages long.

I have read every post and acted the best I can on every point raised.

This is what I can show you after only 3 days since the last full clean that was not even done on a gun that had been shot since the clean before. So it was a clean on top of a clean with one week apart!!

https://ibb.co/mH5tgYc

As you can seen, even a RIG Grease loaded wool mop will not stop the rusting!!

I am at a total loss as to how the hell I clean my Pedersoli Hawken and keep the rust out??

I've done most of what all these pages suggest, and still rust. I know I a human waste of space, the lowest of the low, somebody that shouldn't stand with in 10 feet of a gun, basically a horrible person with no skill what so ever, but surely after only 3 days my gun should be rust free??

Before the last clean where these patches show, I scrubbed the bore with a 50 cal bronze brush using Boretech gun cleaner, then washed the bore with IPA and patched it with IPA and then stuck an air line down the bore to dry it out, then the RIG soaked wool mop.

I guess I'm going to have to live with it being rusty after every clean.

Just as point of interest, the patches came out like this when I cleaned the bore before the very first shot when the gun was brand new from the shop !!
 
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