C&B revolver, OX-Yoke wads, and Pyrodex pellets

I recently picked up a Pieta 58 Remy. Took it to the range for a little fun yesterday. It turned out not to be so much fun after all.

I've always shot Goex in everything before. Figured I would try something different. I bought a can of Pyrodex 30 grain pellets, and a can of OX-YOKE Revolver Wonder seals. Turns out to be a BAD combination. The pistol would not fire at all. :hmm:

I noticed, as I went to put the caps on, that there were tiny strings of something coming out the nipples. Didn't really think that much of it at the time. Well, pulled the trigger on the first cylinder, and nothing but a tiny pop. Second cylinder, tiny pop, and so on for all 6 cylinders. After pulling a nipple to check for obstructions, I noticed when looking down into nipple hole that it didn't look like powder. After finally forcing a ball out of a cylinder from the nipple hole, I discovered that the wad lube had traveled down the hole through the Pyrodex pellet and completed covered over the back of the pellet. It had also plugged up the nipple and coated the inside of the cap. :cursing:
After firing about a dozen caps on each cylinder, I was able to get the other five of the cylinders to fire.
So, moral of the story. No more wads for me, and probably no more Pyrodex. Gonna stick to black powder and ye ole trusty Crisco over the cylinders from now on. At least that has always worked for me so far.

welcome to the Forum Turk and thanks for an informative first post :hatsoff:

I have some pyro pellets I bought for possible quick reloads in the field but never used them yet. I prefer stiff lube smeared over the ball or slug myself.

Yup. That's what I had figured. Quick, easy loads in the field without ending up covered in Crisco. Measuring the powder and trying not to spill any on my shoes, or having the wind blow it into the county is not my ideal for getting consistent loads. Smearing Crisco all over the front of the cylinders usually ends up with my hands so slick and greasy I can barely hold on to the gun.

It's hard enough to get my wife to come with me to the range. She likes to shoot, but is not into all the fuss with conventional loading. I end up having to do all the loading myself. Was hoping to make it a little less messy, so I could quit having to stop shooting to go reload for her.

Your problem WASN'T the wonder-wads, it was deviating from Goex! I use the wonder-wads all of the time, and so does the entire League of revolver shooters at my local club! Nobody uses crisco any more at our matches, for the greasy mess it makes! I've earned my NRA Expert in ML Pistol using the wonder-wads. In fact, in the Winter, I always add a little more lube to the wads cause they work better that way for me :idunno: , but I'm using them directly on the powder and under the balls.

The pellets used to have a fine coating of real black on one side of them, which you would then face towards the ignition source, to insure consistent ignitions. You must have some heavily-lubed wads or be using quite a lot of pressure when seating the balls to get the problem that you speak of. I've not heard of it prior to your post. I have heard of ignition problems with the pellets before, and it was in revolvers that the shooter was using lube over-the-balls with the balls being seated directly onto the pellets :idunno: .

My suggestion is to bring a New York Reload with you: A second revolver! Then you won't have to worry too much about a "fast" load :shocked2: .

Welcome to the Forum, have fun and make smoke!

Dave

Gotta agree with Dave. It wasn't the Wonder Wads - they were just used improperly: with pellets. They work just fine with granular powder.

I have never run into any thing that said not to use the combination of the wads, and pellets. Now they MIGHT work in cold weather, but not in 98 degree Texas sunshine. Next time I go, I'm gonna try the wads with regular black powder. I just keep in mind that you don't learn from your success's, you learn from your mistakes.

It's already so expensive at the range that I use that I can't really afford to bring anymore guns with me. It's the only one around this area within a reasonable distance. $15 to get in the gate, $5 extra for my wife, and $5 for each extra gun. When you add in the obligatory dinner out to appease the wife, it starts to get expensive in a hurry. And any man that has been married anytime at all knows, if the wife ain't happy, then ain't nobody gonna be happy.. :haha:

When I go to the range, I shoot at least 50 rounds, so bringing another pistol wouldn't make much difference. It would just be more guns that I would have to reload while I'm there.

capt_turk said:

I have never run into any thing that said not to use the combination of the wads, and pellets. Now they MIGHT work in cold weather, but not in 98 degree Texas sunshine. Next time I go, I'm gonna try the wads with regular black powder. I just keep in mind that you don't learn from your success's, you learn from your mistakes.

It's already so expensive at the range that I use that I can't really afford to bring anymore guns with me. It's the only one around this area within a reasonable distance. $15 to get in the gate, $5 extra for my wife, and $5 for each extra gun. When you add in the obligatory dinner out to appease the wife, it starts to get expensive in a hurry. And any man that has been married anytime at all knows, if the wife ain't happy, then ain't nobody gonna be happy.. :haha:

When I go to the range, I shoot at least 50 rounds, so bringing another pistol wouldn't make much difference. It would just be more guns that I would have to reload while I'm there.

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As far as the pellets go, you may light them off easier if you turn them 180*; so try just one chamber that way to see if you have THOSE pellets!

As far as the costs of the hobby are concerned, you're right, it is starting to get a little expensive. I sit on a Board of Trustees at one of the (3) Clubs that I belong to.
We just decided NOT to raise our dues over the $384.00 per Annam that's charged now, which includes 7% NJ Sales Tax. That works-out to about $1.00 per day, plus 7% Tax, whether or not you show-up. Both Indoor & Outdoor Range complexes are provided, and the Indoor Range is a 24/7/365 operation unless a League is using it or there's a clean-up going-on. Wife & Family members shoot with you for free, except and unless they're registered as a League or Special Match participant. Then they also pay the $5.00-$20.00 fee collected from the members to shoot the match. Some Matches use more materials than others, and some include lunch as well. What we don't do is charge a fee per gun/firearm, and we don't charge an hourly fee either, since we're a private range for members & Family. We do invite the public to our calendar-scheduled regular League Matches, and the public can shoot them for only $20.00 (4x the member rate).

Jeff Foxworthy does a comedy routine about, "If Momma ain't happy, then NOBODY'S happy!" and I just belly-laughed upon reading your post! :haha:

I'm helping to R-O a Black Powder Match today at this Club that I spoke of. The fee to shoot the Match was set at $50.00, and that included the main rifle match with a chance to win prize money, tickets for two (2) side-matches, lunch, drinks, a chance to shoot my 10 gauge at some clay birds, and a wood-cutting competition with teams trying to break 2x4's. Registration is a little lighter than I anticipated, probably due to the economy. The expenses for operating this Match will probably be more than the monies collected , but we had to break the ice and start somewhere, and show folks in our area a good time.

I tell you all of this to show you that you're not alone. I wish you well and to have continued success in this great hobby of ours :thumbsup:

Welcome to the Forum once again, and if we can be of any further assistance, don't hesitate to send me a PT.

Sincerely,

Dave

Apart from the use of wads over a solid lump of propellant, which I found rather odd to say the least [Why?], you gentlemen seem to be paying a TERBLE amount of $$$ for your shooting. Apart from the fact that most of you have ranges that make most of ours look like they are in Bulgaria, it seems that you have to pay for almost everything again AFTER you've gotten onto the range. I have to say though, that this does not happen in the club to which I am lucky enough to be an Hon Memb - it's in WA not far from Fort Vancouver and that's all I'm going to say there.

Here in UK we have a small club - only 254 members. We have two ranges. One is indoors to use on monday, tuesday thursday and friday evenings - all LEAD calibres up to and including .44 Mag on two four-point ranges set at opposite sides of the club room.

The other, a couple of miles away out in the rurals, has a six position 100m, a six position 50m and a six-position 25m. All FPs are weather-covered. We have turning targets as well, and shoot there saturdays, sundays, wednesdays [BP] and thursdays.

All this costs us £120 per year individual membership, which is reduced by 25% for vets and another 20% if you do RCO duties - 70% of the entire membership are NRA qualified RCO's including BP and practical shotgun. So I end up paying £76 a year.

There are no other charges of any kind. You can shoot as many different guns as you like, in calibre and muzzle energy up to the limits of the range [4000fps/5000 ft lbs].

We also get 10% discount on ANYTHING in our local gun dealership on production of our membership cards.

tac
Supporter of the Cape Meares Lighthouse Restoration Fund

There is something else going on there besides the wonderwads. There simply is not enough lube in a wonderwad to squeeze out down through the pellet and out the nipple. There isn't that much lube in them even if you squeezed them in a 10 ton press! :shake:
I've never even tried the Pyrodex pellets. I don't consider the "convenience" to be worth the cost, nor do I find misfires and hang fires to be "convenient". I'll leave pellets to the inline boys.

There is an interesting article in Backwoodsman Mag. on pellet powder and the C&P pistol

P

The ignition failure with this combination is one thing; can't say I had problems with ignition when I use Pyrodex powder in my .36 Navy. I did note that even after what I though was good cleaning the products of ignition of this powder would tend to rust my revolver rather horribly. So I now only use black powder.

I can't really say whether there is lube enough or not. All I know is that there was a string of lube sticking out the nipples that was a quarter of and inch long.

As to the cost of the ranges, this is the first time I've ever used a range where I had to pay. I have 5 acres out in the country down in Florida that is 22 miles out of town. Never worried about anything there. Just stepped out the front door, and blasted away. lol!

I believe he said he used "Wonder Seals" these are not Wads. They are grease cookies that Cabelas sells to go over the ball. If you put one of these "Wonder Seals"(not Wonder Wads) between the ball and pellet, it may have well contaminated the pellet...............If you use a grease cookie it should be very stiff (i.e more beeswax)....................Bob

Bingo!!!! You hit the nail right on the head.

I thought they were wads.

Leatherbark said:

I believe he said he used "Wonder Seals" these are not Wads.

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Good point. I missed that. Wonder Seals are NOT Wonder Wads. Go to the RMC web site and notice the difference between the Wonder Wads and Wonder Seals in the Revolver Reload Kit RMC sells. Unfortunately, neither Cabela's nor RMC say how to use the Wonder Seals, but it appears they're intended to be place OVER the ball to seal the chamber instead of Crisco. If that's so, they would certainly cause the mess the OP describes. And they should NOT be used between the ball and powder, regardless of whether the powder is granular or pelletized.

I missed that too :redface: , since I've never layed eyes on the "seals" :idunno: . It's definitely a bad combo!

Only the wonder-wads for me! :haha:

Any wads that are placed between the powder and the ball should be checked before, for excess moisture, before using. I do this all the time now. Why you ask? Well personal experience, I went the way of others on this forum and started making my own wads. I found that some some batches had to much lubrication in them. Causing a wet mess when firing. When placing them in the chambers of the cylinder it wasn't noticable. But after firing a couple of rounds thats when things happened. It seems that when firing on a hot day, when you fire a couple of chambers it heats up the others just enough to cause the lub to liquify in the adjacent chambers, making the powder underneath unfirable. So if your making your own wads, or buying lubricated wads from a cottage industry make sure you test each and every bag, or pouch you open.
One way I found to reduce the amount of lub is place wax paper then a rag down, then your wads laid out, then another rag over the top of the wads this is to prevent them from sticking to the rolling pin your using to squeeze out the excess lub. *note*-DO NOT USE your home rolling pin, get one from a garage sale-(I found this out the hard way) and roll those suckers the rags will absorb the excess lub.

Sounds like "Tasty" advice! :rotf:

I actually use more lube on my wads from time to time, like yesterday with the 10 ga. SxS. I apply extra Bore Butter to the wonder-wads I use for my shotgun, as it keeps the fouling soft and does a great job with lubrication, so the gun is easier to re-load shot after shot! The 10 ga. wonder-wad goes on top of the .125 over-powder card, and underneath the shot cushion wad :wink:

In the Winter, I also apply an extra schmeere of bore butter to my revolver wads for extra lubrication. In the Summer, it's not needed.

Dave

There is a cap and ball forum where some of the guys make what they call "Lube Pills". They are similar to the Wonder seals, but have more beeswax or parafinn in them making them stiffer and not so gooey. Those guys put them behind the ball. I have made them sort of tapered and put them on the ball so the ball looked like an ice cream cone. Grab a ball with its lube pill attached to the back and place it down in against the powder and seat it and cap and fire..............I abandoned the idea,because I found some of my balls( bullets)LOL with the lube still stuck to them, but am interested in trying it again if I could find the original formula.