capping at half-cock

[newkid]

I have a TC Renegade and I 've found with the hammer at half-cock there is very little room between the hammer and the nipple. This makes it very difficult to cap while at half-cock. I've tried several different cappers with no luck, it's even tough to put the cap on with my fingers since the space is almost less then the length of the cap. Consequently, I've been capping with the hammer fully cocked. Is this unusual?

Thanks

 

[rebel727]

There's no half cock. That's the safety notch.

 

[roundball]

Yes, TCs caplock hammers sit in their half cock notch positions very close to the cap...I full cock mine to cap.

Actually, there is no "safety notch" on TC locks...that position is their half cock notch.
It's often thought of as a safety but it's not.

A "Kap Kover", which seals out moisture also has the added benefit of serving as a positive safety.

 

[jtmattison]

There's no half cock. That's the safety notch.

If that's the case then where did the saying "don't go off half cocked" come from?

It should have been "don't go off safety notched"

:haha: Just ribbin' ya!

HD

 

[rebel727]

Then why is it so close to the nipple that you can't cap it from there? Doesn't make sense.

 

[CoyoteJoe]

Then why is it so close to the nipple that you can't cap it from there? Doesn't make sense.

Makes perfect sense, if you view it as the safety position and not the "capping position". In a well designed percussion lock the half-cock position is so low one would not even think of trying to cap the nipple in that position. This is so that if the hammer should fall from half-cock it will not develop enough impact to fire the cap. A very low half-cock also covers the cap to protect against an accidental blow against some foreign object. The T/C percussion locks actually have a rather high half-cock position, a good percussion lock may have a half-cock set so low that if barely clears the cap.
Flint locks require a high half-cock position for the flint to clear the frizzen. When flints were converted to percussion they retained the original flint tumbler and so would also have a high half-cock. Many makers of modern percussion locks have followed the same plan, using the same internals for both flint and percussion locks. That works but is not the best plan.

 

[Runner]

I cap in the fully cocked position and then lower the hammer onto the cap. I firmly set the cap on the nipple with the hammer. Then I return to the halfcock position.

 

[BrownBear]

Same for Lyman.

 

I cap in the fully cocked position and then lower the hammer onto the cap. I firmly set the cap on the nipple with the hammer. Then I return to the halfcock position.

Ditto! Many of the old original Hawkens are made the same way. Very little hammer travel from halfcock to the nipple. I used to time mine the same way on purpose. Less chance of losing a cap when traveling with it primed.

 

[roundball]

Then why is it so close to the nipple that you can't cap it from there? Doesn't make sense.

It sounds like you're making an assumptiuon that you should be able to cap it from the half cock notch...and I agree it's too bad there's not more room so it would be easy to cap one from there, but as to..."why is it so close to the nipple"...you'd have to take up that design discussion with TC...I was just clarifying that it's called a half cock notch.

 

[rebel727]

Then why is it so close to the nipple that you can't cap it from there? Doesn't make sense.

It sounds like you're making an assumptiuon that you should be able to cap it from the half cock notch...and I agree it's too bad there's not more room so it would be easy to cap one from there, but as to..."why is it so close to the nipple"...you'd have to take up that design discussion with TC...I was just clarifying that it's called a half cock notch.

Ok, but it shouldn't be called half cock, more like 1/32 cock. :grin:

 

[Zonie]

IMO Several of the folks who have posted are doing things the right way.

Those who said they were capping at full cock, then lowering the hammer all the way to the cap and then placing it on half cock (or safety notch or 1/32 cock) are doing it right.

I say this just to alert the folks who own a rifle with a set trigger to the fact that once the hammer has been brought to a full cock position it cannot be lowered directly into the half cock notch. It must be allowed to go below the half cock position and then be brought back up to it.

In the case of the TC's and the Lyman GPR/GPH that means the hammer must go almost completely down to the cap before it's raised.

WARNING: If you have "lowered the hammer" directly to "half cock" from the full cock position and it seemed to stop there, the sear is hung up on the fly and it may fall at any time without touching the trigger.

zonie

 

[paulvallandigham]

The half cock notch on your gun is designed to be so close so the cap won't fall off the nipple when you are walking with the gun in your arms, and the hammer is lowered to half cock. Put the cap on at full cock, and then lower the hammer to the half cock notch. Simple. And Safe

 

[CoyoteJoe]

Actually Paul, it's as Zonie said above, cap at full cock, lower the hammer all the way down on the cap, then pull back to half-cock. If the lock has no fly in the tumbler you can go from full to half-cock but if that becomes a habit it will get one into trouble when working with a lock with a fly. Even with shotguns which have no fly in the tumbler, I find it best to lower the hammer, press on it a bit to assure the cap is fully seated, then draw the hammer back until I hear it click into half-cock.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Joe: Thanks for making that clarification. I always lower the hammer and then bring it back to half cock because my locks have flies in them. I should have made that process clear. I have actually heard grown men claim they are AFRAID to attempt to lower a hammer on a capped nipple because " It might slip"! My answer to that is " if your hands are so weak that you can not safely lower a hammer from full cock to rest without it slipping, then you should not be handling that gun! "

 

[Don B]

Is there any reason to not walk with the capped gun with hammer down on the nipple? Is there any real risk of snagging the hammer and firing the cap from the hammer down position?

 

[roundball]

Is there any reason to not walk with the capped gun with hammer down on the nipple? Is there any real risk of snagging the hammer and firing the cap from the hammer down position?

Absolutely there is.

Just last year or so one of the hunting mags carried an article where it's thought that a man in a treestand died that way when pulling his loaded caplock up on a rope muzzle first which was totally stupid of course...but speculation is that the hammer caught on tree bark or a tree step enough to pull it back some, then when it slipped past the obstacle, the hammer fell back down on the cap.

A Kap Kover provides good additional caplock safety...(Google it up)

 

[paulvallandigham]

You don't want to be walking around with the hammer resting on that percussion cap, Only a little motion lifting that hammer and then letting it drop will often set off the cap. Now, if you are walking around with NO CAP on the nipple, the gun would be safe. Make a hammerstall for your percussion gun out of a .30 cal. carbine or .25 auto casing cut to fit over the nipple and cap, but not touch the cap on the inside of the casing. Tie a string to the recessed rim, and then tie the other end to your trigger guard. To shoot, all you have to do is cock the hammer to full cock, and reach forward and pull the casing off the nipple. If you put a small "O-ring " over the base of the nipple, it will provide good water seals so you can protect your powder charge in wet weather, too.

Both Roundball and I am are assuming you are asking about walking around with that hammer on a capped nipple! That is very dangerous, and you will not be doing that on any range I am on for long, nor will you be doing so around me in the field.

 

[CoyoteJoe]

You bet!! As a teenager I had a very narrow escape from a 12 gauge Ml shotgun. I was hunting pheasants with my dad. We had hunted out one farm and were just going to drive 1/4 mile to the next farm. Dad had his double ML shotgun and the caps were a very tight fit, very hard to remove, so he set the hammers down on the caps and slid it onto the back seat. I guess he thought full down was safer than half-cock. When we stopped at the next place we both got out to retrieve our guns from the back, from opposite sides of the four door auto. Dad grasped his gun by the toe of the stock and started to pull it toward him as I was reaching in from the other side for my own gun. His front bead snagged in the seat cover and his fingers slipped off the stock. His gun dropped less than a foot but with one hammer directly across the barrels of my own gun and KAWHOOM!! I was engulfed in a world of smoke and flying debris! He had a glass jar of birdshot also sitting on the backseat and that caught the full blast. I was hit with flying glass and birdshot but with no force to it. It took a while before we were both sure I was not hurt, then we laughed ourselves sick as we stuffed handfuls of snow into the seat to extinguish the fire! :haha: Of course that was an unsafe practice with guns of any kind but it showed me that it doesn't take much of a blow to fire a percussion cap, at least some times it doesn't.

 

[Zonie]

CoyoteJoe: That's exactly the way several people on the Oregon Trail got killed according to some of the stories I've read which were written by the settlers. The only difference was the accident occurred while someone was pulling their capped gun out of their wagon.
zonie :hmm: