anybody here interested in in a preengraved cast boolit or round ball?

[BlackHillsBob]

if so i will post my experience with them, all good.

 

[Rich]

if so i will post my experience with them, all good.

Ok I will bite. Only engraved I have ever tried were the Lee REAL stuff.

 

[BlackHillsBob]

years ago i had a 45 cal barrel made 3 inches longer than what i wanted. 1/28 twist. cut off those 3 inches and used that piece to preengrave a cast boolit. took out 1and1/2 inches of lands to the bottome of the grooves. threaded the out side to fit a loading press. i would push through 400 grain cast lubed bullets with the loading press to preengrave the bullet. shot 100 grains of real black, a 60 thousands wad and the preengaved bullet. they are easy to load, must be of pure lead and they are the most accurate i have ever shot. sold the gun to a florida shooter who shoots hogs with it. shot lots of deer with it before i sold it. same power as a 45/100. as to a round ball ive done this many a time. not exactly preengraved. more like shooting with out a patch. powder, felt or 60 thousands wad, your choise. then tap a over sized round ball into the muzzle and place on powder and wad with a regular ram rod. very very accurate and never any leading problems. figured if my handguns can shoot a unpatched round ball so could a round ball rifle. i was right, they shoot with out a problem. the preengraved bullet in a muzzleloader was invented by a california shooter back in the 1950/s read about it tried it, and best shooting gun ive ever owned.so let the couple of naysayers rip this, rip the guy in calif if he is still alive. its the same as shooting a muzzleloader with a starter only no need for the starter. thanks for asking about it.

 

[Carbon 6]

I've heard of that technique before.

 

[Sinner]

Sounds interesting. Anyone else ever try pushing an oversized unpatched ball through their barrel? How'd they shoot? Do they get progressively harder to load?

 

[BlackHillsBob]

as with any shooting and real black, one needs to wipe between rounds but not clean the rifle as to put away. the most powder i used on a 45 this way was 60 grains. never shot over 50 yards but the group was very small and consistant. i think from experience that a 5 to 6 thousands deep grooves works better for this than a 3 or 4 thousands deep grooves. as to a preengraved cast bullet. its the same a someone who starts with a starter but one doesnt need a starter when you preengrave it. i like paperpatched bullets but preengraved is a step up from them and their isnt any negatives with it.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

More traditional information. What do you have against the old patched round ball? I have shot a lot of big 500gr bullets, but I shot them through Sharps rifles.

 

[BlackHillsBob]

nothing against it, their are a lot of shooters who live in areas like alaska. they want something heavier, also some like to shoot muzzleloaders to 1000 yards, that is traditional. 9 inch groups at 1000 yards with a muzzleloader, that has been done. a preengraved bullet can do all of that. stick to the round ball if you want. dont hunt out west where the range for deer and elk and antelope is 200 yards and beyond. the leader of our black powder meets said this. most guy who shoot muzzleloaders in the forest could load any thing even backwards and get their deer at their short yardage. out here where its prairie meets the pines it is a different story. it takes a gun that can shoot 200 yards and beyond. he also said im tired of those guys who cant stop yapping when all they get is volkswagon size groups at 50 yards and call it good. want to see how to shoot, read every thing you can about idaho ron. he is a real shooter at any range who brings the meat home in a landscape that is beautiful open western landscape at any range. dont listen to the guys who try to attach them selves to idaho ron, they are wantabies, idaho ron is the real deal, connect with him and you can hunt anything and do it it at any range. dont forget that their are a guy or two who wants to steal idaho rons stuff,that all they are doing stealing it with no knowledge of their own. idaho ron has a lot o knowledge and if you preengrave a special built rifle or use paper patch you can go to alaska and get anything up their. havent heard from ted from alaska for awhile. listen to him. he is a shooter from alaska who knows how to hunt the serious hunting country. my piece for to day. just want this site to shine with info.

 

[Rich]

Ah, answered my question. Your "engraving" tool is part of orig barrel. Was wondering how you would match the rifling.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Who in the heck is Idaho ron, the governor? I have been fully aware of long range target muzzleloaders and their capabilities for at least 35 years.
If you can't get any closer than 200 yards to your game, muzzleloaders aren't for you. You need to look into BPCR's. I have killed all of my deer at 50 yards or less with a .62 smooth bore with a round ball. I took one deer with a .50 rifle @ 125 yards with a PRB, that was when I was young and could see. These days 60 or 70 yards would be my max range. Some ML that shoots a 500gr slug to 200 yards and beyond would be useless for hunting since I'm not capable of guessing the range accurately enough to calculate the rainbow trajectory those big 500 gr bullets fly in. I seriously doubt there are many who could shoot past 500 yards with open sights well enough to consistently humanely kill an animal.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

BTW, for those hunting large game there are options other than a big long bullet. The larger round ball calibers are very effective on large game.

 

[FishDFly]

"Who in the heck is Idaho ron, the governor?"

One of the more respected and knowledgeable members here.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

"Who in the heck is Idaho ron, the governor?"

One of the more respected and knowledgeable members here.

Sorry, never read a post by him.

 

[Tobee]

I've heard of that technique before.

Me too. Search or google "false muzzle"

 

[Sinner]

I dare say a .54 with 100 grains of fffg will kill anything in North America... too many people have already done it.
Back to pre engraving a roundball; I'm going to have to get some .58 roundballs and try a few. I just happen to have a couple inches that I cut off to shorten my barrel some.

 

[Bad Karma]

Long time ago I had a Wesson .45 target rifle. It came with a loading tool and the false muzzle was indexed by a couple of pins that mated with corresponding holes in the muzzle. I shot bore sized.45 bullets from 385 grains up to 500 grains over 70 to 90 grain powder charges. It was an accurate rifle and along the way I gave it to a good friend who was at that time a marksmanship instructor. He still has that rifle, he thinks as much of it as I do.

 

[RAEDWALD]

What shape is the ball once it has been pushed through the rifled stub? Pre the patched ball, the groove sized ball was knocked down the bore and deformed into the rifling with an 'iron pin and mallet' and the nose half deformed something horrid. The same applied to the Delvigne rifle where the land sized bullet was pushed down to a ledge above a smaller powder chamber and then deformed into the rifling by blows of a heavy ram rod which did no good at all to the nose of the ball.

i would guess that the swedge (for that is the function of your stub barrel) would need to have a nose that nearly matched the land size and was concave as a hemisphere. Do you apply any lubricant to the ball/stub when sizing to engrave the rifling?

 

[BlackHillsBob]

sinner, your on the right track and if you engrave it right, you will like the results. as to lubing the cast bullet, it is lubed before i push it through the 3 inch piece of barrel taken from the end of the barrel. it comes out perfectly engaved as shot in water, ready to load. who is idaho ron? a very very well known paperpatched bullet shooter and teacher of the same. round balls are great but their is more to shooting than round balls. i get a kick out of guys who say your not a hunter unless you can get within 30 yards of the game. those remarks speak for them selves. some guys expose way too much of them selves. thats ok, its a free speech country.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

sinner, your on the right track and if you engrave it right, you will like the results. as to lubing the cast bullet, it is lubed before i push it through the 3 inch piece of barrel taken from the end of the barrel. it comes out perfectly engaved as shot in water, ready to load. who is idaho ron? a very very well known paperpatched bullet shooter and teacher of the same. round balls are great but their is more to shooting than round balls. i get a kick out of guys who say your not a hunter unless you can get within 30 yards of the game. those remarks speak for them selves. some guys expose way too much of them selves. thats ok, its a free speech country.

Scoff at me if you like, but you'd be hard pressed to find a place to shoot more than a 100 yards hunting deer around here. I know out west there's a need, but a PRB has never failed me deer hunting in the Midwest. And, I have a lot of experience shooting heavy bullets in BPCR's so it isn't like I'm some sort of moron.

 

[shane a gress]

What were the eastern elk and buffalo killed with?