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TC-Hoyt .58 replacement barrel

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Dunno. That skinny barrel made me stop at 100, then back off to 80 like you. Kinda loopy trajectory, but since I carry it mostly for quick handling in close quarters, it's more than adequate.
 
Well heck, I gotta work again today. I am very anxious to get to the range and put all this knowledge that y'all have so kindly given to use. Maybe tomorrow.
 
Fyrstyk said:
I have a Bobby Hoyt re-bored .58 barrel on my Johnathan Browning Mountain Rifle. The barrel is 30" long with a 1:66 round ball twist. This rifle likes 120 Grains of 2f as it's hunting load. 1.5" high at 50 yards, pretty much dead on at 75 yards, and 2.5" low at 100 yards.

Sounds like you have found yer sweet spot. Why mess with success? Or, as BB suggested, do double pours.
 
Got a little range time. 80y, .570 Hornady, 100g ff goex. 9th to 13th shots on 8x11 paper. After 9th shot picked up couple patches, ox-yoke pre lubed .015. But for a few threads they would have been donuts. That and the amount of sight adjustment tells me these are first shots thru rebore.

Switched to Tracks dry .018 strip and smeared bore butter. A lot less cutting on them but still not satisfactory. After cleaning I worked some J-B paste in it. Ordered some mink oil and stuff from Tracks.

Shooting from sand bags with left hand at toe for elevation the 100g charge was comfortable. When I get the cutting of patches out of the way I'll work up to 120g.
 
CO Elkeater said:
When I get the cutting of patches out of the way....

I've been on hand for the break-in of 3 of the GM 58 cal drop-ins, and every one was a patch cutter to start with. But shooting took care of that pretty quick. Sounds like you're right on track! Good things in your future with that great barrel, I bet.
 
Thanks BB,

The nipple is a new type to me. It has a groove around it thats about where the end of the cap comes to. The #11 caps fit perfect with firm thumb push. I wish I knew where to get more.

The rear sight is TC fiber optic. I like the shape but not sure of the fibers.
 
I used to like them as well. They function well, but I had trouble with splits. Took a while but they'd eventually split from the mouth down one side. I could avoid it by changing them every few hundred shots, but found TOW's stainless steel nipples worked just as well and last a whole lot longer.
 
If are shooting a Bobby Hoyt 58 caliber 1-60 with radius bottom rifling your patch material WAY too thin in my opinion. And how you measure that patch thickness is also in my opinion a big deal.

In the two Bobby Hoyt 58s I have I use denim patching material. Measuring it with plain old dial calipers it measures .030”. With a mic tightened to it's friction ratchet the same material is .024”. Going to as tight a squeeze as I am comfortable with subjecting my mics to, it will measure about .019”. Using my preferred method, an old mic I have for checking sheet metal (anvil is a ball or radius, so only getting point contact when measuring) the same material that measured .030” with calipers, consistently measures .016” with normal finger pressure on the mic.

Don’t remember particulars about the barrels, but believe they both plug at .580. My Lee two cavity mold is pretty consistent if l am when casting and produces .565” diameter balls (mold size is .562”) that weigh between 270 and 271 grains with my lead mix (yes I weigh them for all serious shooting) and I use a dry lube for my patches.

As a FYI, you may want to get Dutch Schoultz”˜s system. http://www.blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/
 
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II think you are doing everything bouts correctly as possible.. Measureing with a caliper risks bending the instrument which would be hame.
I have no experience with the Lee two cavity moulds. The American allowance for tolerance can frequently give two slightly varying side balls from the separate c amities which might throw you off a bit. But if the balls from each cavity weigh the same, then the balls must be remarkably close.

The importance of very small differences in shooting patch thickness was a total accident on my part. I am still not clear in my mind why it is so. It just Is, as you bride might give as a reason.

With all your care, I must ask what kind of groups you get, bench rest at 50 yards?

Thanks for your thoughts about yourprecedures.

Dutch Schoultz
 
Hi Dutch

Always good to hear from you. Have had your system for years.

As far as MY two cavity Lee mold, it has proven to be accurate. The diameters and weights were at the tip of my tongue as I did some casting yesterday. Did a quick capability study (30 pieces) and found one cavity to average 270.4 grains and the other 270.6 using a pretty accurate digital scale. As long as I am consistent with how I cast, 90% plus of what I cast are +/-.5 grains.

Groups at 50 yards off a rest? If I do my part (if my eyes do their part) both the 58s, the flint and the caplock, will have 5 shots pretty much touching. Center to center, a bit over an inch, although some days a little better.

Dutch, keep posting.

dave
 
SDSmlf,
It seems you have the ball weights in order. Some of the old brass double cavity molds were a bit far apart in weights. I have never considered using a double mold because of that concern,

As far as keeping posting I am trying to minimize my too frequent appearances on the Forum.

A gunsmith friend from beyond the mountains will be spending Sat and Sunday visiting here. He has a business converting standard modern rifles into rifles that are accurate over a double thousand yards. He sells these to MarineSnper teams who have been sending him fan mail from the war zone(s). It should be intereting. He shoots ML BP rifles for fun and has just as much trouble convincing folks to use the System as I do..

Thanks for your post

Dutch Schoultz
 
CO ElkeaterYour question about patching and ball size is somewhat meaningless to me because rhee .015 and .018 measurements are uncompressed measurements and only mean anything to me when measured in the compressed method.
I have found some .018 cloth material to compress a bit more than the ,015 cloth.
When the patch is in use, crushed between ball and barrel wall hit is the compressed size that is important.

The general rule of the biggest ball with the tightest patch will give you the best results. If either of those two fabrics are working well for you, that is something of a coincidence,

The central core of my System is based on the answer to your question.

If you are having success with a cloth sold as being .018 which compresses to a somewhat thinner measurement and you run out, the replacement cloth of .018 may compress more or less and not be right for your rifle.

It will drive you nuts.

I lost my patching supply so I bought some more of the same (uncompressed) thickness and couldn't load it. Figuring out the difference between the two fabrics is the basis for my System which you definitely do not use or you would not have asked that question.

I was surprised how very very small differences in shooting patch compressed thicknesses could so dramatically affect the accuracy of a ML rifle.

Sorry to not be able to answer your question as asked.

Dutch Schoultz
 
CO Elkeater said:
Dutch Schoultz said:
CO ElkeaterYour question about patching and ball size is somewhat meaningless to me

My instinct tells me to use the largest ball possible that can be used with a quality patch. Am I on track?

My experience is a little more "detailed" than that. What you say is certainly true with shallow rifling. But I've had my best luck with thicker patching loaded tight when the rifling is deeper or sharper.

My bud also has a GM 58 drop-in and was having his problems with .575 balls and ticking that ran .014-.015, depending how you measure it. I developed my load using .570 balls and heavier ticking that runs .018-.019, again depending on how I measure it. He was also using the fair-haired liquid lube of the day (Hoppes, as I recall), but switched to the same grease I use (TOW mink tallow).

His issues went away, but now I have an issue. I have to go to his house to collect my .570 mold whenever I need it! :rotf:
 
I look at the issue a little differently. With my Hoyt .58 I found a .575 ball with a mink oil lubed .015 (compressed) pillow ticking patch gave me the accuracy I was looking for (3"@ 75 yards open sights) and still allowed me to make a reasonably quick reload using the wooden ram rod that came with the gun without swabbing between shots. I can get better accuracy using a .018-.020 denim patch with mink oil( 1.5" @ 75 yards), but it requires a brass or steel range rod and significant effort to seat the ball. Not conducive to quick followup shots if necessary. In my hunting loads I lean towards easy loading in the field and will sacrifice some accuracy.
 
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