"SWAMPED" BARRELS??? Intended or poor workmanship?

[springfield art]

Your source is not only wrong but totally ignorant as well. Swamped barrels had lighter weight and caused the rifle to handle better than a straight barreled one. It was and is done on purpose. That's why they were so common and so popular.

Right on!

 

[Relic shooter]

I agree but in the thread last week about octagon rifles and round barrel rifles I was told that the swamped barrel was failure of the gunsmith to draw file the barrel properly. In fact the person replying to me said that swamped barrels were no more than poor workmanship but sense the rifles exist with swamped barrels we are only following their imperfections

Wrong on all counts,, sounds like comments from a moron or perhaps an early April fools prank ..
OR,, could be I'm crazy for collecting & shooting rifles & pistols with swamped barrels for past 60 years

 

[th1840]

Watch the Gunsmith of Williamsburg and see him make a barrel from a flat piece of iron, forge weld it then bore it. Pay attention to what he says about he says while he draw files the barrel, swamping it.

It is done to lighten the barrel, balance the rifle and give it less of a nose heavy feel. It does not weaken the barrel and is done on purpose.

It's a intended design having the thickest at the breach where the charge is and then taking the weight off down the barrel but swelling slightly at muzzle so you don't have a tall front site. Can you imagine trying to hold a 1 1/8 x 44-46" long barrel ? They knew what they were doing

 

[Relic shooter]

This well balanced big bore Jaeger with swamped barrel weighs in @ 7.25 lbs., the same type rifle with a straight profiled barrel would weigh in @ approx. 12 lbs.

 

[Rudyard]

In 1966 I was still in School, how the hell have you lasted so long ?

But in 2003 our blokes with the Brits were "touring" Kurdistan introducing Javelins to the Iraqi Armour annoying the Peshmerga at the time; it was the sunset of my Army career.
We found the Kurds to be good folk, their women are damn fierce warriors understandable considering their history.

Well I was 21 Good question as to longevity but Ime still here. Ime sure there must be some Good Kurds I just met some B' er' illegitimate' ones had to fight them off with a length of wood on a truck .And they pinched my sheath knife I wore on my West Africa travel's the year before .I was heading for India but couldn't afford the 10 $ visa for Afghanistan so ran the southern route entering Persia at Macoo then hitched to Tabriz but found busses where cheap so went Kerman ,Isfahne / Ziadan to Nokundi & into Balluchistan thence down to Karachi & took a Pilgrim ship to Bombay as the Lahore Ferozapore border was closed due to the useual war with India . cost me 16 pounds to reach Bombay from Milano . Other night we et out my meal cost more than that ! . Different world today .I did on the run back to UK via Darwin /Portugees Timor go through Afghanistan but it was pre Russian Invasion 1969 All I' fought' was ginnourmous bed bugs in a flop house. they won ! I retreated to the flat roof . However I digress but I did buy a dozen flint locks after a long & expected haggle for 10 Shilling apiece (100 Afghanis) at black market rate which wasnt much better than bank rate but saved the paper work & time . Ive had too much fun that's my secret or excuse .
Regards Rudyard

 

[M. De Land]

There will be no difference in accuracy in a decent Swamped barrel that I am aware of. Bench rest stuff that weighs 15lbs, using heavy straigh barrels soem with false muzzles etc,, are purpose made and not a realistic comparison . IMHO

I'm talking about stand up target shooting not bench rifles. The awamped are a delight to look at, carry and shoot but for top accuracy the straight or straight taper carry the day from what I can learn .

 

[Coinneach]

Well I was 21 Good question as to longevity but Ime still here. Ime sure there must be some Good Kurds I just met some B' er' illegitimate' ones had to fight them off with a length of wood on a truck .And they pinched my sheath knife I wore on my West Africa travel's the year before .I was heading for India but couldn't afford the 10 $ visa for Afghanistan so ran the southern route entering Persia at Macoo then hitched to Tabriz but found busses where cheap so went Kerman ,Isfahne / Ziadan to Nokundi & into Balluchistan thence down to Karachi & took a Pilgrim ship to Bombay as the Lahore Ferozapore border was closed due to the useual war with India . cost me 16 pounds to reach Bombay from Milano . Other night we et out my meal cost more than that ! . Different world today .I did on the run back to UK via Darwin /Portugees Timor go through Afghanistan but it was pre Russian Invasion 1969 All I' fought' was ginnourmous bed bugs in a flop house. they won ! I retreated to the flat roof . However I digress but I did buy a dozen flint locks after a long & expected haggle for 10 Shilling apiece (100 Afghanis) at black market rate which wasnt much better than bank rate but saved the paper work & time . Ive had too much fun that's my secret or excuse .
Regards Rudyard

Man what a life you've already lived sir, are you related to one Richard Burton (not the bloke with the impressive voice who married Liz Taylor) ?

Somehow, some time....somewhere we're going to have to meet and compare notes and reasonable Wines Rudyard.

 

[pwbsmokey]

I would think if a swamped barrel was poor workmanship, no two flats would be filed the same. Which is not the case

 

[The Appalachian]

Another reason/theory for swamped barrels (as told to me, I can't prove it) was that with the soft iron used for barrels back in the day, the swamping absorbed much of the harmonic vibration caused by the exploding powder and gave much better accuracy than a straight barrel. Any expert input that can explain or refute this would be appreciated.

I'm not an expert but I've paid my dues with long range precision rifles, and learning/understanding what makes them work, and what doesn't work, at that game. I owe much of that education to a good friend and neighbor of mine named Dan Newberry of OCW internet fame who delved into understanding barrel harmonics and figuring out a practical way to address the issue while handloading modern smokeless ammunition. I've used his knowledge and a chronograph to evolve my own process further and can now achieve a fantastic load with very minimal expenditure of components.

There's a ton of myth and misunderstanding all over the 'net about "barrel harmonics". I won't go into all that, because volumes could be written about just the myth and misunderstanding.

The knowledge about it is relatively new in terms of weapons history, and really wouldn't be something that original builders and shooters would have understood, much less actually done something to address it. There was no means then to measure pressure curves, or the need to, to discover "harmonics".

It wasn't necessary to understand. Today we know that the pressure curve of blackpowder is much different than modern smokeless. A muzzleloader's explosion of a BP charge is much more "gentle", for the lack of a better term, and any "harmonics" are hidden in the weight of the muzzleloader, how it's constructed, and how they are shot. The contained (metallic cartidge case) extremely rapid burn of modern smokless is a much faster and sharper pressure curve, and produces a much more noticeable "harmonics" situation. Do note that despite the technical definitions of the two propellants, our perception of their respective internal ballistics are completely opposite their definitions.

Barrel harmonics really only come into play with modern smokeless rifles that use a free floated barrel and a solid platform, ie glass bedded into a quality stock or the use of a CNC machined chassis. It really is only then that a shooter/handloader can see the effects of harmonics on the paper they shoot holes into. And then you also have to understand what you're looking at, actual harmonics or some other hiccup in the system. None of that applies to our primitive weapons, even remotely.

Sure, you could construct a free floated muzzleloader mounted in a solid platform, and with extremely precise and consistent loads, probably measure some slight effect of harmonic vibrations moving up and down the length of the barrel until they dissipate, but even the mental part of that is outside the narrow scope of the original builders/shooters knowledge. And it's way outside the practicality of what we do with our flintlocks and caplocks.