I Have This Old Rifle...

[Badfinger]

My grandfather acquired this 1858 Eli Whitney Rifle/Musket sometime in the mid-1930s. He was living in Pennsylvania at the time and the story goes that he came home from work as an elderly neighbor lady was placing it in a trash bin. When Grandad inquired about it the neighbor pulled it out and handed it to him. She told him it belonged to her late husband, and she didn’t want it in her closet. Into grandad’s closet it went.

Grandad moved to Ohio and brought it along. A high school friend of dad’s was injured in an accident and laid-up for months and during that time dad gave him the gun to refurbish. Unfortunately, that included inserting dice or dominos into the stock. Dang! At some time around 1949 he gave it to my father and after getting married he took it to their home and back into the closet it went.

Then a few years ago it came to my closet then safe.....

I have some qustions.
It is .58 and has rifling. Is it a rifle or musket?
I'm wondering if this old piece is ruined or can be restored or there are ny replacement stocks around. What if anything would you do with this piece?

 

[64Springer]

It's a Rifle Musket.

Very nice piece.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Moving this to Antiques...,

That's an M-1855, not an 1858, and IF the lock is a functioning Maynard Tape lock, then that is a rare version, one of 350 issued to the 8th Conn. Volunteer Infantry... here's what I found....,

From an College Hill Arsenal website...,

One of the scarcer examples of Whitney “Good & Serviceable” arms was the US M-1855 Type Rifle Musket (Flayderman 5J-036). According to arms historian, researcher and author Howard M. Madaus, Whitney purchased 350 condemned US M-1855 Maynard Tape Primer locks from the Harper’s Ferry arsenal. Unlike the guns built with unfinished M-1855 locks (Whitney “High Hump” and “Low Hump” guns), these locks were complete and functional, with the tape primer mechanism in place. Based upon extant examples, the majority of these locks were dated 1858, although a few were dated 1857 and some were apparently undated (or the dates were removed). Using these locks as a basis, he produced a .58 rifle musket that outwardly resembled the US M-1855, but had a number of unique differences. The guns were iron mounted, with flat, spring retained bands and pewter forend caps. The guns had a pair of brass, wing-shaped lock screw escutcheons, similar to those found on P-1853 Enfield pattern rifle muskets, and were possibly left over parts from the Robbins & Lawrence Enfield contracts. The guns had 40” round barrels that were rifled with 7 grooves. This pattern of rifling is unique to Whitney’s M-1855 type rifle-muskets; with the 7-groove rifling system typically only encountered his shorter rifle length arms. The guns were equipped with one of two patterns of rear sights. The Type I was a long-base ladder sight, similar to those found on early US M-1855 rifle muskets and rifled and sighted US M-1842 muskets. The less common, Type II rear sight, was a simple L-shaped leaf sight with a large aperture hole. The guns utilized simple, straight shank ramrods (instead of the swelled shank rods used on US M-1855 rifle muskets), and typically had tulip shaped heads. Some with brass heads or tips have been noted as well. The guns are usually devoid of any markings (including barrel proofs), other than the re-stamped Whitney markings on the locks. The bands do not bear the usual “U” of US arms, nor do the buttplate tangs have the “US’ mark. As the guns were sold at the state level, the guns are not encountered with US inspector cartouches. According to most researchers, only 350 of these M-1855 Type Rifle Muskets were produced by Whitney, with the majority being delivered to the state of Connecticut. From there it appears that almost all of the guns were issued to the 8th Connecticut Volunteer Infantry. The 8th Connecticut Volunteer Infantry was organized in Hartford in September of 1861 and initially saw service in the Department of North Carolina. From there they joined the Army of the Potomac, serving during Lee’s Maryland Campaign at both South Mountain and Antietam. The 8th also took part in the battle of Fredericksburg. From there they spent a number of months in service on the Virginia peninsula, eventually joining Grant’s army for the battle of Cold Harbor and the Petersburg Campaign. Their final battle was that of Fair Oaks during the final days of the war, and the regiment spent time occupying both Richmond and Lynchburg, VA, before being mustered out at Lynchburg in December of 1865.


SO you have a rare piece, from is seen so far....,
LD

 

[Badfinger]

Thank you 64springer

 

[Notchy Bob]

It looks like a Model 1855 US Rifle Musket with the Maynard tape primer system.

Notchy Bob

EDIT: Dave beat me to it, by about five seconds! That's a nice write-up.

The NRA has a column in The American Rifleman entitled "I Have This Old Gun." The NRA also puts these on their website, sometimes with a video. They did a nice job with the M1855. Here is a link: U.S. Model 1855 Rifle-Musket

...and "rifle-musket" is the correct terminology for that type of firearm.

Notchy Bob

 

[64Springer]

Shame someone cut off the lower sling loop.

 

[Badfinger]

Yes it is, actually part of the loop is still there I believe it was broken.

I remember as kids we thought this was fake or made for reinactors to fire caps.

 

[Kansas Jake]

What a nice piece in spite of the old inlays.

 

[64Springer]

OP.

I may be talking out of my butt, but I think much of the 1861 Springfield was derived from the 1855.

If so, a trigger guard sling loop from an 1861 may fit your 1855.

The question is would the hurt the rifle's genuineness or not.

Is the cut off sling loop a part of the rifle's history?

Would a quality repair enhance the rifle by bringing her back to original configuration?


P.S. Lodgewood Manufacturing may be able to help you. They did a hell of a job helping me with my '64 Springer.

 

[appalichian hunter]

The sling loop is an easy fix, do some online searching and you can find an original it should be attached to the guard with a screw. If not it will be a pin that can be punched out with light taps(use a brass drift for this or even better yet is a plastic type drift) As to the holes in the stock, get some walnut and patch them, then match the color as close as you can get with some fiebings leather dark brown dye (use the regular dye not the low VOC type) and oil the areas really good. the repairs won't disappear but will be less noticeable. Nice gun. I would not re-stock this gun, you want to retain as much of the original as possible. If it is what Dave posted, you have a treasure.

 

[64Springer]

Personally, I would not fill in those butt stock carvings.

They are tastefully and carefully done by whoever carved them.

There may be meaning behind them. Though we'll never know.

Could be Civil War trench art.

 

[appalichian hunter]

Read the original post stated someone in layed dice or dominoes in those holes long after the war.

 

[64Springer]

My bad.

But until I see the dice and dominoes, it's trench art.

As those holes are not designed to hold dice or dominoes.

 

[Badfinger]

Thanks guys, I really appreciate all the information as well as your opinions. As far as dice or whatever was to be inlaid in the stock, my brothers and I just guessed that it happened when my dad let his friend "clean it up" and nobody knows for sure because dad has passed. We never thought about the possibility of Civil War trench art.

Thanks 64Springer, P.S. Lodgewood Manufacturing looks like a possibility.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Yes it is, actually part of the loop is still there I believe it was broken.

View attachment 235075

I remember as kids we thought this was fake or made for reinactors to fire caps.

CONGRATULATIONS

LD

 

[Badfinger]

If This Old Rifle Could Talk This Would Be One of The Stories:

Around 1977 or so I took dad's rifle-musket to a local gun store and range and after much discussion and debate, the staff decided it was safe to shoot. I proceeded to buy patches, balls, musket caps, everything necessary to try it out.

Once on the range I fired a couple of caps to check it out and was told to try about fifty grains of FFg powder. I hung a target on a heavy cardboard backer at 25 yards. While loading I got concerned about the condition of the rifle and backed the load down a little bit, I do not remember how much but with a RO looking on I proceeded to fire at the target only to see the ball bust about halfway through near the bottom of the target board and fall on the ground.

After much laughter, I was able to regain my composure but not my pride. I noticed an older gentleman walking by to a shooting position and he stopped to admire my rifle. He was tall and thin and extremely polite, a real gentleman and introduced himself as Omer Johnson. He was carrying a nice Kentucky long Rifle.

He asked to look the rifle over and did so then laid it back on an old green army blanket I used to protect it on the steel bench. He said something like that is a nice piece of history you have there, and you know if it were mine, I would put it up an buy a replica for shooting. He then went to shoot his rifle.
I asked the RO about Omer, and he told me Omer was a schoolteacher and champion shooter. As for me I cleaned up the old rifle and took it back to my dad’s closet and never tried to shoot it again.

On the upside I bought a Thompson Center .50 Hawken at the range and shot it. Occasionally, I would see Omer shooting at the range and he would always smile and give me a nod. A few years after our meeting they built a Black Powder range and named it in honor of Omer.

Yesterday, I received a new old stock TC .50 Hawkin barrel and I’m building a replacement for the one I enjoyed so long ago.

 

[Notchy Bob]

That’s a good story. I’m of the opinion, though, that it doesn’t hurt the originals to shoot them, provided they are in shootable condition and they are loaded and cleaned properly. I’m not saying they ought to be carried across the pommel of a saddle while crossing the Rockies. However, the old timers might enjoy a trip to the local range with proper care and handling.

I’ve seen old guns that were shot regularly and kept in fine condition. I’ve also seen fine antiques spoiled by rust and bugs while neglected in storage. The attention they get with occasional handling helps preserve them, and they were made to be shot, after all.

Best regards ,

Notchy Bob

 

[TDM]

You did well @Badfinger

 

[springfield art]

That’s a good story. I’m of the opinion, though, that it doesn’t hurt the originals to shoot them, provided they are in shootable condition and they are loaded and cleaned properly. I’m not saying they ought to be carried across the pommel of a saddle while crossing the Rockies. However, the old timers might enjoy a trip to the local range with proper care and handling.

I’ve seen old guns that were shot regularly and kept in fine condition. I’ve also seen fine antiques spoiled by rust and bugs while neglected in storage. The attention they get with occasional handling helps preserve them, and they were made to be shot, after all.

Best regards ,

Notchy Bob

I agree, Notchy!

 

[Muley Gil]

Many members of the North-South Skirmish Association, including myself, shoot original firearms from the War of Northern Aggression.