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Login Name Post: Help ID this old longrifle - Somerset County PA?        (Topic#307612)
History Buff 
32 Cal.
Posts: 11
06-10-18 06:11 PM - Post#1689206    

Hello - I did a quick search and seems this may have been made in Somerset County. Can anyone add any info for me? Thanks

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Edited by History Buff on 06-10-18 06:14 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

Posts: 12377
06-10-18 08:37 PM - Post#1689220    

    In response to History Buff

It a faux antique reproduction.
The brass tarnish is inconsistent with original wear. The wood wear inclusions are too random to be considered as old from use, and the newness of the fractures also lend discrepancies.
The shiney pin holding the rear TG, raw carvings, with no wrist wear in the finish, but blonde wood at the tang??
Molon Labe~

50 Cal.
Posts: 1090
06-10-18 09:26 PM - Post#1689222    

    In response to History Buff

I do not think the gun is that old, relatively speaking.
The carving looks too recent, as does the wear.

The vent hole was drilled out by someone that knows nothing about flint guns, or flint to percussion conversions. Real authentic old guns have been butchered by amateurs all along, but this gun sends up way too many red flags for me.

Gene L 
50 Cal.
Posts: 1432
06-11-18 11:53 AM - Post#1689295    

    In response to smoothshooter

The carving looks to me like it was done with a rotary tool, like a Dremel. It's not typical of old carving, and is poor quality...IMHO.

Kansas Jake 
50 Cal.
Posts: 1447
06-11-18 01:59 PM - Post#1689315    

    In response to Gene L

Why would someone go to that much trouble to make a faux antique? If they are newer parts the cost would be as much as it might bring unless contributed to a known builder. If old parts put together why do such a poor job on the carving. It is a interesting problem piece.

58 Cal.
Posts: 2134
06-11-18 02:53 PM - Post#1689323    

    In response to Kansas Jake

50 Cal.
Posts: 1090
06-11-18 10:45 PM - Post#1689391    

    In response to Kansas Jake

It's possible SOME of the parts date from the late flint era, possibly even the stock itself. The poor carving may have been added many decades after the stock was made.

54 Cal.
Posts: 1640
06-11-18 11:04 PM - Post#1689393    

    In response to History Buff

Looks like the back of the lock plate area has
been filled it because a Bedford has a long tail.

50 Cal.
Posts: 1090
06-12-18 06:04 AM - Post#1689404    

    In response to Kansas Jake

There are prople with some money that would pay $1000 or more for something like that.

Posts: 1
06-12-18 09:32 AM - Post#1689416    

    In response to History Buff

You need to take this to American Longrifle site, you will get better answers for this rifle.

Edited by POPPY on 06-12-18 09:35 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

Posts: 26538
06-12-18 05:13 PM - Post#1689474    

    In response to History Buff

The patch box is almost exactly like one on a rifle made by Jonathan Dunmyer (1827-1884) who lived in Sipesville, Somerset Co., Pa.

This patch box is shown in "KENTUCKY RIFLE PATCHBOXES, ALL NEW VOLUME 2" by James B Whisker and "Rocky" Chandler, © James B. Whisker 1992. It is listed as photo # 130.

Some seem to feel that "relief" carving is the only type used however this is far from true.
The carving on your rifle is the "incised" type consisting of grooves cut into the surface.

This type of carving was quite common as is shown in many pictures in Joe Kindig, Jr.'s THOUGHTS ON THE KENTUCKY RIFLE IN ITS GOLDEN AGE" and George Shumway's RIFLES OF COLONIAL AMERICA.

As for its quality, as with most things, there are some who can do a splendid job of it and others that are not as talented.
It looks like Johnathan (if he did make this rifle) was not as talented as others.

As for it being a fake, I don't believe it is.
There is little or no good reason for faking an incomplete gun. Without all of its parts it really is not of any great value beyond being a touch with the past.

The differences in the engraving on the patch box is, in my opinion, supportive of the idea that this rifle is not a fake.
Often a craftsman will create something a little different just because he feels like doing so at the time.
A good forger tries to duplicate a existing item as exactly as possible to fool the unsuspecting into thinking it is genuine.
Just Jim...

Edited by Zonie on 06-12-18 05:25 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

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