GreyD
32 Cal
I've been reading a lot of posts and I'm putting this out here because I see all sorts of conflicting information to the point where I'm really irked about it. I know this has been covered before but I haven't read anything that really satisfies me or makes me think anyone really knows what they are talking about. And a lot of the posts seem to conflict with what is being discussed out there about patch lube, which relates to this issue.
There appears to be a majority consensus that modern ML barrels do not need seasoning and/or cannot be seasoned. I read Paul H. Vallandigham's post (here) that some refer to when discussing the "seasoning myth." With all due respect, for the most part I think a good portion of Mr. Vallandigham's post is hooey. He says that modern barrels are made of steel not iron and you don't need to season steel. Hog wash. I have carbon steel (not cast iron) frying pans that absolutely require seasoning or they will rust and food items will stick if you don't. If you have steel cookware that rusts you likely need to season it. Well, ML barrels are for the most part are carbon steel and rust big time if you don't take care of them properly. Mr. Vallandigham's theory that there is no way for oils to penetrate and get burned into and fill the pores of steel also doesn't hold up. If my carbon steel frying pans can retain a coating of seasoning so can a ML barrel. And it seems like some type of seasoning coating would be beneficial both to prevent rust and provide a slick surface in a ML barrel.
My understanding of seasoning a ML barrel is using natural fats/oils as patch lubes enough times during shooting and the high temperatures from powder ignition will result in polymerization of the fat molecules so that they form a hard coating on the surfaces of the barrels. A little different than seasoning a frying pan, of course, where you coat with fat and heat the pan for an extended period of time, but similar in principal. If the coat and bake method is the type of seasoning Mr. Vallandigham was referring to, then I wouldn't do that either. And I'm no expert, but I do have a chemical engineering degree and recognize that polymerization reactions can be quite instantaneous and could occur during the short time of a muzzle blast. That some polymerization of the fat/oil used in patch lube that gets coated on the barrel at the temperatures that occur from burning BP and creates some type of polymerized coating or "seasoning" on the surface of the barrel seems likely. If you are using saliva or some aqueous-based patch lube, okay no, but those that are using fats and oils as patch lube I would say you are getting some type of seasoning on the surfaces of your barrel, even if it is very minute amount. It seems that this would build up to some degree over time. I would also say that this would have some type of protective and slickening effect, just like in a frying pan, which to me would be beneficial.
There appears to be a lot of negativity out there on the seasoning issue - along the "it's a myth" and "you're reducing your bore diameter and filling your rifling grooves" type stuff. And yet, in the discussion of patch lubes there are many members here using oils/fats as patch lube (maybe some that are even in the no-seasoning camp). If the point of the "seasoning is a myth" mantra is that although you are using fats and oils as patch lube it just really doesn't do anything to season a barrel and/or you don't really need to have it seasoned nowadays because it's modern steel and you are cleaning it thoroughly anyway, then okay, fair enough, maybe so. But there are those that claim it is building up and filling the rifling grooves, effectively "seasoning" your barrel with thick layers of seasoning. So seasoning is not a myth, in fact you're getting too much seasoning. So which is it? If it is reducing your bore diameter and filling your rifling, then you shouldn't be using any fats or oils as patch lube, which is a traditional patch lube. You should probably be using spit, moose milk or Dutch Schoultz's dry patch system, etc. and never introduce any natural oil/fat based product in your barrel during shooting whatsoever. Yet, so many members are using natural oil/fat patch lubes.
I can't prove for sure that seasoning occurs to any great degree or not with fat/oil patch lube. Maybe it all gets blown out or washed out during cleaning. It seems unlikely though. I know the seasoned carbon steel frying pans I have don't lose their seasoning even with washing in hot, soapy water. And I do notice that after around 50 rounds or so using a natural fat/oil based patch lube in a new barrel there is a pronounced shift in the amount of fouling that seems to occur and an increase in the number of shots that can be loaded between swabs. If, as some say, it is getting built up and reducing bore diameter and rifling, then the whole "seasoning is a myth" idea gets blown up because you are seasoning your barrel anyway, whether you believe it or not, and can do it way too much. I could see this as a possibility over time if seasoning is in fact occurring and you are adding layer upon layer of seasoning, but I haven't got to that point yet. If there is a definitive post out there someplace about this, I guess I missed it, but I haven't seen anything here or elsewhere that I would call definitive. What would satisfy me is someone taking a cross section of a so-called "seasoned" barrel and analyzing its surface and any coatings it may have and compare it to a similar barrel that has been shot without the use of any natural oils/fats. If that has been done, someone please direct me to it.
There appears to be a majority consensus that modern ML barrels do not need seasoning and/or cannot be seasoned. I read Paul H. Vallandigham's post (here) that some refer to when discussing the "seasoning myth." With all due respect, for the most part I think a good portion of Mr. Vallandigham's post is hooey. He says that modern barrels are made of steel not iron and you don't need to season steel. Hog wash. I have carbon steel (not cast iron) frying pans that absolutely require seasoning or they will rust and food items will stick if you don't. If you have steel cookware that rusts you likely need to season it. Well, ML barrels are for the most part are carbon steel and rust big time if you don't take care of them properly. Mr. Vallandigham's theory that there is no way for oils to penetrate and get burned into and fill the pores of steel also doesn't hold up. If my carbon steel frying pans can retain a coating of seasoning so can a ML barrel. And it seems like some type of seasoning coating would be beneficial both to prevent rust and provide a slick surface in a ML barrel.
My understanding of seasoning a ML barrel is using natural fats/oils as patch lubes enough times during shooting and the high temperatures from powder ignition will result in polymerization of the fat molecules so that they form a hard coating on the surfaces of the barrels. A little different than seasoning a frying pan, of course, where you coat with fat and heat the pan for an extended period of time, but similar in principal. If the coat and bake method is the type of seasoning Mr. Vallandigham was referring to, then I wouldn't do that either. And I'm no expert, but I do have a chemical engineering degree and recognize that polymerization reactions can be quite instantaneous and could occur during the short time of a muzzle blast. That some polymerization of the fat/oil used in patch lube that gets coated on the barrel at the temperatures that occur from burning BP and creates some type of polymerized coating or "seasoning" on the surface of the barrel seems likely. If you are using saliva or some aqueous-based patch lube, okay no, but those that are using fats and oils as patch lube I would say you are getting some type of seasoning on the surfaces of your barrel, even if it is very minute amount. It seems that this would build up to some degree over time. I would also say that this would have some type of protective and slickening effect, just like in a frying pan, which to me would be beneficial.
There appears to be a lot of negativity out there on the seasoning issue - along the "it's a myth" and "you're reducing your bore diameter and filling your rifling grooves" type stuff. And yet, in the discussion of patch lubes there are many members here using oils/fats as patch lube (maybe some that are even in the no-seasoning camp). If the point of the "seasoning is a myth" mantra is that although you are using fats and oils as patch lube it just really doesn't do anything to season a barrel and/or you don't really need to have it seasoned nowadays because it's modern steel and you are cleaning it thoroughly anyway, then okay, fair enough, maybe so. But there are those that claim it is building up and filling the rifling grooves, effectively "seasoning" your barrel with thick layers of seasoning. So seasoning is not a myth, in fact you're getting too much seasoning. So which is it? If it is reducing your bore diameter and filling your rifling, then you shouldn't be using any fats or oils as patch lube, which is a traditional patch lube. You should probably be using spit, moose milk or Dutch Schoultz's dry patch system, etc. and never introduce any natural oil/fat based product in your barrel during shooting whatsoever. Yet, so many members are using natural oil/fat patch lubes.
I can't prove for sure that seasoning occurs to any great degree or not with fat/oil patch lube. Maybe it all gets blown out or washed out during cleaning. It seems unlikely though. I know the seasoned carbon steel frying pans I have don't lose their seasoning even with washing in hot, soapy water. And I do notice that after around 50 rounds or so using a natural fat/oil based patch lube in a new barrel there is a pronounced shift in the amount of fouling that seems to occur and an increase in the number of shots that can be loaded between swabs. If, as some say, it is getting built up and reducing bore diameter and rifling, then the whole "seasoning is a myth" idea gets blown up because you are seasoning your barrel anyway, whether you believe it or not, and can do it way too much. I could see this as a possibility over time if seasoning is in fact occurring and you are adding layer upon layer of seasoning, but I haven't got to that point yet. If there is a definitive post out there someplace about this, I guess I missed it, but I haven't seen anything here or elsewhere that I would call definitive. What would satisfy me is someone taking a cross section of a so-called "seasoned" barrel and analyzing its surface and any coatings it may have and compare it to a similar barrel that has been shot without the use of any natural oils/fats. If that has been done, someone please direct me to it.
