Zouave, good and bad.

Discussion in 'Percussion Rifles' started by bang, May 16, 2019.

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  1. May 16, 2019 #1

    bang

    bang

    bang

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    Well finally found a Zouave. Got them under 400 on it. Agreed and will get it when back in town. Good
    Bad? Freezer went out same day. Been cooking meat all day while new freezer gets cold.
    Makes me wonder if I had paid 700-1000 for Zouave if the freezer would still be working.
     
  2. May 16, 2019 #2

    Stony Broke

    Stony Broke

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    Most of them shoot a fair group and fire regularly as they should.....they just don't shoot the group where you want it. Everyone I have had experience with shoots really high and has no adjustment for windage. I guess there are some fixes for these problems, but it would be nice if someone just made a rear sight that could be adjusted so you could actually hit something without a lot of BS...
     
  3. May 17, 2019 #3

    JB67

    JB67

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    The Zouave (made by Remington) is historically an odd duck. It was developed during the Civil War but never issued, the Springfield being widely used by the time the Zouave was ready. Most of the inventory remained in storage until Bannerman got his hands on them. He may be responsible for the Zouave moniker.

    As it was never used in battle, ACW groups don't allow the Zouave, yet originals are technically ACW surplus. I think it would be neat to have one, even if only a reproduction.
     
  4. May 17, 2019 #4

    Artificer

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    Some Remington Zouaves actually got issued to the Federal Veterans Reserve Corps in Washington, DC and there is pretty good informed speculation at least some were used when CSA General Early threatened the outer DC defenses and Fort Stevens in 1864.

    Bang,

    Who made your rifle and how good of shape is it in?

    Gus
     
    JB67 likes this.
  5. May 17, 2019 #5

    bang

    bang

    bang

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    Discribed to me as a Remington made repro of Ranson Italian. Not necessarily what is considered high end now a days but the condition is really nice. Typical blemishes that won't take 30 minutes to deal with. Truely looks like it just sat in a cabinet.
     
  6. May 17, 2019 #6

    Eddie2002

    Eddie2002

    Eddie2002

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    Past up on one made by Navy Arms two years ago. It was in good shape but I just didn't have the cash handy at the time. Ended up with a Navy Arms Buffalo hunter for $140.00 which is pretty much the same but a carbine that's in the Hawken style. They were in the same shop and must of been from the same owner, felt a little bad about breaking up the pair.
     
  7. May 17, 2019 #7

    Artificer

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    Good news, I just checked the NSSA list of approved Zouaves and the Ranson is on the list. That means you got a good one, and not one of the junk/crappy Zouaves that were imported by fly by night importers over the years.

    I worked a lot of Zoli and EuroArms Zouaves over the years, but didn't remember working on a Ranson one, that's why I looked it up.


    Gus
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2019
  8. May 17, 2019 #8

    bang

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    There is a euro arms armi san paulo 1861 and a Zouave at a local gun shop. They are asking 595 for each. I really liked the 1861 but just couldn't see paying it. Guess I'm just old and cheap. Coming across this one was stroke of good luck. If I'm correct the number on the barrel is 445. Think it was made durring the ACW Centennial time. Has the eagle on the lock if that seperates it from others I don't know. Other stamps are hard to make out.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2019
  9. May 17, 2019 #9

    Sparkitoff

    Sparkitoff

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    I had a replica made by Zoli in the '80's I knew nothing about percussion rifles and this one was given to me. A local gunsmith smiled when I walked in with it. He was a .50 caliber aficionado and gave me a bunch of heavy conicals and a box of musket caps. Again, I didn't know anything about muzzleloaders in general. I bought some powder that I now believe was probably Pyrodex. I loaded 70 grains of powder and rolled the conical in straight Crisco before loading it. The rifle had a rear sight that was adjustable for elevation. After 3-shots at 50 yards it was pretty well centered and about 3-inches high. I shot 3 more shots at 100-yards and they were in the 5" black circle. I did not swab at all between shots because I didn't know any better. I then cleaned the rifle with Hoppes #9 just like I would a centerfire. On several days in a row a repeated the same sequence with the same results. Eventually, I shot a spike buck whitetail deer (at about 25 yards). After moving about 7-times over the years the rifle "disappeared". I wish I had it back. You asked "good and bad?" Well, this was obviously not pickyabout the load, actually shot conicals pretty good and was consistent from outing to outing. It was not finicky about mediocre cleaning or the lack of swabbing between shots. It kicked real hard with those heavy conicals. The front sight was very fine and not easy to use in the woods for hunting purposes (it showed up ok on red or white bullseye. Nowdays I 'd figure out the twist and then load either PRB or a Minnie probably with 60 grains of real black powder. Then I would tweak the load for accuracy. For someone new with muzzleloaders at the time, I thought it balanced well and pointed nicely. It was easy to carry and made a big hole in deer. The smoke was cool. I don't think you can go wrong with a Zouave....
     
  10. May 17, 2019 #10

    bang

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    From what I can make from pix the marking indicates Gardone.
     
  11. May 17, 2019 #11

    Nessmuck56

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    I had a peep sight put on mine....shot a 500 or 525 grain Minnie with 60 grains FF....very accurate @50 yards.
     
  12. May 17, 2019 #12

    Stantheman86

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    The Zouave is that rifle that I think everyone owns :)

    I have a Zoli Buffalo Hunter.

    Pedersoli makes them on the old Euroarms machinery and at the end of the day it's more or less a .58 Mississippi with a leaf sight and slightly different stock metal. I think the original Remington rifles were made with a heavy influence or even on the tooling for the Mississippi rifles?

    The original "Zouave" kind of falls into the same historical box as the Rogers and Spencer revolver.....they were delivered too late to see any widespread issue but people still "believe maybe" that some R&S revolvers were privately purchased or issued late in the war or used on the Western frontier. No doubt the Zouaves were issued to some units.

    Both the Zouave and R&S revolvers were
    sold as cheap surplus by Bannerman. A good many of the revolvers were converted to cartridge.
     
  13. May 17, 2019 #13

    TFoley

    TFoley

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    Gardone Val Trompia is the location of the Italian state proof house. ALL firearms made for the civilian market in Italy are required by law to be subjected to proof here, and stamped accordingly. The principal stamp is a tiny miniature of the coat of arms of the city, surmounted by a star representing the Republic of Italy. Depending how old the piece is, you might also see the letters V and T - one on each side of the star, and stamped at an angle.
     
  14. May 17, 2019 #14

    bang

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    Congrats you win a cigar.
     
  15. May 17, 2019 #15

    crankshaft

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    If y'all have a hankering for one, check the NSSA for sale. I bought an Italian one for $250. Shoots great with 45 grains, mimie at 100 yrs. The guy sent load data and targets. These old buzzards are dieing off fast and downsizing.
     
  16. May 17, 2019 #16

    TFoley

    TFoley

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    You posited a ?

    I replied with an explanation.

    You don't have to read it.
     
  17. May 17, 2019 #17

    hawkeye2

    hawkeye2

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    I believe he meant that as a positive and humuorous reply.
     
  18. May 17, 2019 #18

    sawyer04

    sawyer04

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    I have a Euroarms Zouave that I purchased used in 1975. The only complaint I have about shooting is the amount of powder and lead it takes. I have done multiple spring, sear repairs and modifications to the tumbler. The stock (walnut) has been repaired for chips and shrinkage. Accurate enough to hunt deer, but feel like it is overkill.
     
  19. May 17, 2019 #19

    bang

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    Yes it was meant to be jocular. The marking was the only one I could make out from photo. I knew it was proof test but that's ok I didn't make that clear. There are three other markings. One looks like a rectangle with two dots. One looks like a moon over a mountain. The other is not visible enough to guess. They may be covered by the stock. Just have to wait till I get it. The only numbers are C58 and 445.
     
  20. May 17, 2019 #20

    TFoley

    TFoley

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    'kay. Other markings SHOULD be a square cartouche with either Roman numerals in it, or letters - the date code. Also a five-pointed star in a crinkly circle, meant to look like a multi-groove rifled barrel, the marking PN [black powder], Made in Italy, Black powder only. The calibre is usually expressed like this - .58cal, but your gun might be older, so the C58 is the calibre designation. 445? Unknown to me. The triangle with two dots is another unknown. When you get it, take a look at the cartouche and we can advise you of the age of the piece.
     

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