Working on my kit/persona

Help Support Muzzle Loading Forum:

smokingoodtimes

32 Cal.
Joined
Mar 13, 2013
Messages
42
Reaction score
22
Location
Wilton,WI
Need some advice. I’ve been trekking for awhile but wanting to go more period correct. I know other say to pick a person/time frame or work around your gun. So the gun I mainly use is a perdersoli trade gun(I’ve always like the northwest trade guns). Also aiming for that 1780s to 1800s fur trader.
Already have the small essentials for building a fire and keeping my gun shooting and basic cooking gear. For clothes I have a green wool blanket shirt and moccasins.
If I go with stuff in this link will that work?
Also have a hawken gun but then your into buckskin clothes which I’m not as interested in.
Also on a budget so my wife doesn’t leave me for buy clothes that went out of fashion over 200 years ago lol
 

tenngun

Cannon
MLF Supporter
Joined
Jan 27, 2008
Messages
17,243
Reaction score
9,676
Location
Republic mo
Your gun is cr 1810-40. Great time as you over split eras.
You should have trousers, moccs, shoes or boots.
For moccs you can have side or center seam, or pucker toes. Your early for hard soles.
Trousers should be narrow fall but broad fall was coming in to use.
Shirts are pretty generic. Eighteenth century shirts would stay in style till TWBS although true early nineteenth century shirts were designed.
Most men wore a vest. In this time frame to about the top or the trousers. Around 1800 could be so short that the shirt was exposed below the vest.
Principal difference was in the neck. 1800 vest came up to the neck. A v became popular getting bigger and bigger to the 1830s when it came to the lower third of the sternum
Some sort of kerchief was worn at the neck. Even a man working with his shirt off would keep a neckchief on. You could die of an exposed neck.
Coats tended to have big cutaways starting at the bottom of the vest making a tail coat.
Short working man’s coats ending at the trousers top was common.
A heavy over coat was worn in winter. Most were tailored and not the blocky Indian capote of popular use. Commercial made capotes were common. Most stopped at about knee length. Some mid thigh.
Leggings were often of the same wool as the coat.
The riflemans shirt had reached the classic look sold by lots of venders today reaching below mid thigh. Often fringe was dyed a contrasting color to the body of the shirt.
A true winter coat of very similar cut to a riflemans coat was seen on the frontier
Dark navy blue was common
Round brined hats were in. If you were Beau Brimmal you could go a top hat. Wheel hats and bonnets were pretty popular still.
White mans fur hats tended to be of the Canadian cap style more then full fur hats common in MM drawings
Anything could be made from buckskin
 

Silky921

45 Cal.
Joined
Mar 5, 2014
Messages
1,031
Reaction score
205
TG gave you some good advice. I might add, just get started and start having fun and don't overthink to much as you get going. Good way to learn what your preferences are is by going to rendezvous/events in your area.

I'm sure everyone would like to see some pictures too.
 

smokingoodtimes

32 Cal.
Joined
Mar 13, 2013
Messages
42
Reaction score
22
Location
Wilton,WI
Your gun is cr 1810-40. Great time as you over split eras.
You should have trousers, moccs, shoes or boots.
For moccs you can have side or center seam, or pucker toes. Your early for hard soles.
Trousers should be narrow fall but broad fall was coming in to use.
Shirts are pretty generic. Eighteenth century shirts would stay in style till TWBS although true early nineteenth century shirts were designed.
Most men wore a vest. In this time frame to about the top or the trousers. Around 1800 could be so short that the shirt was exposed below the vest.
Principal difference was in the neck. 1800 vest came up to the neck. A v became popular getting bigger and bigger to the 1830s when it came to the lower third of the sternum
Some sort of kerchief was worn at the neck. Even a man working with his shirt off would keep a neckchief on. You could die of an exposed neck.
Coats tended to have big cutaways starting at the bottom of the vest making a tail coat.
Short working man’s coats ending at the trousers top was common.
A heavy over coat was worn in winter. Most were tailored and not the blocky Indian capote of popular use. Commercial made capotes were common. Most stopped at about knee length. Some mid thigh.
Leggings were often of the same wool as the coat.
The riflemans shirt had reached the classic look sold by lots of venders today reaching below mid thigh. Often fringe was dyed a contrasting color to the body of the shirt.
A true winter coat of very similar cut to a riflemans coat was seen on the frontier
Dark navy blue was common
Round brined hats were in. If you were Beau Brimmal you could go a top hat. Wheel hats and bonnets were pretty popular still.
White mans fur hats tended to be of the Canadian cap style more then full fur hats common in MM drawings
Anything could be made from buckskin
Great info! Thanks you. If capotes weren’t popular yet would they have used a great coat if they could afford one?
 

tenngun

Cannon
MLF Supporter
Joined
Jan 27, 2008
Messages
17,243
Reaction score
9,676
Location
Republic mo
They wore capotes, but they were fitted and made like coats. There is the one cut but it has a fitted yoke
The Indian style cut did not appear until near the reservation period
Blankets were used but mostly it was out of heavy woolen blanketing and not a blanket.
The southren coat shown here is almost the same cut as a riflemans shirt, but was often made in wool. Even this one shown is lined for warmth
F8ED9153-8744-4AFB-B329-73BC7287B8EA.jpeg
 

Attachments

smokingoodtimes

32 Cal.
Joined
Mar 13, 2013
Messages
42
Reaction score
22
Location
Wilton,WI
They wore capotes, but they were fitted and made like coats. There is the one cut but it has a fitted yoke
The Indian style cut did not appear until near the reservation period
Blankets were used but mostly it was out of heavy woolen blanketing and not a blanket.
The southren coat shown here is almost the same cut as a riflemans shirt, but was often made in wool. Even this one shown is lined for warmthView attachment 91219
Great info again. Kind of back to my debacle. Not much for options for commercial capotes. What would be a suitable commercial available coat? My sewing skills aren’t ready to tackle a job like that.
 

tenngun

Cannon
MLF Supporter
Joined
Jan 27, 2008
Messages
17,243
Reaction score
9,676
Location
Republic mo
It’s not very hard.
Northwest traders sells some easy patterns
And Reconstructing History
I don’t think there is a commercial company that turns one out.
Townsend sells a great coat but I think it a might over priced
 

smokingoodtimes

32 Cal.
Joined
Mar 13, 2013
Messages
42
Reaction score
22
Location
Wilton,WI
It’s not very hard.
Northwest traders sells some easy patterns
And Reconstructing History
I don’t think there is a commercial company that turns one out.
Townsend sells a great coat but I think it a might over priced
Think I’ll hold off on a coat for now and stick with the blanket shirt and if it’s that cold I’ll stay in for now. Love the look of a great coat but didn’t want to invest in a coat that isn’t correct time. Were they in use on the frontier yet? Would they have only been worn by captains and such? I am trying to recruit a girl I work with to help me with a capote once she gets done with her SCA projects
 

tenngun

Cannon
MLF Supporter
Joined
Jan 27, 2008
Messages
17,243
Reaction score
9,676
Location
Republic mo
Great coats were upper middle class/ wealthy, sort of. A working man would have similar and plainer if he needed one.
Match coats were common and just layers of clothing
 

Loyalist Dave

Cannon
Staff member
Moderator
MLF Supporter
Joined
Nov 22, 2011
Messages
10,498
Reaction score
4,238
Location
People's Republic of Maryland
Sm
So the gun I mainly use is a perdersoli trade gun(I’ve always like the northwest trade guns).
Tim,

So Tenngun gave you good information, and you are using a sort of NW Tradegun. The Pedersoli is made to resemble, but not to copy, such a gun. BUT....,

The serpent sideplate was used much much earlier than 1810 on trade guns. What I did with my Pedersoli Tradegun was I swapped out the blued, steel trigger guard for a brass trigger guard. Here are a couple images of a c. 1760 English tradegun, with a less pronounced trigger guard, in BRASS. Note that the tang bolt goes from the guard to the tang, not the tang down to the trigger plate as in the Pedersoli. No need to change the tang bolt on your gun.
You don't need to be elaborate with the brass either.


TRADEGUN 1760 TRIGGER GUARD SIDE.JPG


TRADEGUN 1760 TRIGGER GUARD BOTTOM.JPG


Or don't change anything at all....totally up to you.

Now it's documented that English Fusils were sold, and much less expensively, than rifles, at the English trading post of George Morgan, in Kaskaskia, in the 1760's.

Which means you could easily be a "hunter" in 1780, hunting fur animals, as he employed hunters. Both fur and hides were in great demand.

I think you're either going to need to sew, find a person person to sew, or..., frequent events and blanket traders. While Townsends makes good stuff, it is not inexpensive. If you're going to be schlepping about a National Forest on a Trek, or maybe even Canada, the clothing is going to take some abuse, and reducing the overall costs will help you deal with the abuse. ;)

LD
 

smokingoodtimes

32 Cal.
Joined
Mar 13, 2013
Messages
42
Reaction score
22
Location
Wilton,WI
Sm


Tim,

So Tenngun gave you good information, and you are using a sort of NW Tradegun. The Pedersoli is made to resemble, but not to copy, such a gun. BUT....,

The serpent sideplate was used much much earlier than 1810 on trade guns. What I did with my Pedersoli Tradegun was I swapped out the blued, steel trigger guard for a brass trigger guard. Here are a couple images of a c. 1760 English tradegun, with a less pronounced trigger guard, in BRASS. Note that the tang bolt goes from the guard to the tang, not the tang down to the trigger plate as in the Pedersoli. No need to change the tang bolt on your gun.
You don't need to be elaborate with the brass either.


View attachment 91442

View attachment 91443

Or don't change anything at all....totally up to you.

Now it's documented that English Fusils were sold, and much less expensively, than rifles, at the English trading post of George Morgan, in Kaskaskia, in the 1760's.

Which means you could easily be a "hunter" in 1780, hunting fur animals, as he employed hunters. Both fur and hides were in great demand.

I think you're either going to need to sew, find a person person to sew, or..., frequent events and blanket traders. While Townsends makes good stuff, it is not inexpensive. If you're going to be schlepping about a National Forest on a Trek, or maybe even Canada, the clothing is going to take some abuse, and reducing the overall costs will help you deal with the abuse. ;)

LD
Great info! Thanks Dave. Being able to go back a couple decades makes finding clothes easier. Most of my trekking is on my own land. Not part of a group yet as I don’t know of any in my area in Wisconsin. Would love to go trekking with a group in a national park for several days in the future at some point. I earlier contacted north west traders and see they can make a capote for a ressonable price. Biggest fear was spending a lot of money on a good blanket then botch it.
 

Loyalist Dave

Cannon
Staff member
Moderator
MLF Supporter
Joined
Nov 22, 2011
Messages
10,498
Reaction score
4,238
Location
People's Republic of Maryland
Yes this is a common concern when trekking.

OH and it's a National Forest, not a National Park. ;) There is a big diff between the regulations for a National Park and National Forest. Trekking with a flinter in a National Park will likely get you charged with something. 😳 You can also look into Wisconsin's laws regarding a State Forest vs. a State Park.

We are rapidly coming to the close of Trekking season in National and State Forests, except for those who have a hunting license, they can extend trekking into hunting season.

LD
 

smokingoodtimes

32 Cal.
Joined
Mar 13, 2013
Messages
42
Reaction score
22
Location
Wilton,WI
Yes this is a common concern when trekking.

OH and it's a National Forest, not a National Park. ;) There is a big diff between the regulations for a National Park and National Forest. Trekking with a flinter in a National Park will likely get you charged with something. 😳 You can also look into Wisconsin's laws regarding a State Forest vs. a State Park.

We are rapidly coming to the close of Trekking season in National and State Forests, except for those who have a hunting license, they can extend trekking into hunting season.

LD
Laws in Wisconsin are very relaxed. The DNR and parks try to keep it hush hush but hunting and carrying a firearm in state parks is very legal.
 

Grenadier1758

Cannon
Joined
Oct 9, 2004
Messages
7,509
Reaction score
4,718
Location
St. Louis, MO
You don't really need a coat. You could go the match coat route by squaring up a blanket. The extra material would be used for leggings.

Depending on how the blanket is wrapped around and over the shoulders, a corner could act as a hood and with a sash to tie it closed at the waist, you can be pretty well covered up.

Do a web search for "match coat" and look at the many options to wrap a blanket around your body.
 

Mike Payne

36 Cal.
MLF Supporter
Joined
Feb 14, 2010
Messages
287
Reaction score
388
I squared a gray military surplus blanket made a useable match coat. I use it a lot during hunting season. Fold it up and put my old butt on it to keep it warm and dry!😜
 
Top