William Moore 12 bore...

Discussion in 'Smoothbore' started by Eterry, Nov 9, 2018.

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  1. Nov 9, 2018 #1

    Eterry

    Eterry

    Eterry

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    The shotgun arrived today. It is "Farm Fresh"... the wood is in good condition, the barrels had plenty surface rust and a small amount of pitting behind the sight. The bore was rusty, but doesn't seem pitted. The barrels are .730., marked "Fine Laminated Steel"
    The left lock won't hold, I haven't looked at it yet. It has musket nipples in it. Screenshot_20181108-200251_Gallery.jpg Screenshot_20181108-200251_Gallery.jpg Screenshot_20181108-200256_Gallery.jpg Screenshot_20181108-200251_Gallery.jpg Screenshot_20181108-200256_Gallery.jpg Screenshot_20181108-200251_Gallery.jpg Screenshot_20181108-200256_Gallery.jpg Screenshot_20181108-200302_Gallery.jpg Screenshot_20181108-200314_Gallery.jpg Screenshot_20181108-200319_Gallery.jpg
    The locks are not as rusty as the barrels, and are marked William Moore- London.
    The barrels are Belgium, according to V.M. Starr.
    Is it a parts gun or Belgium made?
     
    Britsmoothy likes this.
  2. Nov 9, 2018 #2

    Eterry

    Eterry

    Eterry

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    The barrels are marked with ELG inside a circle. This is a Belgium proof mark, correct?
    The pictures didn't turn out as planned, i had to cut them down to get them loaded. I'll try to post better ones soon.

    At .730 is it an 11 gauge? The one Starr called "Sue Betsy " was an 11 gauge as well.

    What's your opinion of the scattergun?
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2018
  3. Nov 9, 2018 #3

    Feltwad

    Feltwad

    Feltwad

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    For what I see it is Belgium stamped with a English makers name for export ,this was a common practise . It could have been built has a 11 bore but most likely it started has a 12 and barrel ware it is now a 11.Belgium did make some nice percussion shotguns but I am afraid this is one of the cheap exports .
    Feltwad
     
  4. Nov 9, 2018 #4

    Eterry

    Eterry

    Eterry

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    Thanks for the reply Feltwad. I am hoping to repair or replace the lock and get some range time out of it. The locks are marked London but was suspicious of it being English. The proof marks settled all doubt.
     
  5. Nov 9, 2018 #5

    Spence10

    Spence10

    Spence10

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    I'll bet if you get the old gun up in shooting shape it will give you years of shooting pleasure, regardless of it's family history.

    Spence
     
  6. Nov 9, 2018 #6

    Feltwad

    Feltwad

    Feltwad

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    Restoring this old gun is a good project if this is your first restoration take your time and always remember never take it to far not forgetting that this gun is in the excess of 150 years old and should look its age not some thing straight of the shelf so if in doubt leave it be.
    The lock most likely will be a broken sear spring or a bent nose on the sear it could also be that the sear leg is binding and not allowing it to engage the tumbler ,also have the barrels checked by a good gunsmith for wall thickness , lap out the bore check the ribs on most Belgium guns these are ok because most are brazed or silver soldered . Good luck with restoration and always remember not to take it to far
    Feltwad
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2018
  7. Nov 10, 2018 #7

    Pukka Bundook

    Pukka Bundook

    Pukka Bundook

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    Eterry,
    While Belgian made, it's not a "bottom of the barrel" type at all, and looks a nice gun and will look nicer still when cleaned up gently!

    .730 " is still a 12 bore. (12 runs between .729" and .740")

    Best,
    Richard.
     
  8. Nov 10, 2018 #8

    Eterry

    Eterry

    Eterry

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    Thanks for the kind words Gentleman...i hope to use it soon.

    First i checked for a load in the barrels... or a note stating it was used in the Coffeville Ks. Raid.. lol. I spent some time with 0000 steel wool on the barrel exterior, next i want to gently steel wool the bores to get some rust loose. Then I'll worry about the lock. I'll need a hammer; the left one has begun broken and brazed back.

    I don't plan to do much to the stock... I'd like to fresh the checkering but not qualified. I may steam some dents from the stock, i love the dark patina.
     
  9. Nov 10, 2018 #9

    Pukka Bundook

    Pukka Bundook

    Pukka Bundook

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    Bit of linseed on the stock will bring it back to life.
    Boiling water in the bores is V good for softening rust, then a good scouring out with steel wool on a jag or wrapped around a brush.

    All best,
    R.
     
  10. Nov 11, 2018 #10

    Eterry

    Eterry

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    I spent a few hours working on the W-M, and was pleasantly surprised when I learned the sear screw on the left lock was backed out a full turn, causing it not to set. Tightening it up left me a properly working lock.
    Then i spent some time scrubbing the bores with hot soapy water until the patches were mostly clear. Then some scalding water to rinse and some oil for lube.
    I used a toothbrush and soapy water to get the powder residue behind the locks and in the barrel channel of the stock.

    The more i clean, the better it looks .
     
  11. Nov 11, 2018 #11

    Feltwad

    Feltwad

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    I use this tool for lapping out rust in muzzle loading shotgun bores , it has a detachable head and is used with a electric drill .Over the years I have used this homemade tool on many barrels with good results
    Feltwad

    [​IMG]
     
  12. Nov 12, 2018 #12

    toot

    toot

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    keep us posted.
     
  13. Nov 12, 2018 #13

    Eterry

    Eterry

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    Well, the left lock still won't hold. I've heard of cutting a new notch... i may have to look into that.

    I think I'll leave the stock alone, other than a coat of linseed.. like i said i like the dark look.

    I had a dowel with steel wool on it for work on modern shotguns, I'll locate it and give the bore a polishing.

    I watched the Midway video on YouTube about refinishing the barrels... they look nice and the laminate really stands out. But i don't have the tanks to do that. Guess I'll use more steel wool and elbow grease.

    I'll need a set of nipples... see my other post on that.

    I'll post pics again soon.
     
  14. Nov 12, 2018 #14

    Feltwad

    Feltwad

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    Take a tip from me do not recut a new notch it will alter the throw of the hammer with one hammer when both at full cock one will he ahead of the other .Check to see it the sear leg is binding on the wood work if that is ok then go to the full cock notch on the tumbler just dress it up by using a needle file with a couple of passers .
    Feltwad
     
  15. Nov 15, 2018 at 2:28 AM #15

    Eterry

    Eterry

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    I thought the sear was just loose, after tightening it the lock would hold, but slight pressure on the hammer caused it to fall. I'll take it off tomorrow and see what's going on.
    Thanks.
     
  16. Nov 15, 2018 at 10:13 AM #16

    robinghewitt

    robinghewitt

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    I have one of these in 10 bore. It takes top hat musket caps and is very silly. I like silly guns :D
     
  17. Nov 15, 2018 at 3:04 PM #17

    Pukka Bundook

    Pukka Bundook

    Pukka Bundook

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    ETerry,

    To brown barrels and bring out the figure, you don't need tanks. These are usually done with a solution and left to rust, carded, and solution applied again, until desired colour is reached. This I s a V brief description! :)
     
  18. Nov 16, 2018 at 2:12 AM #18

    Eterry

    Eterry

    Eterry

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    Where can I find a detailed description?
    May post over on the gunsmith thread for info...
    thanks
     
  19. Nov 16, 2018 at 3:28 AM #19

    Pukka Bundook

    Pukka Bundook

    Pukka Bundook

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    ETerry,
    Probably the best bet would be over on the Double gun site...or just look up "barrel browning" or Damascus barrel browning.
    I have a solution , but some of the old ingredients are getting hard to find. (like tincture of steel and even Mercuric chloride these days)
    Mixtures vary, and can give from a soft brown, to a near black and white finish.
    I will try and find some info for you as time permits.

    Just did a couple of barrels last winter.

    Best,
    Richard.
     
  20. Nov 16, 2018 at 4:05 AM #20

    Eterry

    Eterry

    Eterry

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    I am building a lefthand flintlock early Lancaster style. I just finished drawfiling the barrel and using several coats of Homer Dangler brown solution. just not looking forward to removing the old finish/patina/rust on a double barrel, lots of tiny nooks and crannys.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2018 at 4:12 AM

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