Why I stay away from muzzleloaders with scope mounts

Help Support Muzzle Loading Forum:

Bassdog1

32 Seneca Guy
MLF Supporter
Joined
Jan 18, 2018
Messages
583
Reaction score
399
Location
Tipton, Indiana
Picked up for Thompson Center 45 caliber Cherokee barrels today bought as a package deal at the right price one has a Really decent barrel with some very minor pitting that I’m sure will be an excellent shooter two others have rusted bars and in my opinion will need to be relined. The third barrel was in really decent shape and add a clean bore So I removed the site now and the two holes closest to the breach were drilled all the way into the chamber. So sad that a beautiful barrel has been ruined. I will strip the sites and other parts off to re-sale. The other two barrels I will probably Sell to someone who wants A project barrel Or strip them for their parts also.
 

Attachments

buickmarti

32 Cal.
Joined
Dec 31, 2016
Messages
121
Reaction score
50
How much would you want for the drilled threw barrel. Looks like a good barrel for my underhammer project.
 

Historian

20 ga. Flintlock SXS
MLF Supporter
Joined
Jan 9, 2013
Messages
406
Reaction score
284
Location
North AL
Just shorten the barrel by having Bobby Hoyt take off the breach end and retap it. The barrel will be 3 inches shorter it looks like but should work. Make a shorter ramrod and you will be all set. Being it is s .45 and does not take large powder charges it should be a good shooter.
 

Bassdog1

32 Seneca Guy
MLF Supporter
Joined
Jan 18, 2018
Messages
583
Reaction score
399
Location
Tipton, Indiana
Thought about that but the other screw holes at the front of the sight mount are an inch behind the rear sight and I am assuming that they are nearly through also. Now if someone wanted to make a long barreled Patriot barrel they might be able to do so.
 

Norman Brooks

40 Cal
MLF Supporter
Joined
Mar 26, 2021
Messages
230
Reaction score
101
Location
Michigan
That's one of the bad things about buying somebody else's stuff. Don't know how to clean them, have to have that 14 power scope and shoot 150 grains of powder. Two years ago I seen CVA's and Traditions going for $50.00 to $75.00 at an auction, nobody wanted to take a chance on what they might find on the inside of the barrel...
 

ML48

Banned
Joined
May 9, 2021
Messages
567
Reaction score
566
Picked up for Thompson Center 45 caliber Cherokee barrels today bought as a package deal at the right price one has a Really decent barrel with some very minor pitting that I’m sure will be an excellent shooter two others have rusted bars and in my opinion will need to be relined. The third barrel was in really decent shape and add a clean bore So I removed the site now and the two holes closest to the breach were drilled all the way into the chamber. So sad that a beautiful barrel has been ruined. I will strip the sites and other parts off to re-sale. The other two barrels I will probably Sell to someone who wants A project barrel Or strip them for their parts also.
PM me please.
 

BP Addict

40 Cal
Joined
Dec 10, 2020
Messages
122
Reaction score
137
I've always stayed away from the guns on the auctions. I could see a scope on an Inline but not a side-lock.
 

ML48

Banned
Joined
May 9, 2021
Messages
567
Reaction score
566
I've always stayed away from the guns on the auctions. I could see a scope on an Inline but not a side-lock.
Well, there are folks that just want to shoot their traditional, but with age sometimes the eyes aren't as good with metal sights. And truthfully, I'd rather see them hunt with a scope and not risk wounding an animal, and also still enjoy shooting their traditional.
 

Pietro

45 Cal.
Joined
Sep 15, 2020
Messages
760
Reaction score
820
Yep - As Clint said: " A man's got to come to terms with his limitations" ………...
 

nkbj

Cannon
MLF Supporter
Joined
Jan 31, 2009
Messages
7,991
Reaction score
1,017
In my fifth decade of muzzleloading now, scopes are becoming more attractive all the time.
Almost twenty years ago picked up a scope and mounts TC designed for New Englanders and also the mounts for their Hawken and Renegade rifles. They were made to fit the rear sight screw holes. They had a different type of bottom on the scopes for locking into the mounts so their proprietary mounts and scopes didn't fit anyone else's. A smart marketing ploy that turned out to be goofy in the eyes of the public.
For about a week now I've been threatening to put the mounts and 2x7 extended eye relief scope on the New Englander that Mr. Hoyt long ago relined for me to shoot both paper patched and .457 diameter rifle bullets as dropped from the mold. But I'm thinking that first I'll try the TC peep again and find out if the eyes have it.

There's another mounts system that I've happened upon that some that need scopes could appreciate. It's a clamp with the upper and lower halves shaped to fit an octagonal barrel. It works well if the rifle does not have an under rib.
scary black rifle.jpg


And, there's yet another type of clamp on system that has the obvious advantage of no lower half. It clamps on securely with side to side pressure. It's an ideal alternative system for long range load development because it's easy on and easy off.
Navarone.jpg
 

BP Addict

40 Cal
Joined
Dec 10, 2020
Messages
122
Reaction score
137
Well, there are folks that just want to shoot their traditional, but with age sometimes the eyes aren't as good with metal sights. And truthfully, I'd rather see them hunt with a scope and not risk wounding an animal, and also still enjoy shooting their traditional.
I hadn't thought about that. I just figured it was CF shooters wanting to hunt with a Muzzle Loader. The Traditionalists that I know wouldn't be caught dead with a scope on their gun.

Most of the folks I hang around with gravitate to peep sights when their eyes go weak.

Thanks!

Walt
 

BP Addict

40 Cal
Joined
Dec 10, 2020
Messages
122
Reaction score
137
In my fifth decade of muzzleloading now, scopes are becoming more attractive all the time.
Almost twenty years ago picked up a scope and mounts TC designed for New Englanders and also the mounts for their Hawken and Renegade rifles. They were made to fit the rear sight screw holes. They had a different type of bottom on the scopes for locking into the mounts so their proprietary mounts and scopes didn't fit anyone else's. A smart marketing ploy that turned out to be goofy in the eyes of the public.
For about a week now I've been threatening to put the mounts and 2x7 extended eye relief scope on the New Englander that Mr. Hoyt long ago relined for me to shoot both paper patched and .457 diameter rifle bullets as dropped from the mold. But I'm thinking that first I'll try the TC peep again and find out if the eyes have it.

There's another mounts system that I've happened upon that some that need scopes could appreciate. It's a clamp with the upper and lower halves shaped to fit an octagonal barrel. It works well if the rifle does not have an under rib.
View attachment 87437

And, there's yet another type of clamp on system that has the obvious advantage of no lower half. It clamps on securely with side to side pressure. It's an ideal alternative system for long range load development because it's easy on and easy off.
View attachment 87438
Relining a barrel isn't something you hear much about anymore. Most folks want to just take to the next caliber up.

Thanks!

Walt
 

ML48

Banned
Joined
May 9, 2021
Messages
567
Reaction score
566
In my fifth decade of muzzleloading now, scopes are becoming more attractive all the time.
Almost twenty years ago picked up a scope and mounts TC designed for New Englanders and also the mounts for their Hawken and Renegade rifles. They were made to fit the rear sight screw holes. They had a different type of bottom on the scopes for locking into the mounts so their proprietary mounts and scopes didn't fit anyone else's. A smart marketing ploy that turned out to be goofy in the eyes of the public.
For about a week now I've been threatening to put the mounts and 2x7 extended eye relief scope on the New Englander that Mr. Hoyt long ago relined for me to shoot both paper patched and .457 diameter rifle bullets as dropped from the mold. But I'm thinking that first I'll try the TC peep again and find out if the eyes have it.

There's another mounts system that I've happened upon that some that need scopes could appreciate. It's a clamp with the upper and lower halves shaped to fit an octagonal barrel. It works well if the rifle does not have an under rib.
View attachment 87437

And, there's yet another type of clamp on system that has the obvious advantage of no lower half. It clamps on securely with side to side pressure. It's an ideal alternative system for long range load development because it's easy on and easy off.
View attachment 87438
What you say is true to the MAX. What you say makes very good sense. However, common sense doesn't seem to be very common these days.
 

nkbj

Cannon
MLF Supporter
Joined
Jan 31, 2009
Messages
7,991
Reaction score
1,017
I wish there were more options on the available scopes but hey, I'd like a rifle set up with false muzzle and mold made by the gunsmith too!
But hey, I'm left eyed 😜 and custom is a matter of selecting where you want to put the money.
 

cvco

36 Cl.
Joined
Jan 28, 2021
Messages
63
Reaction score
43
Location
SoCal
Ive bought in auctions many times and only had bad luck once. The guy had made a really dumb modification and I couldnt see it from the photos. But looking closer after I bought it I saw how I could set it all back correctly with time and effort but no cost. If you want to buy in an auction and really know the gun, call the company and ask specific questions and they will happily report what they see. Furthermore, they will also let you return a gun for unseen defects and usually how it works is that they wont refund you but put it for auction again at no cost to you. The sad part is that while you get your money back, the next guy is stuck with the same defect.

To be honest, ive had worse luck buying from owners on forums. When you say "i'll take it" youre committed, its final and can be sent ANYTHING. I bought a pistol on a forum and even met the owner for the transfer. Everything seemed OK. What I didnt do is take it completely apart and carefully inspect before handing over money. When I did that later at home for cleaning, I saw the reason he was selling, a really screwed up and nasty problem deep inside that occurred due to poor care. I got it fixed at a gunsmith and it cost me plenty.

So the problem isnt auctions, forums, pawn shops, friends or other, it about buying anything secondhand. Unless something is special or rare and you have the time, patience, money and knowledge to deal with headaches, its taught me to buy new, buy new with a warranty, buy new with a warranty and someone to take responsibility.
 

cvco

36 Cl.
Joined
Jan 28, 2021
Messages
63
Reaction score
43
Location
SoCal
That's one of the bad things about buying somebody else's stuff. Don't know how to clean them, have to have that 14 power scope and shoot 150 grains of powder. Two years ago I seen CVA's and Traditions going for $50.00 to $75.00 at an auction, nobody wanted to take a chance on what they might find on the inside of the barrel...
Oh they are still cheap. I just passed up a nice Hawken that went for $80 on an auction. I think its not about taking a chance on a bad barrel or something but that some guns just arent worth much. My god, for many desirable guns people pay $1000, $2000, $4000 on auctions, sight unseen! Couldnt they have bad barrels and parts too?

WE in a group like this, this is the single-shot world and overall, single-shot guns go cheap, whether its a muzzleloader or shotgun or .22. We are tiny fragment of the gun universe which favors repeaters and giant magazines. I promise you, I put up ANY kind of gun with a 20,000rd magazine and mile-a-minute feeding, it wont go for $80 no matter whats inside that barrel --- or even if it has a barrel at all!
 

bang

50 Cal.
Joined
Jan 2, 2011
Messages
1,377
Reaction score
767
If the fwd mount holes aren't all the way through just plug the holes.
 

Bighorserider

40 Cal
Joined
Apr 20, 2013
Messages
151
Reaction score
88
Just a thought, but since breech plugs, nipples, and drums are all just threaded why not just loc tite some screws in the holes?
 

Bassdog1

32 Seneca Guy
MLF Supporter
Joined
Jan 18, 2018
Messages
583
Reaction score
399
Location
Tipton, Indiana
Thought about that but will allow someone else to have the barrel cheap if they would like to try it.
 

Bassdog1

32 Seneca Guy
MLF Supporter
Joined
Jan 18, 2018
Messages
583
Reaction score
399
Location
Tipton, Indiana
The last post got me thinking so I took the barrel to my gunsmith he says he can plug the holes tightly with little or no problem then I will start proofing this barrel with light loads to make sure this fix will work the barrel isn’t worth much if I don’t try and do something with it but will keep it for my own use if everything works OK
 
Top