TVM,What's The Attraction?

[Birdwatcher]

Jackie,

Have you ever heard hens when laying their eggs?

:grin:

CS

???

Not sure the meaning, assuming its dismissive/derogatory towards me :shrug:

Well, the last post I made here I think was late Monday morning in a McDonald's (free wi fi :v ) 463 miles from here, I had rolled out at 4:30am that morning on a school business-related errand and drove pretty much non-stop (a moderate jaunt in Texas terms, but it did get me out of state).

Rolled out from there (a friend's house, not the Mikey D's) 5am Tuesday morning, took the long way back with many stops, stopped in Austin to visit another friend, rolled in here ~1am Wednesday, still awake now at 2:30 on account of accumulated caffiene.

Anyhoo... if that post WAS meant how I think, yer wasting your time there Sherlock. I am merely stating fact on this thread, you appear to be striving for ridicule.

Not something I would do.

And on the topic of this thread...

I have already stated my position in previous posts.

Been burned twice; once in the original sale and again when I went out of my way to bring the gun back personally and had it handed back in the condition you have seen.

The fact that the product is STILL advertised with NO reference to barrel taper or the lack thereof means other folks is gonna get suckered too.

If TVM would just present this product honestly and forthrightly to the consumer I'd be well satisfied and call it even.

Many people who logged into the TVM website would learn something, the product would be better, and folks more satisfied.

I of course, like unsung heroes everywhere, would be quietly forgotten :nother shrug:

and my next gun can be built elsewhere.

Dont worry, I'm certain they know about my posts and know who I am.

YMMV,

Birdwatcher

 

[stone knife]

TVM is representing the barrel honesty, if they said it was tapered and it was not that would be a lie. This is not the case and it is unfair to say otherwise. If you have an issue the thing to do is to take it up with Matt ether face to face or over the phone, I'm not sure but it would appear that you stopped short of resolving this issue with the proper person and now continue nearly three years later to rake the guy over the coals some what behind his back. I can understand why your frustrated over this matter but what's right is right. I surely hope you don't take this as a personal attack as it is not meant as that.

 

[roundball]

That's pretty much the take most have...obviously something was bought without enough understanding of the product.
Then 2 years after the fact he said "somebody" at Friendship found fault with it.
And finally, saying that the builder (in this case TVM) was unethical to have sold him such a product was so far over the top that all credibility went right out the window.
No personal attack either...just a summary interpretation of the OP's own facts presented by the OP in this thread.

 

TVM is representing the barrel honesty, if they said it was tapered and it was not that would be a lie. This is not the case and it is unfair to say otherwise. If you have an issue the thing to do is to take it up with Matt ether face to face or over the phone, I'm not sure but it would appear that you stopped short of resolving this issue with the proper person and now continue nearly three years later to rake the guy over the coals some what behind his back. I can understand why your frustrated over this matter but what's right is right. I surely hope you don't take this as a personal attack as it is not meant as that.

You nailed it. It's amazing how often people complain on forums rather than contacting the company they have the problem with. And, if you don't try to resolve your problem within a reasonable amount of time, just bite the bullet and don't complain years later. Take responsibility for your own actions and move on.

 

[Robby]

I agree Jack, if you have a problem, its only fair and right to both party's to address it immediately.
Stone knife, TVM knows Their product with a non-tapered (special) barrel doesn't measure up to what would be 'commonly' accepted as traditional for that type of gun. That would make it a lie by omission, a subtler form of that transgression, but a lie none the less.
Robby

 

[Birdwatcher]

And, if you don't try to resolve your problem within a reasonable amount of time, just bite the bullet and don't complain years later

Agreed, I still have the fowler.

And you'll not this was a thread evaluating TVM products, I have posted my experience, as it occurred.

ALL FOUR of the TVM fowler owners posting here were completely unaware of thw issue.

EVERYBODY reading this considering a TVM now knows to at least ask.

BTW, for a similar price point NSW makes a comparable product, with an apparetly correct barrel.

Birdwatcher

 

[Rifleman1776]

That's pretty much the take most have...obviously something was bought without enough understanding of the product.
Then 2 years after the fact he said "somebody" at Friendship found fault with it.
And finally, saying that the builder (in this case TVM) was unethical to have sold him such a product was so far over the top that all credibility went right out the window.
No personal attack either...just a summary interpretation of the OP's own facts presented by the OP in this thread.

I don't always agree with you. But do this time. We all have our learning experiences. The time factor here makes the whole experience a non-issue. Getting a gun built is a risky matter. A reccomended builder completely messed up a Jaeger build for me. I had it dissassembled and rebuilt by another builder into my present rifle. Happens. OP should drop the matter and get on with life.

 

[Birdwatcher]

Then 2 years after the fact he said "somebody" at Friendship found fault with it.

Have you BEEN to Friendship? The Spring Shoot?

At least 80% of the thousands of guns there are flintlocks. That week it is probably THE principal repository of flintlock expertise on the entire planet.

Just to give folks an idea, this is what their SMOOTHBORE range looks like, these folks wring out extraordinary accuracy out of these guns, without the use of a rear sight....

Everybody who owns a flinter should go at some point, even when there are no matches or events on "Flintlocks Inc." is open all yer round, or has been the three separate times I stopped in.

Imagine in a store with rows and rows of shelves devoted to flintlocks and flintock shooting supplies.

Anyhow, Friendship IN is about equally distant from St Louis and Cicinatti, I want to say an hour from each, in the beautiful rolling hills of "Kentuckiana"

At Friendship, two weeks after I took delivery of the gun I believe three individuals pointed out the barrel taper issue, AND the pan, the first guy stopped at the pan issue. Anyhoo, after those four guys I stopped showing to it folks.

Two weeks later the first guy who looked at it at Ticonderoga pointed it out also.

Two of these people are known to me personally, the friend at Friendship a travelling vendor, active in the reenactor community online.

To give an idea of my "newbieness", since it was raining I was actually walking around with my brand-new fowler wrapped in a trashbag :grin:

This gentleman GIFTED me a linen rifle sheath I use it to this day.

And finally, saying that the builder (in this case TVM) was unethical to have sold him such a product was so far over the top that all credibility went right out the window.

Well, we've establshed that at least FOUR TVM fowler owners here were completely clueless about barrel taper at the time of purchase.

ROUNDBALL,

Speaking of credibility, I'm going to ask you once again the question you have already avoided once....

Would YOU sell a fowler with an untapered barrel to a newby without EVER putting forth that information?

Yes of no?

Thanks,

Birdwatcher

 

[Rifleman1776]

Been to Friendship many times. I doubt flintlocks are in the majority. But, that's me.
The "muskets" range is CW rifled muskets. They are percussion and can be fairly accurate way out there.
Life as we know it did not end with you getting a straight barrel. It will shoot quite well if you just use it. Or sell and get on with your life.

 

[Birdwatcher]

TVM knows Their product with a non-tapered (special) barrel doesn't measure up to what would be 'commonly' accepted as traditional for that type of gun. That would make it a lie by omission, a subtler form of that transgression, but a lie none the less.

Exactly so,

And as long as that transgression remains I'll provide my own experiences every time the issue comes up on the 'net so that others do not fall into the same trap.

Birdwatcher

 

[Rifleman1776]

A major fault of TVM fowlers is the barrel taper, or lack thereof. ALL of the original examples from back in the days have tapered barrels, for good reason

Saying "ALL" is painting with a very wide brush.
I am trying to do some research on this matter of taper on originals. More later.
However, I went to the TVM website and the description of their American Fowler clearly states it is not an exact replica of any one historical piece. And, it clearly states the barrel is straight.
Someone buying one of these has no legitimate gripe when their fowler is delivered with a straight barrel.
Lotsa talk about this issue which is really a non-issue.

 

[stone knife]

Looks like TVM edited their description of the Fowler, this just goes to show they are a respectable business.

 

[jdkerstetter]

Yes, I agree that must be an edit as the word "straight" was not there a few days ago.

I give them credit for clarifying what is "special" about their barrel and paying attention to their customer base.

Enjoy, J.D.

 

Anyhow, Friendship IN is about equally distant from St Louis and Cicinatti, I want to say an hour from each, in the beautiful rolling hills of "Kentuckiana"

Cincy is probably about an hour if your coming from the east side, but St.Louis is about seven or eight.
Did you mean Indianapolis or Louisville?
I live where Indy, Cincy, AND Friendship are all about fifty miles give or take a little.

 

[Birdwatcher]

Its possible that a significant number of potential customers might suddenly have known to ask.

....that and perhaps the realization by some folks that they, like me, have about a dog's span of years left on this earth here if they're lucky.

Be sorta awkward if St. Pete brung up the topic of them fowler barrels.... :grin:

Anyhow Pilgrim, my work is done here, where's the sunset?

Birdwatcher

 

[Birdwatcher]

Louisville or Indianapolis

I meant Louisville,

Once I had school business for a week in Clarksville and took a rental car over, the other times we stopped in either coming or going on our way 'tween Texas and New York.

You sure live in a beautiful area.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Louisville or Indianapolis

I meant Louisville,

Once I had school business for a week in Clarksville and took a rental car over, the other times we stopped in either coming or going on our way 'tween Texas and New York.

You sure live in a beautiful area.

Yep. I used to live near Friendship and your St. Louis comment confused me. :v

 

[hanshi]

I agree.