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TOW problems

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AFMSgt

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Anyone have trouble with Track of the Wolf. I just ordered a flint pistol and here's what they sent me.

CANCELWe cancel this order. Since you have purchased an Hand made India replica before and returned it due to not being satified with the quality. You will not be satisfied with this one either.Carole Ripplinger

They substituted an Indian made musket on my order a couple of years ago and it came in with a broken stock - of course I returned it. I called them and they are refusing my order. What the heck?
 
Wow... sorry you have had problems with TOW. I've been buying from them since the 1970s and my experiences with them in either my purchases or picking up the phone and asking for suggestions or other advice has been very positive.

I've only bought one gun from them, a Lyman Plains Rifle when I was waiting for a custom flint to get built. It came quickly, well packed, and my experience with that purchase in the order and customer service was great.
 
Have dealt w/ TOW since 1976 and have never had a problem w/ them....and have returned a few items including a parts set. Orders have always been delivered promptly but I always inquire if any item would be back ordered and then go to another vendor.

Sometimes if a customer "mouths off" to a vendor, relations suffer and cannot be reconciled henceforth. TOW's reaction to you was caused by "something" and usually stems from a gross misunderstanding between 2 parties. Tow's not dealing w/ you had to be caused by "words" on either your part or theirs.

Move on to another vendor and hopefully things will improve.....Fred
 
I agree with Fred, something happened.
Track is still a sole proprietorship, Dave owns it flat out with family members working there.
 
Well it can't have anything to do with the Indian made musket I returned over three years ago. That gun had a broken stock and they not only refunded my money but postage as well. Now I find the real issue is the disagreement over a consignment gun they sent me over two years ago. Went all the way to BBB on that one and the complaint is still there listed as an unsatisfactory response from TOW. I don't think I was out of line. All that hassle, and now my $300 purchase cancelled and looks like I'm a "banned" customer over $62 worth of postage. Details were still out there. Guess I will be looking for another vendor.

Complaint: Company failed to disclose a visible product defect and charged me shipping costs both ways. On 11/25/2013, under invoice number ******, I ordered item number AAM-667, a Mortimer 12 ga. flintlock shotgun from Track of the Wolf. I ordered based on photographs and a verbal description that noted no deficiencies other than minor handling marks. When I received the shotgun I found the handling mark issue acceptable but then noted the lock was not fitted to the gun properly. It was not inlet into the stock as it should have been and as such left the gun unusable to me. I contacted Track and was told to return the gun for a refund minus shipping costs. I stated that I felt their return policy was ok if my dissatisfaction was based on me simply not liking it but in this case they failed to show in their photographs or in their description of the gun that the lock mechanism was not installed properly and I felt I should be reimbursed for the shipping costs on something I'd have never ordered in the first place. Track refused. This company is a very well known provider of muzzleloading firearms, kits, and accessories with a wealth of knowledge about these products. They allegedly have a number of people who go over these consignment used guns, write descriptions and take pictures for the ad on their website. For them to have missed this ill-fitting lock mechanism is at the very least a sign of someone's incompetence or neglect and at the worst it is blatant misrepresentation and fraud. My initial purchase price of $799.00 has been refunded but I want the othe $62.00 charged for shippings costs refunded as well. Again, I would have no complaint if it was simply a matter of me not liking the gun or my interpretation of minor handling marks differing from theirs. But this gun was clearly defective when they sent it out, they failed to note it in the product description and I'm out additional fees that they should have to return.

Desired Settlement: I want a refund of shipping - $62.33

Business Response: Initial Business Response /* (1000, 5, 2013/12/19) */ Thank you for your letter of December 11, 2013: Regarding Case # ********: ******* ******, ******************** Columbus, OH 43230. Mr. ****** ordered used replica antique gun #******* at $799.00 plus postage. Enclosed invoice ****** dated 11/25/2013 shows itemized shipping charges. Mr. ****** returned it for "same day refund" of $799.00. Enclosed refund invoice ****** dated 12/06/2013 shows $799.00 refunded. We offer "10 day inspection and approval, same day refund if returned". We do not refund shipping, which is the customer's cost of inspecting the goods, nor do we profit from shipping. His order was securely packed in our injection foam filled oversize double boxed carton. Shipping is the customer's only risk, so stated in our terms of sale, catalog, web site, and advertising for over 42 years. We do not refund shipping. Returns are few. Photographs from our professional studio illustrate each item, in addition to our descriptive text. The enclosed web page prints illustrate the actual item, #*******, sold to another buyer when returned. All past sales may be viewed in our web archives. Mr. ****** is correct. Hand fitting and finishing at the factory in Italy is never perfect. Finding a perfect specimen, in our used market, at a 50% discount from new pricing, is unlikely. We invite customer inspection. Same day refund if returned. Customer pays shipping. We have honored our terms of sale, but that has not satisfied Mr. ******. Final Consumer Response /* (3000, 7, 2013/12/19) */ (The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.) They take no responsibility and actually call their studio "professional". If that was the case they'd have identified the defect. And I totally reject the "enclosed web page" comment as I checked their website daily and never saw this gun come up again. This was not a quest for perfection, the defect was not just a minor one and if they are remotely as detailed as they profess to be I'd have not been stuck with the merchandise they incorrectly described. If this is their business model they need to have a disclaimer and a caveat emptor statement. NO WHERE IN THEIR AD DID IT SAY "THIS LOCK IS NOT FIT PROPERLY THE GUN". It said, "minor handling marks" and that's what I expected to see.
 
Based on what you've told us so far.....I'd say that TOW's actions were justified and in the best interest of both parties....

Best that you just put the whole issue behind you and move on to a new vendor.... :2
 
Personally I've had no issues with Track of the Wolf, which includes ordering and keeping several used firearms. I've always found them to be exactly as described and find that they try to point out actual defects (cracks, chips, etc.)

They also always show a close-up of the lock area in their photos. Was this a safety issue in the inlet under the lock that could not be seen, like not enough wood removed so the lock would not stay set, or just minor inletting "issues" around the plate? If the latter, then I'd say TOW was justified, if the former, then I think the shipping should have been refunded.
 
With the lock (pan) flush (not really flush, it would only fit at an angle) against the barrel, one end of the lock plate was all way out of the wood - I could stick a credit card under it. If you tried to shim everything up in the lock mortise you couldn't get the pan up against the barrel at all. The defect was obvious as soon as I took it out of the box. None of the pictures from TOW ad were taken at an angle that showed it.
 
Retiree said:
... I contacted Track and was told to return the gun for a refund minus shipping costs. I stated that I felt their return policy was ok if my dissatisfaction was based on me simply not liking it but ...
Their policy is clearly stated...

Ten day inspection begins at delivery. Send your approval. Else return it for same day refund, if not delighted. Postage is your only risk.
It sounds like what they are saying is, you pay for return shipping, for whatever reason. That is your cost to inspect the gun.
 
Been dealing with track since hector was s pup, I'm thinking 77 or so. I have never had any trouble with them.
That said one sour taste is enough to turn one off to a dealer. So... I can also highly recommend petotonic or log cabin sport shop, both have treated me well also
 
I always had great and quality service from TOW.

I think the bottom line is that you are PO because you didn't get your postage back ...period! Simply buy elsewhere!
 
In the last 40 years I have never had a bad experience from TOW......In the last 20 years I have only had 1 good experience from Cabelas....and I say that to give them the benefit of the doubt.

No! wait...to be fair I actually can think of one good experience.....But, I have still had more good experiences from my dentist than Cabelas...

TOW is a benchmark.....By which others are measured....
Just my opinion....You can agree or disagree... :v
 
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Retiree said:
Went all the way to BBB on that one and the complaint is still there listed as an unsatisfactory response from TOW.
The BBB has the complaint listed as "closed". http://www.bbb.org/minnesota/busin...-wolf-inc-in-elk-river-mn-15000503/complaints

To be honest, there are several places that I have received poor service from and two that have cost me money (like your shipping costs) that have made me un-happy.
I won't do business with those places!
I wouldn't for a second consider giving those places a single dime of my money to make even one tenth of one percent profit from. And I've got no problem telling folks I won't do business with those places and why.
So I guess I don't understand the trouble here,,(?) Maybe it's just a Minnesota thing.
Fool me once Shame on you, fool me twice Shame on me.
 
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Don't want to sound redundant as my experiences mirror everyone else's. Have been doing a lot of business with them over the last 10 years. Never ran into any problems with their descriptions or quality of their products.

Sorry to hear that things went south for you! I hope the best for you in your future dealings.

Respectfully, Cowboy
 
It's unfortunate, and I'm not taking a either side, but I can understand Track's position. I am a business owner and if I had a customer file a complaint against me with the BBB, I would certainly not want to deal with them again.
 
Sometimes a person thinks they are right, and can't see that they are actually wrong.
Other times they actually are right...but it is still wrong..

Military strategists learned a long time ago that, winning a battle does not ensure victory and that, sometimes you have to lose a battle in order to achieve victory.
 
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