Took my friends son deer hunting, but it did not end up as expected.

[waarp8nt]

The day started out early, about an hour before bright and early. We met up at my house and headed for the woods, I stopped by the barn to get a chair and allow enough time for the young man to get to my stand in the hopes I may kick something up for him as I walked to my spot among the multiplier roses and autumn olives. The young man walked a couple of does to the far side of the woods as he walked in, as for me...didn't see a darn thing on the way to the briars and shrubs. It had been a little while and I decided to "check in" on the young man, he said he seen three does cross the field in front of him, but they were too far off for the confidence he had in his recently purchased muzzleloader. While setting there in the mess of briars at the edge of the woods, I noticed a couple of dogs run by me. They didn't notice me setting there, just ran on by through the field. One dog was large and most likely a Malamute, the other dog was obviously a mix as it looked Boxer, but had somewhat shorter legs. To be honest, I didn't think much of it...just figured it was one neighbors let their dogs loose for a while. Thought they may even kick up a deer for the young man. It wasn't long and a doe running in on my left hand side, she was running and turned right for me so I stood up as to keep her from jumping on me, then I realized the dogs were chasing her as she ducked around the corner to get into the woods away from the dogs. The dogs came out of the woods after the doe left them behind, still the dogs didn't notice me. They started running back through the field and ended up by the young man, unknown to me at the time, from up in the stand he waved his hat trying to get the dogs to leave, the just dogs growled at him and ran off.
A little later, the dogs were over in the barn lot. The Malamute was jumping up attempting to kick up rabbits, the other dog was simply running around the barn lot. I didn't much care for them hunting the rabbits, but I had another concern as the young man and I built a fence in the barn lot the previous week. That fence held my two fainting goats and was attached to one side of my barn. It was one thing the dogs hunting rabbits, I was just hoping the dogs wouldn't find the goats. Several minutes later they did...the Boxer looking dog had went into the barn and came out right next to the goats. It was "game on" for the dogs. The goats were carrying on, the dogs barking trying to get into the fence and my dog barking...penned up about a half a quarter away by the house. I worked my way out of the briars on the far side of the field and crossed the field in a hurry, I pulled up my .54 caliber Flintlock Renegade, but was afraid it could shoot through and hit a goat if I pulled the trigger. I was still fairly far away as there was a small valley and a creek to get across, but it would be best to get a better angle. The hill down to and up from the creek are fairly steep, so I worked my way upstream to cross a small ford to get to the barn lot. As I approached the lot, I began to shout and clap my hands in hopes the dogs would just run off. The dogs would do no such thing, the Boxer mix turned and came toward me barking and growling. I pulled the flintlock from my shoulder as I walked to the side to keep from shooting toward the goats and barn. Pulling the rifle up and started to aim at the dog, then I realized I had only one shot, I had not brought a handgun and only had a smaller knife with gut hook, not my large hunting knife. The Malamute dog pulled away from attempting to get into the pen and started coming my way, at first I thought he was just going to walk by and run off, but he turned to me and showed his teeth as the other dog crossed his path to get to the other side in an attempt to circle me. My thoughts raced as I decided I would be better off shooting the larger dog and battle the shorter dog using my flintlock as a club. So, I quickly aimed and shot the larger dog and immediately slid the rifle down my hands to use it as a club. As the dust settled and the smoke cleared, the Boxer mix was running off and the Malamute took its last breath as I approached. I went up to the barn to check on the goats and they were fine, the dogs had tried to dig under the barn wood to get the goats and broke ground on the fence. I loaded my rifle and went back to check the big dog. He was dead from a well placed shot, no collar and stunk like a dumpster...certainly not a pet.
The young man met me in the barn lot, I apologized for ruining his morning hunt. We discussed the dogs growling at him and the fact that he couldn't hear me yelling or clapping over the dogs barking while they were attempting to get to the goats. He and I went to the house and enjoyed a cup of coffee (soda for him) and a snack before heading back out, this time I brought a hunting knife along with my flintlock. While I had been muzzleloader hunting before, it was the first time taking an animal with a flintlock. The young man seen a couple more does that afternoon, but was patient and didn't pull the trigger as they were over 100 yards away.

 

[Nameless Hunter]

Wow! Just wow! Not what you'd expect when you started your hunt that day!

 

[R.J.Bruce]

Feral dogs are nothing to be played with. They are fully capable of killing adult humans. Congrats on coming out on top of the situation.

 

[R.J.Bruce]

One of the problems hunters/landowners face today is feral dogs vs loose pets. When I was hunting in the late 60's & early 70's, ANY loose dog in the woods during hunting season was fair game for a bullet. This was just common knowledge, and people that lived in rural areas where hunting took place KNEW to keep their pets contained during hunting season, or else suffer the possibility of losing a pet. NO ONE complained, pet owners knew their responsibilities, and acted accordingly.

Fast forward to 2021, the past 25 years, or so really, and with the upsurge in non-hunters living in large numbers in rural areas, as well as the various animal rights organizations, and the political/legal climate has been reversed 180 degrees.

If I was faced with what waarp8nt was faced with having to do, the very first thing I would have done after checking on my livestock's well being, and attending to their needs had they been injured, would have been to quietly bury the dog. And NOT posted on the internet what I had done.

I don't know what waarp8nt's local laws are regarding defense of livestock against feral dogs, especially ones still wearing a collar. He is incredibly lucky the dog he shot was not wearing a collar. But, I have read more than one account online where the landowner had to rely on the whim of the game warden's decision making, and the court system after shooting a feral dog. Or, face huge fines, and possible jail time, as well as civil court compensation for killing a collared dog. And, I am not talking about a dispute between two people over a dog. I am talking about a collared dog running wild in the woods.

Even when game departments openly acknowledge that feral dogs are a problem, similar to feral hogs, permission to kill them on sight is generally NOT ALLOWED due to our sensitivities towards pets. EVEN WHEN THEY ARE OBVIOUSLY NO LONGER PETS.

 

[waarp8nt]

Here in Illinois were are fortunate enough to have laws to allow us to protect our person & livestock from dogs. However, the law does not allow for us to protect our pets, for example if the dogs attacked my dog, then by law I could not have done anything to prevent it.

Local ordances do not allow dogs to run at large.

Feral dogs were an issue in this area some time ago, in fact if you lost live stock to dogs you could petition the county and they would pay for the loss. I don't believe it is in effect anymore.

 

[LawrenceA]

This is in Austraalia. Same dog problems different gun laws.
This was not a feral dog but a good story none the less.
My father had a problem with the neighbour's dog getting into the chickens, peacocks and other fowl on his 3 acre block on the edge of town.
He spoke to the neighbour and told him the problem and asked that he fix his fence to stop the dog getting out (my father's place has a permanent creek and cannot be effectively fenced).
The neighbour told him to shoot the dog if it returned.
A couple days later the dog returned.
A couple of days after that the neighbour asked my father if he had shot his dog.
He replied he had.
The neighbour stood stunned for a bit and then asked why. He was then reminded of the prior conversation and the request to shoot the dog if it returned.
He then told my father that it had cost a few thousand in vet's bills to save the dog.
My father suggested the neighbour that it would likely have been easier and cheaper to fix the fence.
The neighbour was dumb struck and soon departed.
The fence was fixed a few days later.

 

[GoodRabbitPilgrim]

That would have been hair raising mate,

I would have been annoyed if someone shot my gsp as I know she would never go near someone's pets or livestock. I had a whippet once attack sheep (fortunately my own) and he shortly departed this world. No sympathy for that type of thing be it feral, someone else's or my own.

 

[Eterry]

Dad bought his farm in 1983, it had been abandoned for years. Theres a bridge where everyone thinks its humane to dump out their pets. When he bought the place there was a huge pack of feral dogs. We kept a gun in the barn, at the door, and on us most of the time. Slowly we picked them off 1 at a time.

Then one sunday morning they attached the chicken pen en masse, 6 dogs in total. 4 of us managed to kill the 6 after about 30 minutes of back and forth.

Strays still show up at the bridge, they get no mercy from us and our neighbors.
Be careful out there.

Regardless how bold they are, most times gunfire will turn them.

 

[No Deer]

The three S method..... Shoot, Shovel, Shut-up.

 

[Sparkitoff]

There's a huge study that was done that additives in dog and cat food are making them more aggressive. Feral dogs eat cats and cat food, so do coyotes. Bears eat dog and cat food, sometimes fed to them and sometimes incidentally. Same for raccoons. So on and so on, all these animal attacks and aggression are on the rise world-wide. This particular study blamed the food additives for nulling the animals inherit fear of humans and overall aggression. I'm glad you were able to solve the problem and it is interesting you did it with a flintlock. Great service taking a youngster hunting too!

 

[Howie1968]

The day started out early, about an hour before bright and early. We met up at my house and headed for the woods, I stopped by the barn to get a chair and allow enough time for the young man to get to my stand in the hopes I may kick something up for him as I walked to my spot among the multiplier roses and autumn olives. The young man walked a couple of does to the far side of the woods as he walked in, as for me...didn't see a darn thing on the way to the briars and shrubs. It had been a little while and I decided to "check in" on the young man, he said he seen three does cross the field in front of him, but they were too far off for the confidence he had in his recently purchased muzzleloader. While setting there in the mess of briars at the edge of the woods, I noticed a couple of dogs run by me. They didn't notice me setting there, just ran on by through the field. One dog was large and most likely a Malamute, the other dog was obviously a mix as it looked Boxer, but had somewhat shorter legs. To be honest, I didn't think much of it...just figured it was one neighbors let their dogs loose for a while. Thought they may even kick up a deer for the young man. It wasn't long and a doe running in on my left hand side, she was running and turned right for me so I stood up as to keep her from jumping on me, then I realized the dogs were chasing her as she ducked around the corner to get into the woods away from the dogs. The dogs came out of the woods after the doe left them behind, still the dogs didn't notice me. They started running back through the field and ended up by the young man, unknown to me at the time, from up in the stand he waved his hat trying to get the dogs to leave, the just dogs growled at him and ran off.
A little later, the dogs were over in the barn lot. The Malamute was jumping up attempting to kick up rabbits, the other dog was simply running around the barn lot. I didn't much care for them hunting the rabbits, but I had another concern as the young man and I built a fence in the barn lot the previous week. That fence held my two fainting goats and was attached to one side of my barn. It was one thing the dogs hunting rabbits, I was just hoping the dogs wouldn't find the goats. Several minutes later they did...the Boxer looking dog had went into the barn and came out right next to the goats. It was "game on" for the dogs. The goats were carrying on, the dogs barking trying to get into the fence and my dog barking...penned up about a half a quarter away by the house. I worked my way out of the briars on the far side of the field and crossed the field in a hurry, I pulled up my .54 caliber Flintlock Renegade, but was afraid it could shoot through and hit a goat if I pulled the trigger. I was still fairly far away as there was a small valley and a creek to get across, but it would be best to get a better angle. The hill down to and up from the creek are fairly steep, so I worked my way upstream to cross a small ford to get to the barn lot. As I approached the lot, I began to shout and clap my hands in hopes the dogs would just run off. The dogs would do no such thing, the Boxer mix turned and came toward me barking and growling. I pulled the flintlock from my shoulder as I walked to the side to keep from shooting toward the goats and barn. Pulling the rifle up and started to aim at the dog, then I realized I had only one shot, I had not brought a handgun and only had a smaller knife with gut hook, not my large hunting knife. The Malamute dog pulled away from attempting to get into the pen and started coming my way, at first I thought he was just going to walk by and run off, but he turned to me and showed his teeth as the other dog crossed his path to get to the other side in an attempt to circle me. My thoughts raced as I decided I would be better off shooting the larger dog and battle the shorter dog using my flintlock as a club. So, I quickly aimed and shot the larger dog and immediately slid the rifle down my hands to use it as a club. As the dust settled and the smoke cleared, the Boxer mix was running off and the Malamute took its last breath as I approached. I went up to the barn to check on the goats and they were fine, the dogs had tried to dig under the barn wood to get the goats and broke ground on the fence. I loaded my rifle and went back to check the big dog. He was dead from a well placed shot, no collar and stunk like a dumpster...certainly not a pet.
The young man met me in the barn lot, I apologized for ruining his morning hunt. We discussed the dogs growling at him and the fact that he couldn't hear me yelling or clapping over the dogs barking while they were attempting to get to the goats. He and I went to the house and enjoyed a cup of coffee (soda for him) and a snack before heading back out, this time I brought a hunting knife along with my flintlock. While I had been muzzleloader hunting before, it was the first time taking an animal with a flintlock. The young man seen a couple more does that afternoon, but was patient and didn't pull the trigger as they were over 100 yards away.

This was my hunt yesterday they came from a neighbooring property the big white one hiked his leg up and peed on the hay i have for deer. They went to the feeder ate some corn. I whistled to them to come to the ground blind. They were friendly dogs they got in the back of my truck and i found out where they lived and took them home. Around here it is common to see dogs sniffing around i cant think how many hog dogs ive found. Ive only had 1 dog come at me in the woods and a shot in the air deterred the dog. A few pics

 

[Rifleman1776]

Feral dogs are nothing to be played with. They are fully capable of killing adult humans.

Amen, Bro. And, not acknowledged by many, loose running family dogs almost always revert to feral behavior then back to gentle pet when they get home. I was once arrested (only time in my life) for shooting a dog that had killed two (possibly three) of my cattle. The arrest was highly political but still involved handcuffs, lawyers, court, etc. Fortunately, I had an expert witness who testified that a pet is usually feral when away from home. Case was dismissed.

 

[R.J.Bruce]

Something that most pet owners that DON'T HUNT, have zero knowledge of, is as Rifleman1776 stated.......

Domesticated dogs that are thousands of generations (usually) away from their wild genetic ancestors, IF CAUGHT UP IN A PACK OF FERAL DOGS, will INSTANTLY revert to their once wild behavior. If they refuse to join in, either the alpha male, or the female in the pack will set the other dogs on it, and destroy it right then. There is ZERO compromise in pack behavior. Its join in, or die. And be eaten.

Another thing is that feral dogs most often kill for the mere sake of killing, not to eat. I have seen deer left alive in piteous shape, with much of their skin flayed off, hamstrung, intestines spilled out, faces chewed off, etc. That's why we shot them on sight back when I started hunting in the 60's.

Domesticated dogs & cats just have no place in the wild ecosystem.

 

[mikeinpa]

Years back we raised chickens, goats and ducks. A dog got in the chicken pen and killed a mess of chickens. he also kilIed the neighbors chickens. I called the game warden and asked " should I call you when it returns"? She said just shoot it and save the collar for me and we'll make sure the owner pays for your damage. I don't know if that would work in suburban Pa nowadays.

 

[Spikebuck]

While I wouldn't just shoot a dog for being in the woods (sometimes hunters or hikers "lose" a dog temporarily), I'd certainly do it if it was like those described which were clearly vicious. About 35 years ago I lived in a little town of about 50 people and a large feral mutt was running around. It had attacked and nearly killed our small dog in our yard and aggressively confronted our 3 YO daughter in the yard with us right there. But it somehow knew what a gun was because on several occasions when it came in the yard, I'd grab my rifle and go out to shoot it and it would take off the instant it saw a gun in my hands. If no gun, it would aggressively confront. So, one morning I Ieft the gun on the open porch and just sat and waited until it came around. I stood up with no gun in hand so it would see me, but the gun was within quick reach in the corner. It was the last time it confronted anyone. As a side note, I had asked all around to see if anyone knew who the dog belonged to and no one did. I also called the county sheriff's office asking what I could do and they said to shoot it. Done deal.

 

[LME]

A lot of people here haven't ever seen a feral dog. If you have you know without a doubt if it is a feral dog or not. A tame or feral are like two different animals.

 

[R.J.Bruce]

Anybody that thinks that they KNOW & TRUST their pet dog 100%, should think again. When I was in high school one of my fellow homeroom students came from a DIE HARD hunting & fishing family. One day in 11th grade, 1971, he came into class Monday morning during hunting season with the following tale. His family had several contiguous pieces of property on the Eastern Shore of Maryland comprising quite a few acres that the locals knew NOT to trespass on as this family was very adamant about protecting their property/hunting rights.

The extended family was out hunting in their tree stands early on Saturday morning when a pack of feral dogs came through their property around dawn chasing deer. This family could not abide feral dogs disturbing wild game, as they subsisted as much as possible on wild game as opposed to domesticated meat.

They came down from their tree stands, got on their three-wheelers (remember those?), chased down the pack, ambushed it, and killed off more than half of the 20 plus dogs in the pack.

Come to find out that one of my classmate's father's prized hunting dogs had gotten loose, joined the pack, and been killed in the ambush.

The family found the aftermath of half a dozen not quite dead deer that morning scattered all over the landscape that the pack of feral dogs, INCLUDING THE HIGHLY PRIZED SETTER, had chased down, worried, and NOT KILLED.

JUST FOR THE THRILL OF THE CHASE.

So don't anybody ever tell me that they 100% KNOW their so-called domesticated animal, especially dogs. I have had too many close encounters in my 66 years to EVER be completey comfortable around any pet.

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE DOGS. I just always keep in the forefront of my mind what a dog is capable of if it choses to attack.

 

[andy52]

My only encounter with a dog while hunting was much less threatening and rather amusing.
I was hunting on a island on the Mississippi when this beagle comes walking by I was sitting on the ground leaning on a tree to my back. This dogs sees me and comes over and flops down right beside me, soon there after it places it's head in my lap and falls asleep.
A short time later a deer comes by at about 30 yds up comes my .54, Boom deer goes down and the last thing I see is the dog heading for higher ground. I guess it didn't like being awakened in such a manner.

 

[bptactical]

The statement about domestic canines reverting to their pack mentality and behavior is spot on.
My father was a veterinarian (large animal mainly) and we had a 5 acre place with 6 paddocks/stalls along with the barn he had converted to his practice/office, a large chicken coop and couple smaller out buildings. We were out and away from town a considerable distance and our closest neighbor to the south was a mile and a half away.
The majority of my dads practice was related to a horse racing track in the area. Now if you know anything about horse racing you know that race horses are $$$$ some are very large $$$$$$.
I was about 12 at the time and we had a mare at our place that was close to foaling, she had a history of difficult births so the owner brought her to our place. She gave birth to a filly and when she was about a week old dad loaded the family into the car and we went into town for dinner.
When we got home we were driving down our driveway and saw what we thought was a deer at first but it looked odd. It ran off and we saw about 5-6 dogs chasing it.
Dad didn’t like the looks of it and drove around back to the paddocks and was horrified to find the mare torn up badly and the filly was down and dead. My sister had rabbits in the chicken coop and they were all dead, torn and ripped apart.
We got good tracks and my dad figured it out, a pack of dogs were were the perpetrators.
I have never seen my dad that upset, it wasn’t really a mad but more of a hurt and sad, quiet internal rage.
The next afternoon he came to me with his Winchester 88 in .243 with a Unertl scope and 2 boxes of cartridges.
He told me he would give me $5 for every dog I buried. He told me to shoot from the roof of the chicken coop and stay up there if the pack came close, he knew how dangerous pack dogs would be.
I made $40 the next night and $20 the night after that.
I hate to say it but dropping the hammer on a dog on a dead run is a heckuva challenge and a fun test of your marksmanship
The odd looking deer we saw? A huge Great Dane.
We never had a rogue dog problem after that again.

Oh and OP, the rule of the 3 S’s applies to your case.
Shoot
Shovel
Shut up

 

[waarp8nt]

I love dogs, I have a Golden Retriever mix that was given to me by a friend. We go to the woods often, mushroom hunting, checking the fence, checking on next seasons firewood and just for walks. I spend a fair amount of time outdoors and most of the time he goes with me. I remember early in my deer hunting experiences one of the neighbors dogs coming over to me, under my stand and just making a bunch of noise. Barking at me, running around making noise in the dry leaves...he was wanting to play as we had done many times before when he got loose from his aging pen. I have no issues with pets what so ever, so long as they are friendly, I would gladly lose a morning hunt to keep a pet safe. I took the dog back home when I went to eat lunch, the neighbor who happens to be my 2nd cousin apologized for the dog and we laughed about it.

Some food for thought. Here is the issue I have with the 3 S's in my situation, Microchip GPS Locators. In my mind to simply burry the dog on your property, your suddenly hiding / admitting your guilty of wrong doing. I left the dog lay in the same place all day until well after dark before I hauled it off the property. Just in case some liberally challenged dog owner, who chipped their dog before turning their pet loose on the world, suddenly decided they wanted to be responsible for it and challenge my actions. I left the dog lay there until we were done hunting for the day. I understand every situation is different, every area is different regarding dogs / feral dogs and protecting oneself or livestock and it can be difficult making the right decision after the fact. Locally, the Sheriff's office would handle complaints of this nature, since my actions were justified and legal, I had nothing to hide, I believe I made the correct decision for my situation. If the laws and ordnances in our county were not in my favor, I may have handled it differently with the 3 B's (bundle, backhoe, bury).

Something else to think about, I heard a story second hand from a friend of a friend, so take it for what its worth. He said a retired fellow he knew shot a dog that kept killing his chickens. He put the dead dog in his truck and hauled it off. Later that day the dog owner showed up on his door step asking why he shot his dog, the property owner, at first denied shooting the dog that kept killing his chickens. The dog owner said the dog was here for a while, then left the property at 55mph and ended up over by the Interstate where I found it had been shot. The property owner admitted to shooting the dog because it kept killing his chickens. The dog owner accepted that answer and left without further comment. Not sure what to think of this story...is it true or not. Could be, people can locate a stolen car in such a manner...

As a young man, back before the county would pay you for the feral dog activities (loss of livestock). My brother was just old enough to drive legally, I was 10 years younger than him, so I'm guessing 6 or 7 years old. My parents had livestock on the old hobby farm, long before they built the new house...they build a cattle barn and fence. Cattle, hogs and goats were the critters I remember helping feed, don't recall us every having chickens or birds of any kind. Dad was working that day at his job and did not come home on time, which meant he had to work overtime. As a result, my brother decided we would go feed, so my dad wouldn't have to do it after dark. I remember pumping the water to mix this nasty smelling brown stuff to feed the hogs, then we went back to the barn to feed the cattle and goats. We had a gravity feed wagon in the barn, we dipped corn from it to feed the cattle and goats. We had just finished up the chores and were getting ready to head back to the truck when suddenly my brother grabbed my and threw me into the gravity feed wagon. Before I could complain he jumped into the wagon as well. He said look over there, a pack of feral dogs made it through the fence and was on the way to the barn. The dogs messed around in the barn lot, barking at us and the critters, but mostly running around. Then they left, we waited some time after they were gone to go to the truck, as a young boy it seemed like forever... Since we were just feeding the livestock and had not intended on doing other work we didn't bring any water. There was a Thermos from a day or two before with coffee, so I had a sample. To this day I'm still not a fan of cold coffee and for the life of cannot figure out why kids want to buy it that way. My brother received a revolver for Christmas that year and I do not recall us ever going back the barn or woods to check fence without it