tomahawks vs hatchets?

[fatboy]

A wheellock ax look at that

 

[Jim Blair]

The design of the blade in the 1st and 3rd axes in the picture can also be used as a thrusting weapons as well as chopping.

 

[Jim Blair]

As far as terminolgy used in original period writings,yes.The words "tomahawk" and "hatchet" seem to be used to describe a one handed bladed,hafted piece that could be used as a weapon or tool equally in more than "casual conversation".I can't see a farmer called up for militia duty going out and buying a "tomahawk" when he had a suitable "hatchet" at hand.

 

[fatboy]

I can't see a farmer called up for militia duty going out and buying a "tomahawk" when he had a suitable "hatchet" at hand.

I have to agree

 

[fatboy]

Not of the same time period but wanted to share this referring to Viking arms

One advantage of an axe over other edged weapons is that all the force of the blow is concentrated into a small section of the blade, so the axe has enough power to punch through a helmet or mail. The sagas often mention axe blows that cleave the head down to the shoulders.

 

[vtbuck223]

I think that there is something to be said for the fact that these items are still used today even in our modern military. It really speaks to their usefulness as tools and weapons. My son is a Cavalry Scout...he wanted a VTAC...tactical tomahawk...for Christmas this year. These are made by American Tomahawk Co. and after having one in my hand....can tell you that it would work quite well for a variety of applications. Apparently they are actually issued as part of kits for certain units....but many individual soldiers choose to carry them in the field. These tomahawks are fairly expensive...but you get what you pay for. There are many cheaply made versions that when you hold in your hand you realize would be good for nothing...even though they look almost the same. My point is that...how something is made makes a big difference...and was no doubt true back then as well. Well made items would be much more effective than something that was poorly made. A well made and balanced tomahawk probably would have worked well for a variety of tasks.......

 

[Rifleman1776]

As far as terminolgy used in original period writings,yes.The words "tomahawk" and "hatchet" seem to be used to describe a one handed bladed,hafted piece that could be used as a weapon or tool equally in more than "casual conversation".I can't see a farmer called up for militia duty going out and buying a "tomahawk" when he had a suitable "hatchet" at hand.

Methinks a tomahawk can be used as a wood whacker and a hatchet can kill a man.Perhaps not specialized for those duties but will work.

 

[crockett]

That "Take up the hatchet"- I am just now reading an article in this month's issue of Muzzle Blasts and that term is used. British Governor of Canada Sir Guy Carleton, upon hearing of the Ethan Allen/Arnold march to Canada caused Carleton to..
"instigating the Indian nations to take up the hatchet" p7, March 2012 issue. In any event, I think the terms hatchet and tomahawk were used interchangably even though we today differentiate between a hatchet and a tomahawk.

 

[huntinguy]

In any event, I think the terms hatchet and tomahawk were used interchangably even though we today differentiate between a hatchet and a tomahawk.

I think that is a very accurate statement. We, modern folks, in an attempt to be "HC/PC" put way tooooo much into what was and what wasn't.

As one instructor I had once said, "wood or flesh, the blade doesn't know the difference." Look at what some martial arts can do with the sickle.

Each item has its pros and cons. My guess is it was just what the owner had or could acquire and what they were doing.

Building a cabin- felling ax or broad ax. Around the cabin, small ax for splitting fire wood. A foray into the woods... a small ax and if it was a hatchet or tomahawk... well it was what ever you had. I have read many accounts of the the difference between and Indian fire and a white mans fire. I don't think the Indian needed a very heavy hatchet for that work... White man, bigger is better has been a theory for a long time...

Also, keep in mind there were two sources for supplies. The local governments and the raided farms, houses and tribes.

Wern't no Walmart folks :shake:

 

[dyemaker]

Also, keep in mind there were two sources for supplies. The local governments and the raided farms, houses and tribes.

Wern't no Walmart folks :shake:

This is true. Maybe I shouldn't have mentioned such specialized weapons/ tools. About the civil war U.S. Navy boading axe... I imagine the introduction of iron clad vessels opened a whole new can of worms. Also, I cannot help but wonder
if there were any frontier tommahawk/flintlock hybrid weapons. If so I imagine them to be quite rare. i've never seen one. Sorry for straying from the subject. :hmm:

 

[Birdman]

:bow: :thumbsup: All I can say is WOW!!! I posted the question about hawks vs hatchetts n never would have thought this much GREAT info would come out. This site as the kids say IS THE BOMB, Thank you gentlemen one n all, and keep it coming if your a mind to, I am enjoying every single post, YMHS Birdman

 

[fatboy]

VTBuck I wish your son well if he is over in the sandbox somewhere. Those are pretty pricey not sure what type steel they are using but sure look like they will get the job done. Joe DeLaRonde makes period type hawks and has on his website that military and contracter orders take priority and I think I have seen some other makers taking orders for military also.

 

[poordevil]

I read some, but not all of the reply's, so this may have been brought up. But I understand that the word "Tomahawk" is an Algonquin word for their stone headed war clubs. When the Europeans brought over their European axes the Indians called those "Tomahawk" also. The tomahawk retains the European style, while an American style of ax head developed over here.

This is from my dust covered library between my ears.

p

 

[Jim Blair]

Origin 1605-1615
Virginia Algonquin-tamahaac(English spelling)-hatchet-Equivalent to Proto-Algonquin temah(to cut off)+a-akan(instrument for)

:grin:

 

[necchi]

poodevil and Scots Jim,
Now thats cool, now we have the origin of both words
Thank you both :grin:

 

[vtbuck223]

I am currently reading "War on the Run" by John Foss...an excellent read so far. P.192 talks about the attempts to transform British regulars under Abercromby into an effective fighting force in North American conditions. There is a quote from the journal of a Dr. Huck in which he writes of the regulars..."many have taken up the Hatchet and wear Tomahawks"...in describing their equipment and appearance. Interesting that he seems to refer to them using both names in the very same sentence.

 

[fatboy]

So that is letting us know they are 2 different items wouldnt you say? But used for the same thing

 

[Jim Blair]

Good book,I'll have to dig it out and read it again.

 

[fatboy]

Looks like a good book they rated it 4.5 stars

 

[Claude Mathis]

... he writes of the regulars..."many have taken up the Hatchet and wear Tomahawks"...in describing their equipment and appearance. Interesting that he seems to refer to them using both names in the very same sentence.

"Taking up the hatchet" is a phrase that is the same as "going on the War Path". It doesn't necessarily mean a particular weapon is being used. Or, "bury the hatchet" - to make peace. It's a figure of speech.