The Punt Gun

[Feltwad]

The two previous threads on fowling covered the Duck Gun and the Goose Gun .Another important gun for fowling is the Punt Gun these are large bore smooth bore guns some in flintlock and some percussion ,these were used in flat bottom boats known has a punt. Those that are open decked were used mainly on the marshes {ings}, while the larger ones which were two man punts and deck covered were used on the fore shore or the river estuary. To the fowlers of the Victorian and Edwardian period both the gun and the punt were tools of a trade to these people it was a living and any surplus was sold at market
The main quarry at that period was geese , swans, whoopee swans , ducks, not forgetting the large flocks of starlings that roosted in the marsh reed beds
In the States these fowling people were known has Market Gunners .Enclosed are a couple of images of punt guns
Feltwad

Two Punt Guns Middle

 

[Rifleman1776]

Market Gunners

Yes. But, not realized by many is why these guns and that type of harvesting (not 'hunting', IMHO) went out of favor. Was not due to laws or other restrictions. Was because of the invention of refrigeration. Game meats no longer had to be fresh. Fowl, and other animals, could be farm raised, slaughtered and held for a period of time and shipped to consumers. Market hunters were no longer needed.

 

[Feltwad]

Market Gunners

Yes. But, not realized by many is why these guns and that type of harvesting (not 'hunting', IMHO) went out of favor. Was not due to laws or other restrictions. Was because of the invention of refrigeration. Game meats no longer had to be fresh. Fowl, and other animals, could be farm raised, slaughtered and held for a period of time and shipped to consumers. Market hunters were no longer needed.

Yes you may be right for the 1930s onwards but for the Victorian and Edwardian period here in the UK the main Towns and Cities were supplied with wild fowl from the marshes and fore shore which was shipped to these cities and towns by rail .
Feltwad

 

[Juice Jaws]

Market Gunners

Yes. But, not realized by many is why these guns and that type of harvesting (not 'hunting', IMHO) went out of favor. Was not due to laws or other restrictions. Was because of the invention of refrigeration. Game meats no longer had to be fresh. Fowl, and other animals, could be farm raised, slaughtered and held for a period of time and shipped to consumers. Market hunters were no longer needed.

I am not so sure about that. Refrigeration in every house hold did not come intill after WW II. My dad said they did not get refrigeration intill after the war and he live in central Calif. I think it went out of favor because of game laws, and killing off lots of waterfowl. Just my three cents worth

 

[Coot]

Histories of the Chesapeake Bay have multiple stories of 'cat & mouse' games played between market gunners and game wardens for years after punt guns were outlawed for hunting. Pretty sure Michener's "Chesapeake" has several such tales.

 

[Juice Jaws]

Histories of the Chesapeake Bay have multiple stories of 'cat & mouse' games played between market gunners and game wardens for years after punt guns were outlawed for hunting. Pretty sure Michener's "Chesapeake" has several such tales.

Do you have any idea when the punt guns were outlaw?

 

[Coot]

Some states were taking action to either ban or regulate market hunting by the latter 1800s. The Lacy Act of 1900 banned transporting of wild game across state lines (pretty hard to prove on interconnected MD, VA & NC waterways) Various Federal laws/regs in 1918 put an end to the legal practice of market hunting.

 

[Feltwad]

Some states were taking action to either ban or regulate market hunting by the latter 1800s. The Lacy Act of 1900 banned transporting of wild game across state lines (pretty hard to prove on interconnected MD, VA & NC waterways) Various Federal laws/regs in 1918 put an end to the legal practice of market hunting.

Enclosed are a couple of images showing the English style of punt used mostly on the UK estuary
Feltwad

 

[Feltwad]

Some states were taking action to either ban or regulate market hunting by the latter 1800s. The Lacy Act of 1900 banned transporting of wild game across state lines (pretty hard to prove on interconnected MD, VA & NC waterways) Various Federal laws/regs in 1918 put an end to the legal practice of market hunting.

Enclosed are a couple of images showing the English style of punt used mostly on the UK estuary
Feltwad

There seems to be little interest in this thread ,is this because the punt gun became illegal in the States many years ago with the result that most of todays muzzle loaders have little recollection on this type of gun and its practice ?

Feltwad

 

[azmntman]

I wouldnt say Im not interested, I am. Just that I had only heard of this once from an old timer from Maine who used to see it happen. Its "commercial" a bit too much for me. I'm into the historical survival type stuff like Mnt Men (who were commercial as well with pelts). I always wondered how a bow mounted 4 ga looked. Thank you!

 

[Rifleman1776]

I wouldn't say not much interest. Just a lack of knowledge and most of us cannot expand beyond what you post. The interest is there, please continue sharing.

 

[Feltwad]

I wouldn't say not much interest. Just a lack of knowledge and most of us cannot expand beyond what you post. The interest is there, please continue sharing.

Enclosed is a image of a small punt gun in flintlock. Notice the hole in the butt though which the rope passed to the front of the punt to absorb the recoil .On the big guns the recoil is so strong that when the gun is fired the punt is pushed back in the water a good 10 yards
Feltwad

 

[trent/OH]

Please explain the mention of starlings on the marshes. Were they also hunted for the market?

 

[Flint62Smoothie]

I wouldn't say not much interest. Just a lack of knowledge and most of us cannot expand beyond what you post ...

Agreed 110%!

 

[Coot]

[/quote]
There seems to be little interest in this thread ,is this because the punt gun became illegal in the States many years ago with the result that most of todays muzzle loaders have little recollection on this type of gun and its practice ?

Feltwad [/quote]

Knowledge of these guns and the practice of market gunning seems to be a regional thing in this country. If you ever make it to this side of the pond, there is a great museum in Harve de Grace, Maryland ( not far from Baltimore), that is a specialist in waterfowl hunting. They have many punts and sneak boxes, guns & decoys that anyone interested in the subject would enjoy. They also host a wildlife festival & decoy auction each year.

 

[Artificer]

Some states were taking action to either ban or regulate market hunting by the latter 1800s. The Lacy Act of 1900 banned transporting of wild game across state lines (pretty hard to prove on interconnected MD, VA & NC waterways) Various Federal laws/regs in 1918 put an end to the legal practice of market hunting.

Enclosed are a couple of images showing the English style of punt used mostly on the UK estuary
Feltwad

There seems to be little interest in this thread ,is this because the punt gun became illegal in the States many years ago with the result that most of todays muzzle loaders have little recollection on this type of gun and its practice ?

Feltwad

Can't speak for anyone else, but I have sure enjoyed your pictures in this thread!

BTW, having an actual Punting Boat to "accessorize" your Punt Gun collection is quite a coup!

Gus

 

[azmntman]

Yes for sure, I have always wanted to see on!

 

[nhmoose]

This has been a Great thread!!!!!!

 

[Pukka Bundook]

What may not be clear to all on this side of the pond, is that punt-gunning in the UK has never been outlawed, and is still practiced by a few.

In modern times, this is sporting shooting mostly, just getting lined up for a couple of good shots in a season is worth it to some.
To get a decent shot takes a lot of skill, and does not happen very often.

I think someone mentioned a 4-bore above, but a 4-bore is really too small for a punt -gun, and most were a lot bigger.
I forget Peter Hawker's record on starlings, shot with his double, but it was a Lot!
Yes, starlings can be eaten but must be skinned to cook, as the skin is V bitter. However, many were shot to reduce the over-population, as they kill trees with their bird-lime, when in the V large flocks they tend to congregate in, in winter. A real pest at times.

Nice looking punt guns Feltwad. Thank you for showing them.
Do you know where they were used?
G-father used to shoot on the Wash, but that was in the Edwardian period.

 

[Feltwad]

Please explain the mention of starlings on the marshes. Were they also hunted for the market?

Starling roosted in the reed beds of the marshes {ings] in their thousands and still do today. In the Victorian era it was quite common to shoot them with a punt gun loaded with small shot but is not practiced today. One shot from a punt gun could produce a bag of 100 plus for which most went to market and for each starling they got 1.1/2d or 2d .
The following is a small list of prices for wildfowl in the Victorian Period
Brent Geese 2/6d, Bittens 2/- ducks 2/-to 2/6d Swans 5/-, Whooper Swans 6/6d and 7/-
Feltwad