The Discriminating General firearms

[Charles Painter]

Hi everyone. Im new to the forum and wanted to know if anyone has any info about The Discriminating General firearms. Im looking at their 18th Century Blunderbuss and wanted to know if their firarms are of good quality. Thanks

 

[54ball]

Among Indian made importers The Discriminating General sometimes gets poor ratings. Loyalist Arms and Veteran Arms seem to offer better products and support.

 

[Charles Painter]

Thanks for the info. I'll check out the other venders.

 

[Alden]

The Discriminating General/Military Heritage sells what I believe are SECONDS of India-made arms. Now think for a moment just how bad that really has to be... Worst products across the board of any seller, consistently, in my experience. And we're not starting from "above average" with India-made to begin with -- oh no. And their customer service? Absolutely awful to the point of being non-existent, also in my personal experience! The swashbuckling tailor who owns the place is/they are a joke.

 

[tenngun]

I have never delt with them, but I have heard complaints about them and seen complaints on line. I have heard better about middle section village for simular price range :idunno:

 

[Grenadier1758]

I believe that the Discriminating General sells the guns without a touch hole so they avoid the cost of proofing their guns.

Since you would be the person installing a touchhole, you would bear all the responsibility of any mishap that could occur.

I can't recommend them.

 

[zimmerstutzen]

For years many kit guns were sold without touch holes. (My 2 early CVA flint kits) Even many "custom" gun grade barrels come without touch holes. Guess that notion makes all of them dangerous as well.

Kit guns and some others are imported without touch holes to avoid firearms/export regulations in the source countries. India firearms manufacturers may not export guns to a country without a certification from the receiving country that importation to the destination has been licensed and approved. A sheer impossibility for exports to the US, as no US government agency will issue such a certification. So the maker needs to ship something other than a finished working firearm, if destined for the US. Not because of shoddy workmanship, although some makers are less than quality, but because of idiotic bureaucratic regulations in India. Before that regulation was passed in India, gov't proofed ready to fire Indian guns were easily exported to the US.. (there were US Import taxes) Even Navy Arms sold India made double barrel muzzle loader shotguns 40 years ago, complete with India Gov't proofs.

It bothers me that some dealers sell these without naming the makers, for some are certainly better than others. Kind of like selling a bolt action rifle without saying it is a Winchester, Remington, or Mauser.

 

[Charles Painter]

Wow. I had no ideal they are/where that bad. Thanks gents for the heads up.

 

[Zonie]

I have no idea about whether they are good or bad but as anyone who imports anything from India knows, there are some very well made things from some companies and there are some very poorly made things from other companies.

To find the ones that produce quality things the importer must spend a lot of time checking out each potential supplier. This takes a lot of time and it is not inexpensive.
Once a good company is found, long term binding contracts must be signed including the right of the importer to cancel the contract if the quality of the product drops.

Things like this explain why some importers can provide some fairly good quality guns while others, not so good.

As to the touch hole, companies in India cannot export working firearms without a raft of special approvals. Most of the companies that are currently building and exporting guns can not export a working firearm.

To get around this, the guns are shipped without the touch hole (and, I might add, without proofing).
The importer drills the vent and then sells it to the people in North America as a working gun.

The importer may, or may not proof test the gun, at his discretion.

 

[Alden]

...as anyone who imports anything from India knows, there are some very well made things from some companies...

Things like this explain why some importers can provide some fairly good quality guns while others, not so good.

I don't know of anything from India that is "very well made" myself, but I wouldn't say any of our guns from India are "fairly good quality." None exceed average and most only strive to be acceptable IMO. If this were not the case, by now we'd all know the better manufacturers names and who imports them. India-made guns are uniformly lower quality it seems to me.

 

[nit wit]

I had one, I bought on another forum. It was a 1640 fishtail with a broken frizzen. I called and talked to one of their staff. Number than a pounded thumb! She was not sure but thought it might be 100.00. I asked her if she was nuts! She replied that the gun was over 500.00. I ended the conversation. I called Jeff Miller in Waldoboro Maine and he hand forged a frizzen for 50.00.The gun itself was cool and shot fine. I upgraded to a L Day fishtail kit gun.
Middlesex trading would be better to deal with than DG for sure. If you have stupid people answering your phone, it speaks volumes about your company!
Nit Wit

 

[David Snellen]

Dear Sir,
I have owned DG, Middlesex and Loyalist. Loyalist is the only one of those I still have . My loyalist arms have been great, Middlesex ok and DG terrible.
Just my experience,
David

 

[Alden]

Agree on the hierarchy. I would include Veteran Arms' stuff in the middle of the pack as well, to be fair, though I don't like folks selling unidentified-origin reproductions on gun auction sites to the ignorant for a quick buck. There's another but he's getting out of selling India-made imports as acceptable*.

*Again, to be clear, everything is relative -- we're still talking India-made guns so they all start and end below the ladder-of-quality's middle-rung to begin with.

 

[CrackStock]

Veteran Arms

I have a Charleville from these people and it is doing pretty well for me.

CS

 

[Rifleman1776]

I don't know of anything from India that is "very well made"

Have to agree. I don't know what to think of a country that large that won't urge quality control on it's manufacturers. I have a friend who was a tractor dealer. They decided to carry a brand from India. One order and they quit. Too many faults, including castings so full of voids and holes oil would not stay inside. And watching the 'Amazing Race' show I am amazed when I see food being prepared right on the filthy bare ground with dogs and cows walking in it and eating some. :barf: It is sad. BTW, my bias is not the same as bigotry. I feel sorry for the people living there.

 

[zimmerstutzen]

I have had five pistols made in India. Three were imported by Veteran's arms. One gun bore proof marks and a manufacture date of August 1987. Only one was a flintlock. I wish my thompson center Hawken would have sparked as well. I have three custom flintlock long guns. The Indian lock sparks as fast and reliably as any of the fancy US made locks. Fit and finish of the guns from Sikligar was on par with Lyman or Traditions. The lowest quality gun had terrible fit and looked like a poorly finished Traditions kit. But I got it cheap and could finish it to my expectations. (Heck I buy butchered CVA kit guns to rework.) I recently examined an Indian made "something" It was all the bad things said here. It was not even loosely a style of a gun. Looked like a colonial roman nose stock with barrel bands on the barrel and a back action lock. I actually expected to see the name Stoeger on it. But it was stamped made in India. It had been fired. Huge gaps in the fit. very rough filed surface on the lock plate. Would have been considered amaturish for even a middle school student shop project.

 

[Billnpatti]

Indian made guns are temptingly cheap but they are very seldom of the quality of Italian made guns such as Pedersoli. If you want it as a wall hanger or for reenacting, it will probably serve you quite well. I would never shoot a projectile from an Indian made gun but shooting blanks, when reenacting, you're probably okay. Indian made guns look pretty good from a distance and will serve pretty well when parading around and shooting blanks but that's all I would consider using them for. If you want a gun with which to hunt or to shoot targets but have limited funds, look around for a used gun made by a reputable manufacturer such as Pedersoli, Traditions, etc. and forget Indian made guns. Just the opinion of an old fart, take it for what it's worth.

 

[nwtradegun]

for the cost of an india made gun you can get a quality Italian in excellent condition there are few if any parts for india made guns.

 

[KingofDerby]

Indians are mostly used here (the UK does not have many people doing period style hunting, but has lots more doing reenacting) BUT...all guns have to go through Birmingham Proofhouse, and they test them for shot and ball, with oversized charges.

So while I don't shoot anything out of my gun normally, the few times we go target shooting, I feel safe enough taking my indian made 1728.

The extra cost for a Pedersoly (£925 compared to 375 for a Bess) makes it not worth it.

 

[AZbpBurner]

I have a Ketland from Middlesex Village, and after sending back the lock for unhardened sear & tumbler, then getting the same unhardened parts returned, I decided to harden them myself. I offered to harden parts for Pete, but never got any reply from him. In other questions to his wife Wendy, I've gotten no replies. I suspect they may have either gone TU already or about to. Once I got the lock fixed, and some wood work and refinishing done, it's an excellent musket. But, I'd never do business with them again. Will give them credit for the best sparking frizzen of any flintlocks I own.

OTOH, Loyalist has a better quality lock. It's still a kit gun, requiring a little fitting, shaping and finishing, but it is also a solid Fusil de Chasse. I WOULD do business with Loyalist again.