Sighting in a new(to me) rifle

Discussion in 'Percussion Rifles' started by Coalforge, Feb 2, 2019.

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  1. Feb 2, 2019 #1

    Coalforge

    Coalforge

    Coalforge

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    I am having a problem with a new rifle and while I have some ideas, I would welcome ideas to fix the problem. When I first shot the rifle, it would group good but the group was way to the right at 25 yds. I have drifted the rear sight to where the V notch is just over where the top flat slopes for the octagon barrel. The rifle still shoots about 5 inches to the right at 25 yds. I know I can drift the front sight to the right but that puts both sights way off center. I checked the barrel for straightness and that seems ok. I measured the barrel thickness from the bore to the vertical flat. The barrel on the right measures .195 in and on the left measures .237. It is either bored off center or bored crooked.

    How do I deal with this and get it to shoot to point of aim? View attachment 3980
     
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  2. Feb 2, 2019 #2

    Poboy

    Poboy

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    Ummmm....aim better?
     
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  3. Feb 2, 2019 #3

    Britsmoothy

    Britsmoothy

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    That sounds like a very bad barrel.
    A long straight piece of dowel or bar would help reveal the line of the bore.

    You maybe stuck with bending the barrel and or relieving the crown on the opposite side of the correction of shot you desire.
     
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  4. Feb 2, 2019 #4

    Hawgeye

    Hawgeye

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    I have the same problem with my rifle. The gun was built with the run-out horizontal rather than vertical. The only real fix that I know of is to rotate the barrel 90 degrees, re-breech, re-install the bolster, cut new dovetails for barrel pins and sights and plug the old dovetails with blanks. Not worth it in my estimation. I adjusted the sights to shoot to POI and live with the off center positions of the front and rear sights.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2019
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  5. Feb 2, 2019 #5

    Flintandsteel

    Flintandsteel

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    Bend the barrel.
     
  6. Feb 2, 2019 #6

    Gowacky

    Gowacky

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    You mentioned it is new. I suppose the obvious replace under warranty doesn’t work.
     
  7. Feb 2, 2019 #7

    Coalforge

    Coalforge

    Coalforge

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    My inclination is to try bending the barrel. My concern is that it is a full stock. I think it would still fit the stock even if I had to put a .050 bend in the barrel.

    Poboy: If it was “aim better” I wouldn’t have 5 rounds touching several inches to the right.

    Gowacky: It’s not a new rifle. It’s only new to me. I am at least 3rd owner.

    Thanks for the replies. I will post how it works out
     
  8. Feb 2, 2019 #8

    Gowacky

    Gowacky

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    I wish you the best. I think having to move the sights that far off line is just not an acceptable solution.
     
  9. Feb 2, 2019 #9

    arcticap

    arcticap

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    I would move the sights and see if you can correct it that way no matter how it looked.
    Make an extended base for the front sight if need be.
    Any further experimentation may result with being required to buy a new barrel so be prepared.

    I recall reading an article about the barrel bending process performed by Anschutz as part of their inspection process.
    It was a very specialized machine.
    While it was based on the operator's use of his naked eye, the actual process of what I would call "micro-bending" a barrel
    to meet their stringent specifications required special mechanical leverage.
    It seemed to be a highly sophisticated machine even though it may not have been space aged or computerized.
    Only certain individuals had the expertise to use it.
    I wouldn't expect every barrel maker to have such a machine, or to care as much about the straightness or accuracy of their barrels.

    I recently posted a thread asking folks about lemons they had purchased.
    Unfortunately your barrel would seem to qualify.

    Other than the problem with the sights and point of impact, how is the barrel's accuracy?

    I guess that there's always Kentucky windage.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2019
  10. Feb 2, 2019 #10

    Gowacky

    Gowacky

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    Even an extended base ? You must be kidding. I’d throw up on my moccasins every time I looked at that.

    I think I’d take it to a gun show and SELL!
     
  11. Feb 2, 2019 #11

    Poboy

    Poboy

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    Hey. may sound wacky, but not out of the realm of possibility that you could be aiming crooked.

    Was kidding, but, stranger things have happened. Good luck, and let us know.
     
  12. Feb 2, 2019 #12

    Coalforge

    Coalforge

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    “The Hawken Shop” is here in the island and they have a barrel straightening press. I talked to Greg and he said he had only straightened barrels, never bent one on purpose but we can give it a try.

    ArtiCal: At 25yds off of bags, 5 shots were all touching.
     
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  13. Feb 2, 2019 #13

    bang

    bang

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    If you bought new send it back.
     
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  14. Feb 3, 2019 #14

    F.G. Ford

    F.G. Ford

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    Sounds like it would be just fine if the deer was running hard to the right!
    Fred
     
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  15. Feb 3, 2019 #15

    F.G. Ford

    F.G. Ford

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    I would check the barrel several times to see if it really is off centre, if it is, scrap the barrel.
    It will never be a good shooter
     
  16. Feb 3, 2019 #16

    arcticap

    arcticap

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    Wow, that's a good shooting barrel and doesn't sound like it's bent or should be bent.
    I missed that fact when I first read your post.

    The formula for front sight adjustment or replacement is:
    Record:
    error on target in inches
    distance to target in inches
    sight radius in inches.
    divide error on target by distance to target,
    multiply by sight radius.

    The sight radius is the distance between the front and rear sight expressed in inches.

    If the rear sight is adjustable, adjust it to the middle of its adjustment limits to allow a range of adjustment up or down after replacing or modifying the front sight.

    For example, if the sight radius on a pistol is 10 inches:

    error on target= 12" low.
    distance to target is 900".
    sight radius is 10".
    12" divided by 900" = 0.01333 x 10" = 0.133".

    The front sight has to be lowered by 0.133 inches or a bit more than 1/8 of an inch (.125).

    However in this case, the formula could tell you how much the front sight would need to be drifted in the opposite direction.
    Then at least you know how much of a sight adjustment that you would need to make for a 25 yard zero.

    I would also consider Hawgeye's suggestion to rotate the barrel 90 degrees if there's no other option
    once you determine the amount of front sight adjustment that you would need to make.
    I hope that you can find a way to make it work since the barrel is an accurate shooter.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2019
  17. Feb 3, 2019 #17

    Huntschool

    Huntschool

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    If it is the run out, and it is horizontal and as bad as you say..... sorry, you are screwed. Bending may solve the problem at distance but it also may throw off your close shots. If you like the gun in and of itself then bite the bullet and toss the barrel and have a new one fit to the gun by a competent smith.

    I think with the departure of Douglas from the muzzle loading venue there are no manufacturers making barrels with run out. I think.... so a bore cut concentric to the barrel should fix your problem.

    JMHO
     
  18. Mar 10, 2019 #18

    bang

    bang

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    Had one like that over 40 years ago. No really good fix. If new get another barrel on warantee or just purchse a new better quality barrel.
     
  19. Mar 11, 2019 #19

    8 BORE

    8 BORE

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    Third owner? Wonder why !!!
    Maybe sell the gun to the 4th owner
    Get another gun
     
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  20. Mar 11, 2019 #20

    Carbon 6

    Carbon 6

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    If the barrel came from a major barrel maker I would be on the phone having a discussion with them. I'd just replace the barrel and be done with it. Hopefully the barrel maker would cover all or part of that expense.

    P.S. Bending won't fix an off center bore.
     

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