Siberian Snaplock

Help Support Muzzle Loading Forum:

cyten

32 Cal.
Joined
Jul 9, 2012
Messages
59
Reaction score
69
I spent last month hitching through Siberia while the weather was still good. In Gorno-Altaysk I came across this drawing from a Soviet railroad workers journal that was on display, showing and describing what the locals were using to hunt in the region.

F705E974-96E4-4178-B6AF-764E79A9929B.jpeg

The Rifle Shoppe sells a kit for one just like it, but I had always thoughт it was more of a Baltic area styled gun. During this time, many breechloading shotguns were used by poor folks/natives converted from Krnka/Berdan/Mosin rifles. It is interesting to see that even into the 30’s the old muzzleloader were still being used.
 
Joined
May 24, 2005
Messages
3,374
Reaction score
1,408
Hi Cyten

Thanks for posting. Interesting you bumped into that. The bipod attached to the gun stock seemed to be popular only in the various Eastern markets. Never really caught on in Western markets.
I also thought these guns were mostly Baltic origin. But not really sure. There are about a handful of these guns that have turned up in museums and collectors in California. Possibly brought here by Russian immigrants (?). They all seem to be of small caliber, for hunting smaller game I suppose. But they are simple, interesting guns.
Here is a lock that would likely have been found on one of these guns. Belongs to a fellow Forum member. All hand made from scratch. Note the manual pan cover.

Rick
AIOtmp (Medium).jpg
 

Sam squanch

50 Cal.
Joined
Oct 9, 2019
Messages
1,114
Reaction score
1,174
The Russian flintlock I made from the rifle shoppe parts was a little different. The outside mainspring looked like a regular hooked mainspring, but on the outside of the plate. The hooked end rode on the bottom of the hammer, like a tumbler. Kind of like the Italian miquelets. Dog catch with a spring on the back end.
 

cyten

32 Cal.
Joined
Jul 9, 2012
Messages
59
Reaction score
69
For as much time I've spent in California, I'm surprised I've never seen any then. I always imagined this is what kind of arm the explorers like Baranov used in Lord of Alaska.
I have seen similar rifles in Kyrgyzstan but with a snapping matchlock. I don't have any photos on my current computer but here is a painting from 1871 by Vasily Vasilyevich.
 
Joined
Mar 12, 2020
Messages
1,125
Reaction score
1,125
Location
New South Wales , Australia
Hi Cyten

Thanks for posting. Interesting you bumped into that. The bipod attached to the gun stock seemed to be popular only in the various Eastern markets. Never really caught on in Western markets.
I also thought these guns were mostly Baltic origin. But not really sure. There are about a handful of these guns that have turned up in museums and collectors in California. Possibly brought here by Russian immigrants (?). They all seem to be of small caliber, for hunting smaller game I suppose. But they are simple, interesting guns.
Here is a lock that would likely have been found on one of these guns. Belongs to a fellow Forum member. All hand made from scratch. Note the manual pan cover.

RickView attachment 99574
Any chance of seeing the back of that?
 

Rudyard

54 Cal.
Joined
Feb 28, 2019
Messages
1,571
Reaction score
1,378
My this is great 'Left Field stuff' . Not so sure about the togs but great theme and fascinateing guns . My great Mentor Elmer Johnston of Washington State was into Simerpols? the small l bore Russian guns & made examples .. I believe he had concluded that the guns where primerally to kill fur bearing creatures in traps & most all the pacific coast was trapped & traded in by Russians long before the Hudson's Bay & North West Company and other similar concerns where active in that region . Hitching through Siberia ! ,Your my sort of adventurer. All good stuff Thank you for posting.
Regards & positive salutations .
Rudyard
 
Joined
Mar 24, 2014
Messages
3,785
Reaction score
3,126
Location
Third Pond from the Great God Helios
YES, Please, we need further detailed instruction on the making of such locks and guns! Our Russian and Baltic Muzzleloading traditions have been ignored too long! Please help us rise above the swamp of ennui and ignorance into the sunlit uplands of gun building NIRVANA! Our ancestors from the Eastern regions expect tribute in BUFFALO MEAT!!!
 

Rudyard

54 Cal.
Joined
Feb 28, 2019
Messages
1,571
Reaction score
1,378
Dear Tree Stalker .You have an admirable way with words, good on you and clearly an imagination beyond the norm .I see Pukka caught it too he has just such an emaginitive grasp re the archaic & uncommon guns. Something I relate to as well .
Ide gleefully leap over a pile of Thompson Centers to get too just one batterered Mongolian Matchlock. Which observation might raise the ire of thousands of contented TC owners . But ile risk it .
Regards Rudyard
 
Joined
Mar 24, 2014
Messages
3,785
Reaction score
3,126
Location
Third Pond from the Great God Helios


Here is another example of one, minus the means for a bipod
Is that a duel i
Dear Tree Stalker .You have an admirable way with words, good on you and clearly an imagination beyond the norm .I see Pukka caught it too he has just such an emaginitive grasp re the archaic & uncommon guns. Something I relate to as well .
Ide gleefully leap over a pile of Thompson Centers to get too just one batterered Mongolian Matchlock. Which observation might raise the ire of thousands of contented TC owners . But ile risk it .
Regards Rudyard
Rudyard, your hands on experiences would fill a book, the places you've been, things you have seen and been in! We mere mortals stand in Awe of such a scouter. Thank You, Sir!
 

Rudyard

54 Cal.
Joined
Feb 28, 2019
Messages
1,571
Reaction score
1,378
Wow fan mail!. I only set off to find a better climate all the countries where sort of in the way but once I got the knack it got to be normal I ended up 'Living in a World ' & emulating the geese (Who are not as silly as they look ) swopping hemispheres for years till I married at an F & I Grand Encampment over looking Fort Ti & the Lake from Mount Defiance . Suitably attired Primitive of course . When you see some Bo hanging round a marshalling yard or on an on ramp with a card saying some far place & a tiny S V,P , That was me ,It was a service that We provided for bored travellors . If they only knew of Football or Rugby Im,e stumped but any aspect of history ,geography,. current affairs , philosophy ect we where away & I often stopped talking long after they needed to turn off they being so engrossed by the conversation . You didn''t get that on the goods trains but you got great views from a' fully air conditioned observation car ' Co Conrail, or Burlington Northern. Illinois Central, C N wasn,t picky but preffered the 'Hot shots' Refridgerated freight since they where the expresses on penalty on A to B time limits .
Regards Rudyard
 
Last edited:
Top