Scopes on a percussion....

[54ball]

Confederate snipers were sometimes equipped with English Whitworth target rifles with telescoptic sights. If I remember correctly shots were made at 1500 yards.
One of the most famous quotes concerning snipers of any era was by a Union General. He was berating his troops for taking cover. He said, " They could'nt hit an elephant at this dis"

 

[paulab]

Check out the scopes and mounts offered by Montana vintage arms. Top notch quality. I'll be using mine this weekend [on a 45-100] at 800-900-1000 yards. cheers Paul

 

[sc45-70]

The scope is a modern reproduction. It has coated lenses and is the same as looking through a modern scope of the same quality.

The field of view is smaller than most modern scopes but not so small as to make it difficult to use. It also has over 4 inches of eye relief.

SC45-70

 

[kenhulme]

Scopes, as such, are certainly "traditional" from somewhat before the Civil War. For SNIPERS, not Hunters!! However, modern large lens scopes are not traditional and should not be encouraged on any muzzleloader, IMHO.

Muzzleloaders do not have the ballistics sufficient to make clean kills much beyond 150 yards. And if you can't get close enough to use iron sights, again, IMHO, there is something wrong with your hunting ability or your eyesight. If either is the case, you don't belong in the woods where you might shoot me!

 

[CoyoteJoe]

The notion I see often repeated here is that a scope is only for long range shooting and thus it would be foolish to put a scope on short range rifle. While I don't own a scoped muzzleloader I do disagree with that notion. Scope sights improve the precision of aim and accuracy of shooting at all distances, short or long. I got my first scope, a cheap 3/4" steel tube on my Mossberg .22 as a teenager and was very impressed to find I could hit tiny objects I couldn't even see without the scope. Even though it was a hazy image and gave colors a funny tint, I could spot and head shoot squirrels lying flat among the branches that I couldn't even see without the scope. I decided then and there that a rifle without a scope is only half a rifle. I have a scope on every rifle I own, including my Daisy pellet rifle, excepting only muzzleloaders and that is only because Colorado law does not permit hunting with a scope sighted muzzleloader.

 

[nkbj]

In swapping around I had a rusty .50 TC barrel off of a Renegade obtained for the lock and stock. The barrel had been drilled and tapped for Weaver mounts.
Sent the barrel off to Bobby Hoyt for a fast twist .54 to see how accurate I can be with one of those things. It should be back home pretty soon. Want to try out various REAL's, minies, flat bases and paper patch designs to see how it goes. Would have preferred a longer barrel for the experiment but that's the barrel I had laying around.

 

[Semisane]

The notion I see often repeated here is that a scope is only for long range shooting and thus it would be foolish to put a scope on short range rifle. While I don't own a scoped muzzleloader I do disagree with that notion. Scope sights improve the precision of aim and accuracy of shooting at all distances, short or long. I got my first scope, a cheap 3/4" steel tube on my Mossberg .22 as a teenager and was very impressed to find I could hit tiny objects I couldn't even see without the scope. Even though it was a hazy image and gave colors a funny tint, I could spot and head shoot squirrels lying flat among the branches that I couldn't even see without the scope. I decided then and there that a rifle without a scope is only half a rifle. I have a scope on every rifle I own, including my Daisy pellet rifle, excepting only muzzleloaders and that is only because Colorado law does not permit hunting with a scope sighted muzzleloader.

I'm right there with you CoyoteJoe. My muzzleloaders have either scopes or peep sights. If you're offended by a modern 4X scope on a TC Renegade you wouldn't want to hunt with me. I have three of them with .45, .54, and .58 Green Mountain barrels.

Muzzleloaders do not have the ballistics sufficient to make clean kills much beyond 150 yards.

That may be true for round balls BuggyRifle. But it's certainly not true for heavy conicals. Good hunting accuracy at 300 yards with a paper patched bullet is not too difficult to achieve with enough shooting to learn the trajectory.

 

[Bon Sauvage]

I always thought that a good scope made load development a lot easier.

 

[crockett]

Zonie- that's what I always wondered about- any idea what the field of view was or the magnification? (we are talking the PC tube type scope)

 

[Jblk]

Papa is right about the mount that he is talking about.I don't remember the name of it but you can probably google it.I have one mounted on a Deer Creek fifty that I got when my eyes started failing and you cn dot an eye with it.Of course you won't be correct for the period but you also wont cripple your game and lose it.

 

Or drill and tap a good muzzleloading barrel!
Mark

 

[Zonie]

My comments made above were based on some articles I read years ago in some gun magazines possibly including "The American Rifleman" but I can't lay my hands on them right now.

A bit of digging on the net indicates the first telescopic rifle sights were invented by John Ratcliffe Chapman prior to 1844.
These scopes were manufactured by Morgan James in Utica, NY.

The Whitworth Rifle was sometimes mounted with a Davidson Telescopic sight, made in England.
Depending on the source these were either 3X or 4X and were about 14 1/2" long. They were mounted on the left side of the rifle.

Here's a link to some other interesting things about these old scopes.
http://www.berdansharpshooter.org/target_scopes.htm

 

[ebiggs1]

How about this one. Maybe not totally HC but certainly looks the part!

 

[crockett]

Thanks Zonie- I had no idea what type of mounts were used or how the scope was adjusted.

 

[ohio ramrod]

That looks very simular to Whitetail's rig. He had a lot of trouble with the scope hiting his eyebrow when fired, and getting knocked out of alighnment when the barrel was removed for cleaning.Since the tube scope is actually longer than the barrel. How does yours handle?

 

[dc7x64]

Didnt that Union General die a few minutes later after making that famous quotation?...by a Confederate sniper? Seems I read that somewhere.

 

[F.G. Ford]

THAT LOOKS GREAT!
A period scope does enhance a muzzleloader.
But not a modern short scope.
Fred
Any chance of seeing close-ups of the scope mounts???
Pleeease?

 

[F.G. Ford]

To dc7x64
I don't know if that general died, but if he didn't, I bet he had a lot more respect for those pesky southern long distance shooters.
Fred

 

[Stumpkiller]

Not quite the very last words. But he died of a gunshot wound during the battle of Spotsylvania the same day as having made the remarks:

The general said laughingly, "What! What! Men, dodging this way for single bullets! What will you do when they open fire along the whole line? I am ashamed of you. They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance.

And later repeated:

"Why, my man, I am ashamed of you, dodging that way" and repeated the remark, " They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance."

It goes down as a stupid remark in the retelling, but if you review the day he was a brave man, hiding whatever fear he knew from his troops.

(No evidence scopes were used by the Confederates in the incedent).
http://www.civilwarhome.com/sedgwickdeath.htm

 

[ebiggs1]

And Old Ford

Leatherwood 3/4in Wm. Malcolm 6x Riflescope 32" M634321 offers authentic vintage styling with modern scope making technology. The Leatherwood Wm. Malcolm 6x Telescopic Rifle Scope 32" Long M-634321 has features that the originals lacked. Leatherwood made this old design better by incorporating fully multi-coated lenses and a nitrogen-filled tube to prevent fogging. This Leatherwood Rifle-Scope can be mounted on rifles with barrels ranging from 28-34 inches. The heavy recoil base and "rabbit-eared" type mount also comes with this riflescope to keep your Wm. Malcolm Riflescope secure.

Also available is this..........

These are not cheap both nearing or exceeding $400 bucks.